All-Time Test XI for the Top 8 Nations.

[War]

NOTE: All XIs is what would be the best team for a hypotetical home test match.

AUSTRALIA:

1. Bobby Simpson
2. Matthew Hayden
3. Donald Bradman (c)
4. Ricky Ponting
5. Greg Chappell
6. Allan Border
7. Adam Gilchrist +
8. Ray Lindwall
9. Shane Warne
10. Dennis Lillee
11. Glenn McGrath



ENGLAND:

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Len Hutton (c)
3. Ted Dexter
4. Walter Hammond
5. Denis Compton
6. Ken Barrington
7. Ian Botham
8. Allan Knott +
9. Freddie Trueman
10. John Snow
11. Derek Underwood/Brian Statham


INDIA:

1. Sunil Gavaskar
2. Virender Sehwag/Vinoo Mankad
3. Rahul Dravid (c)
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Vijay Hazare
6. Vinoo Mankad/Gundappa Viswanath
7. Farook Engineer +
8. Kapil Dev
9. Zaheer Khan/Javagal Srinath
10. Erapalli Prasanna
11. Subhash Gupte


PAKISTAN:

1. Saeed Anwar
2. Hanif Mohammad
3. Javed Miandad
4. Inzamam-ul-Haq
5. Zaheer Abbas
6. Mushtaq Mohammad
7. Imran Khan (c)
8. Rashid Latif +
9. Wasim Akram
10. Abdul Qadir/Shoaib Akhtar
11. Waqar Younis


SOUTH AFRICA:

1. Graeme Smith
2. Barry Richards
3. Keepler Wessels
4. Graeme Pollock
5. Jacques Kallis
6. Clive Rice
7. Denis Lindsay +
8. Mike Procter (c)
9. Hugh Tayfield
10. Dale Steyn
11. Allan Donald


WEST INDIES:

1. Conrad Hunte
2. Gordon Greenidge
3. Viv Richards
4. George Headley
5. Brian Lara
6. Gary Sobers (c)
7. Jeff Dujon +
8. Malcolm Marshall
9. Michael Holding
10. Curtly Ambrose
11. Joel Garner


NEW ZEALAND:

1. John Wright
2. Glenn Turner
3. Bert Sutcliffe
4. Martin Crowe (c)
5. Martin Donnelly
6. Chris Cairns
7. Brendon McCullum +
8. Richard Hadlee
9. Daniel Vettori
10. Bruce Taylor
11. Shane Bond



SRI LANKA:

1. Marvan Atapattu
2. Sanath Jayasuriya
3. Roy Dias
4. Aravinda De Silva
5. Kumar Sangakkara +
6. Mahela Jayawardene
7. Arjuna Ranatunga (c)
8. Chaminda Vaas
9. Rumesh Ratnayake
10. Lasith Malinga
11. Muttiah Muralitharan

 

[Dare]

WEST INDIES:

1. Conrad Hunte
2. Gordon Greenidge
3. Viv Richards
4. George Headley
5. Brian Lara
6. Gary Sobers (c)
7. Jeff Dujon +
8. Malcolm Marshall
9. Michael Holding
10. Curtly Ambrose
11. Joel Garner

No reason to separate Greenidge and Haynes. Those 2 are one of the best opening pairs in history. If you had to take out Haynes then Fredericks should replace him.
Sadly I rarely seem to find a spot for Lara in that team and always end up going with Everton Weekes or Clyde Walcott. Viv should be the captain.

 

[War]

No reason to separate Greenidge and Haynes. Those 2 are one of the best opening pairs in history. If you had to take out Haynes then Fredericks should replace him.

Greenidge/Haynes may indeed be one the best opening pairs in history. But once can make a strong argument that Hunte was better than Haynes - thus should partner Greenidge at the top.

Dont think Fredericks was better than Hunte either. If i where to rate the 4 of them based on what i've read i go:

Greenidge >=Hunte>Haynes=Fredericks.

Sadly I rarely seem to find a spot for Lara in that team and always end up going with Everton Weekes or Clyde Walcott. Viv should be the captain.

Either Viv or Sobers can be captain. Dont think you can make a conclusive argument which of those two was a better captain.

But even so in such a hypotetical team. West Indies All-time doesn't really need a master tactical as skipper which such tremendous all-round talent.

 

[TumTum]

AUSTRALIA:

1. Bobby Simpson
2. Matthew Hayden
3. Donald Bradman (c)
4. Greg Chappell
5. Allan Border
6. Keith Miller
7. Adam Gilchrist +
8. Ray Lindwall
9. Shane Warne
10. Dennis Lillee
11. Glenn McGrath

Replace either Greg or Allan with Ricky. If Donald is captain, what's the point of having Allan in the squad?

 

[stereotype]

With Keith Miller there I would throw O'Reilly in as a second spinner maybe I guess for Lindwall. A much different style of legspinner to Warne and very aggressive. Steve Waugh is also a possibility but he and Border very similar in terms of ability so a much of a muchness. Doug Walters also a possiblity, he or Benaud as 12th man.

I know Greg Chappell should be there, his batting average at 3 against some of the best bowlers ever to have existed is a credit to the man. But I still think a proper 4 batsman is needed. Maybe Neil Harvey? I am not sure.

 

[StinkyBoHoon]

your australian openers are horrible. Ponsford, Morris and trumper are all better than flat track and simpson.

 

[stereotype]

139 FC tons is pretty good to me. The middle/lower order plus bowlers are untouchable just about when you think who misses out.

 

[Dare]

Greenidge/Haynes may indeed be one the best opening pairs in history. But once can make a strong argument that Hunte was better than Haynes - thus should partner Greenidge at the top.

Dont think Fredericks was better than Hunte either. If i where to rate the 4 of them based on what i've read i go:

Greenidge >=Hunte>Haynes=Fredericks.

The thing is there isn't a better opening pair in the Caribbean then Haynes and Greenidge. They had 148 innings together, scored 6482 runs at an average of 47 with 16 centuries and 26 half centuries.
Even if Haynes was that much worse then Hunte (which he really isn't) there would be no reason to separate the best opening par in the teams history.
Haynes played 124 more innings and averaged 3 runs less compared to Hunte.
Both were batsman of attacking nature but both changed their game to help the team.

 

[War]

Replace either Greg or Allan with Ricky. If Donald is captain, what's the point of having Allan in the squad?

I love Ponting, but Chappell is irreplacable since he pretty much without doubt the second best AUS batsman after Bradman. Chappell faced better attacks scored tougher runs in his career than Ponting. Most famously the his runs againts the apocalyptic Windies 4-prong pace-attack in WSC 1979/80.

Ponting over Border is indeed an a valid option. But IMO Border suits the role batting @#5 better than Ponting. You dont want all flair players in this hypotetical top/middle-order as would be the case in real cricket, just in case you loose 2-3 wickets early. Border is your "crisis" batsman.

Border doesn't have to be captain either.

War added 10 Minutes and 0 Seconds later...

The thing is there isn't a better opening pair in the Caribbean then Haynes and Greenidge. They had 148 innings together, scored 6482 runs at an average of 47 with 16 centuries and 26 half centuries.
Even if Haynes was that much worse then Hunte (which he really isn't) there would be no reason to separate the best opening par in the teams history.
Haynes played 124 more innings and averaged 3 runs less compared to Hunte.
Both were batsman of attacking nature but both changed their game to help the team.

Its not all about stats. For example i have my father & both grandfather who saw Hunte bat & since i was younger they have maintained that Hunte is was better than Haynes based on what they saw. So their is that, plus based on what i've read of them, i'm comfortable partnering Hunte with Greenidge.

Plus I dont believe separating Greenidge/Haynes in this hypotetical XI would affect the chemistry of that opening pair though. But it does come down to personal preference - so if you want to maintain the Greenidge/Haynes partnership its cool.

 

[Howsie]

1. John Wright
2. Glenn Turner
3. Bert Sutcliffe
4. Martin Crowe (c)
5. Martin Donnelly
6. John Reid
7. Chris Cairns
8. Brendon McCullum +
9. Richard Hadlee
10. Bruce Taylor
11. Shane Bond

Personally, I'd go Vettori over John Reid. An attack with Hadlee, Bond, Taylor and Cairns really doesn't need another seamer to help back them up. John Reid was a better batsmen then Daniel Vettori, but he wasn't much better (then the Vettori of now).

 

[War]

your australian openers are horrible. Ponsford, Morris and trumper are all better than flat track and simpson.

First terming Matt Hayden as "flat track" is one of the misinformed notions in world cricket today. What would be correct to say for a large chunk of Hayden career was a FTB (Mumbai 2001 - Cairns 2004). Then after he WAS technically exposed in Ashes 2005, he corrected his flaws as a FTB with his:

- Oval 05 hundred (which saved his career)

- Super test 05 hundred

- Hundreds vs SA 05/06 in some very bowler friendly conditions with Ntini & Nel in peak career form

- Hundreds vs Hoggard/Flintoff @ MCG 2006 (one the ONLY- serious bowler-fiendly condition AUS batsmen encountered during the 06/07 Ashes)

- Hundreds vs IND 07/08. Especially the MCG test hundred when Zaheer Khan was getting the ball to swing everywhere.

With these innings Hayden corrected his flaws of the past. So is way off the mark to still call him as flat track bully (FTB). That shows a lack of understanding of how Hayden's test career evolved.



Secondly i think you serious underate how good Simpson was as a opener. He averaged 55 as an opener scoring quality runs againts the likes Hall/Griffith, Trueman/Statham, Pollock etc...all very good bowlers. This is very convincing case of why he should open in the AUS ATXI.


Bill Ponsford is defiantely a flat-track bully, farrrrr more than Hayden ever was. Ponsford played in an era where quality pace attacks where basically non-existant & the pitches where probably flatter in his time, compared to Hayden in 2000s era. The only time Ponsford ever faced real pace in Boydline 32/33, he was owned by Larwood & company. No way he should open for the Australian All-time XI. The likes of Bill Lawry, Taylor, Langer, Slater have better cases than him.

Arthur Morris indeed as fair case to open in AUS ATXI over one of Hayden or Simpson. Alot of the people who saw him bat rate him highly. But he scored alot of runs againts poor attacks in his career. IIRC only one of Morris's hundreds was againts a quality attack - which was Brisbane 1954/55. So for me personally he has always been 3rd choice to Simpson/Hayden.


Trumper was clearly better than his 39 averages suggest & i respect him as indeed one of games greats. But i always have a problem rating early generation players like him. He never faced real pace in his career. So i worry in hypotetical all-time XI matchups to bowlers like Marshall, Donald, Hadlee, Imran, Trueman he would struggle. So i'm reluctant to start in the best AUS ATXI.

War added 6 Minutes and 3 Seconds later...

Personally, I'd go Vettori over John Reid. An attack with Hadlee, Bond, Taylor and Cairns really doesn't need another seamer to help back them up. John Reid was a better batsmen then Daniel Vettori, but he wasn't much better (then the Vettori of now).

The reason i picked Reid over Vettori, was because i was picking the best teams for a hypotetical "home" test. New Zealand conditions traditionally help seamers, so its basically utilising home advantage to maximize their chances of winning.

Byt yes for a hypotetical overseas test. I would drop Reid & pick Vettori.

 

[stereotype]

Hayden did have technical flaws in his game but I think in all cases he overcame them, the biggest one was his play off his pads he countered that by taking guard down the pitch even to express bowlers like Bond.

And plus this is for home tests and again Hayden has 21 test centuries from 56 matches on home soil so pretty good numbers, I just think Australian pitches are suited to high class leg spin bowling and haven't we had some of them. Bill O'Reilly just ahead of Clarrie Grimmett along with Miller, McGrath, Warne and Lillee to me would be ideal. I would love to fit Doug Walters in somewhere. Maybe instead of one of the batsmen.

 

[sifter132]

your australian openers are horrible. Ponsford, Morris and trumper are all better than flat track and simpson.

Agree with you War, flat track is not fair on Hayden. One other way to prove it is by averages in their 2nd innings of a Test when conditions are tougher.
FACTS right here:
Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com
Hayden averages over 50 in their 2nd innings, as do Kallis and Gambhir

But look at guys like Lara averaging 38 in their 2nd dig, Sachin at 42, and all the way down the bottom Sehwag averaging 31 - he's the flat track bully. Steve Waugh doesn't look so crash hot in that list either, for a renowned fighter he only seemed to do well in the 1st innings.

 

[stereotype]

Tough to have a good average at 5 in your second dig, not a lot of chances for a big score.

The rest I agree with. What it shows is that a good average for a 2nd innings is probably early 40s.

 

[ballers101]

PAKISTAN:

1. Saeed Anwar
2. Hanif Mohammad
3. Javed Miandad
4. Inzamam-ul-Haq
5. Mushtaq Mohammad
6. Asif Iqbal
7. Imran Khan (c)
8. Rashid Latif +
9. Wasim Akram
10. Abdul Qadir/Iqbal Qasim
11. Waqar Younis

Best team for a Home test match.....I would have to disagree not a huge change but a definite change in the lineup. The first 4 is good but I would definitely put Mohammed Yousuf in for Asif Iqbal, I think Yousuf is easily better than Iqbal and Mushtaq and with Pakistan's strong bowling attack you wouldn't really need another all arounder. So I would put Yousuf at 5 and put Mushtaq at 6. Really however, you are on spot with basically the whole entire lineup for a test match in my eyes.



BTW, How in the world is Ricky Ponting not in the Australia XI. He should have a reserved spot I don't understand how he is not on the side makes no sense.