End of WI Cricket?

It'd be bloody tragic if this were the case.

The BCCI already has a reputation as a bully as it is and to go at a cricket country who is struggling to buy bread at the moment would reenforce that.

I just hope sanity eventually proveils.
 
It'd be bloody tragic if this were the case.

The BCCI already has a reputation as a bully as it is and to go at a cricket country who is struggling to buy bread at the moment would reenforce that.

I just hope sanity eventually proveils.

So you think BCCI should take no action, against WI, and its fine to just abandon a tour midway whenever the players want?

Just picture if a New Zealand summer of cricket was wasted like this. BCCI can recover from this, but do you think NZ Cricket could take a hit of $65 mil, like the BCCI has for the tour being abandoned.

BCCI has to take action, and I don't think they are acting like bullys here. There was genuine damage done to them, and they have a right to get compensated like any other board.
 
Hmmm just think if they were stripped of their test status, could potentially open the door for Ireland.
 
Hmmm just think if they were stripped of their test status, could potentially open the door for Ireland.

Well I am sure Ireland fans will disagree, but do we really need more test nations? Just look at B'desh, and how far they still languish. SL got their first test in 1982 and 14 years later they were winning the WC. B'desh, just where are they. Some may even argue they have actually gone backwards.

Its good to have Zimbabwe sort of come back into the cricketing fold, after years in the wilderness, but they have a long way to go still.

I doubt WI will lose their test status over this, but their competitiveness could suffer to the point of them being reduced to B'desh status. WICB have messed it up so much that I read somewhere playing Minor League Baseball in Dominica pays more than playing for the WI national side. How can WI remain competitive after this. So we could have another very weak test side very soon. I don't think adding more sides to the list is the solution.

Just look at Kenya, it was odd they didn't get their test status around 2003, they were always in the WCs, and even got to the 2003 SF. It was odd when ICC still didn't grant them test status. They are nowhere on the scene today. So in hindsight it was a wise move. Alternatively it could be argued that its because they didn't get test status, that Kenya cricket stagnated. I suspect its more the former than the latter. Giving them test status would have been a mistake, as they clearly didn't have the infrastructure or talent to back it up for the next generation.

Ireland are no doubt by some distance the best of the associate nations, but perhaps caution would better than rushing to grant them test status right now.
 
The BCCI already has a reputation as a bully as it is and to go at a cricket country who is struggling to buy bread at the moment would reenforce that.

while personally i wouldnt want bcci to take action[they probably wont too) cause of the pitiful condition WICB are in and would be a shame to see WI dwindle further.

If bcci were to take action its not bullying in any sense, WICB has bought this on themselves, this the most immature any organisation and its players can act, they have acted out of ego and selfishness without even giving a damn about other parties involved, no way can that be encouraged.
 
So you think BCCI should take no action, against WI, and its fine to just abandon a tour midway whenever the players want?

Just picture if a New Zealand summer of cricket was wasted like this. BCCI can recover from this, but do you think NZ Cricket could take a hit of $65 mil, like the BCCI has for the tour being abandoned.

BCCI has to take action, and I don't think they are acting like bullys here. There was genuine damage done to them, and they have a right to get compensated like any other board.

You mean like BCCI sabotaged the South African summer and our Newlands test last year. I see this as karma paying them back
 
ya right we landed in SA and then pulled out is that the story, i dont see how you can even compare these 2. SA were given notice much prior to the tour that all is not well between the both boards, and its was pathetic they went out and announced the tour without even mutual consent.

There is quite a difference between revenue loss and actual loss.
 
You mean like BCCI sabotaged the South African summer and our Newlands test last year. I see this as karma paying them back

BCCI Sabotaged your test? You mean they agree to play 2 tests instead of 3? So agreeing to play 2 tests instead of 3 is the same thing as bailing midway.

BCCI were honest, said they can only play 2 test matches and they played two honored the deal. Just picture if having agreed to play 3 they had gone home after 2. Would say thats the same thing.

Its one thing to agree to a shorter tour, another thing entirely to bail midway.

If SA wanted to have a three test series they should told BCCI sry 2 tests won't do, you either play 3 or we get someone else. Having not done that and agreed to play 2 tests, BCCI kept their word.

Even if you are referring to something else entirely, its one thing to not reach an agreement and another thing to reach an agreement and then not fulfill it.

WI didn't keep their word. Your two examples are not even remotely close to being the same thing.

Also BCCI will play SL and they will make more than their 65$ mil that they lost, so overall in the Int'l window BCCI still come through ahead. However that BCCI showed resolve to arrange an alternate series, doesn't excuse the WI for what they did.
 
This Michael Holding article probably sums up the problems best - WICB have hung the players out to dry | Articles | Cricket Blogs, Opinions & Analysis | Wisden India

WICB have hung the players out to dry
Michael Holding
|
19 October 2014



MoU being signed in September. They did not know what was being signed.

The players arrived in India without contracts, and did not have a clue as to what they were getting. People could say it is their fault, because you should not be going to a job without knowing what you would be paid. But it is a regular feature of West Indies cricket. When I was playing, and perhaps even before my playing days, people went on tours not knowing what their salaries were. You had a fair idea based on what you got the last time, and possibly there would be a small increase, but you wouldn’t expect it to go down.

When the players arrived in India and saw the contract, they called Wavell Hinds, the WIPA representative who signed the MoU, and told him that they weren’t happy with the terms. The reduction was just too much, bordering on a loss of between 60 and 70%, depending on who you were. Hinds told them not to sign the contracts and that he would renegotiate a few things the players weren’t happy with. The WIPA representative communicated the players’ unhappiness to the West Indies Cricket Board/Dave Cameron, the WICB President, but Cameron/WICB refused to budge, saying that the contract was already signed and there would be nothing further to discuss.

In the years gone by, that $US 35,000 per match-day came about because a former representative of WIPA conned a former Chief Executive Officer of the WICB and got an e-mail confirming that the players were getting that payment, which obviously the WICB didn’t want. Somehow, the CEO misunderstood what was being asked for and agreed to it. When the final negotiations took place, the former WIPA rep turned up with the e-mail from the CEO confirming the payment, and refused to budge. He demanded that the WICB honour the word of their CEO, which they naturally had to. It would seem that the tables are now being turned. The WICB are now saying, ‘Your representative signed the MoU, nothing will change’. In my opinion, that is behaving like a schoolboy. Plain tit for tat. You conned me once and played hard ball, now it’s my time.

first press release put out by the BCCI, though. That was the press release stating that the WICB had cancelled the rest of the tour after the fourth ODI. The WICB then put out a press release stating in effect, contrary to media reports being circulated, that they had not cancelled the rest of the tour and would make a statement at the end of the fourth ODI. That probably riled the BCCI, as that directly contradicted their press release, and I suppose that’s why they released the second press release with the timeline showing exactly what had occurred between October 7 and October 17, when the tour was cancelled.

Throughout the confrontation, the attitude was ‘Play or the tour is off, no compromise’. With that now in the public domain, the WICB/Cameron then had to backtrack and admit that they did cancel the rest of the tour. Folks, all these press releases are available on various readily accessible websites. It sounds like a fairytale but it can be verified. The WICB/Cameron went beyond unreliability this time, that was being dishonest.

The problem with West Indies is that the WICB always pushes things to the brink and waits till the last moment. That’s why so many tours begin with players having not yet signed tour contracts. This MoU was signed in September. Why didn’t the players know exactly what was in the MoU until they got to India at the end of the month? Why weren’t all the players e-mailed the MoU? I’m sure the WIPA and the WICB have e-mails and contacts of all the players. But no. They wait until they get to India, and then try to manipulate the players. They had all the leadup time before the first ODI to try and iron something out but no, no compromise. From the very first instance the prospect of the players striking came up, on October 7 as the BCCI release says, the WICB/Cameron were willing to cancel the tour immediately. The WICB have not denied it. As a matter of fact, the WICB have not even mentioned the BCCI press release. All they’ve done is put out another press release to divert attention from the BCCI release and of course trying their very best to blame the players. Again, dishonest.

What is so ironic is that about five or six of the current players were in the team that represented West Indies when the regulars went on strike a few years ago. They were happy to get selected for West Indies when the players went on strike last time, but now that they have seen how the WICB treats their players, they are happy to join the strike. It includes Darren Sammy, the then captain. How ironic is that? It just shows that the WICB have learnt nothing.

Hinds-405x270.jpg

Having known Wavell Hinds for so long, I am at a loss to understand how he did what he did, and I know most of the players are as well. © Getty Images

What shocks me most about this particular case is the fact that Hinds signed that MoU. If Hinds was playing today, he would be the most upset man in the team. I sat down with Hinds for around three hours once during his playing days in Guyana, when they were about to strike on an England tour, to convince him not to strike. Hinds has been on that side of the fence, and it is again ironic to see him being the person involved in signing the MoU. He must also have realised that the guys wouldn’t be happy with the terms. Ok, I have heard that with Hinds taking over the reins, things are now less confrontational and I’m happy to hear that but still, the players need to know what they’re signing up for before the deal is done. Having known Wavell Hinds for so long, I am at a loss to understand how he did what he did, and I know most of the players are, as well.

I know the above still will not appease some of us in the Caribbean as I know many are displeased with the remuneration of the players anyway. I have heard the shouts around the Caribbean claiming that the players don’t deserve the salaries they are getting because of the poor results on the field. Again, I have joined in sometimes, I am not afraid to admit that. But again, I repeat, they finally agreed there was an imbalance that needed to be addressed but the process obviously was faulty.

A lot of West Indies’ failures in recent years is due to the administration. If you’re not happy with the people you are working for, you are not going to perform the way you possibly could. There is no way you can put out the same level of effort and commitment. Times have changed from when I played. We had no idea who our board members were and we would just concentrate on cricket, but it is now a business. You know who the board members are, what they do and the rubbish that sometimes goes on. That will infiltrate the players’ minds. People may say ‘they shouldn’t worry about that, their job is to play cricket’, but it isn’t as simple as that.

Just one last thing. Whether you agree with anything that has been written above or not, whether you think the players or the board or WIPA are at fault, whether you believe the fight should have been between the players and their union WIPL, and not the WICB, does anyone believe that the action taken by the organisation entrusted with the safekeeping and development of West Indies cricket, WICB/Cameron, was the best option going forward for the welfare of West Indies and world cricket?

I have no idea where this is going to leave West Indies cricket, because it all depends on the BCCI. I don’t know, and I don’t want to speculate. But if I’m a parent of a kid who wants to play cricket, I would encourage him in every way but only to play recreationally. I would tell him to not even think about playing for West Indies until the way the board administrates the game changes. If he wanted to play sport professionally, I would tell him to try another sport.

I am sorry, I know I said previously ‘Just one last thing’, but it has just come to my attention that the WICB/Cameron have sent a document to the players trying to get them to sign saying that they were the ones who went on strike and caused the cancellation of the tour. Needless to say, no one has signed. Again, the WICB/Cameron are trying to paint the picture that the tour was cancelled because of the players’ actions. Folks, the players threatened strike action from the very first ODI and again before the third, but played all three games in ‘good faith’, hoping for a resolution. Because they again threatened strike action doesn’t mean they intended to carry it through on this occasion. The WICB cancelled the tour as the BCCI press release stated.

*By the way, the players on tour in India had still not received a copy of the signed MoU although they had asked for one since their arrival.

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Michael Holding played 60 Tests for West Indies between 1975 and 1987, and was part of the team that won the World Cup in 1979. He was an integral part of a team that lost just one series in nearly two decades, and is now a popular TV commentator
 
It's pretty amazing that another board could manage to outdo the ECB for sheer, unprofessional shittiness but the WICB have absolutely nailed it. The ECB just drove one player out. The WICB have driven out the whole team.
 
For all the flaws in WICB, who seem to treat players very poorly, these lines by Samuels hold true as well

All I am saying is that we are already there in India. Right. Finish the tour. This has nothing to do with India. This is our problem. So finish the tour and then go back to the Caribbean and sort out the problem.

It is hard for anyone to justify the pullout especially when the issue doesn't involve the host nation at all.
 
LOL .. just read that within the next 4 days, Pollard, Bravo, Russell, Gayle, Sammy will be in SAF playing in their domestic T20 cup (Ram Slam)

But there is no certainity that they will play in the WIndies tour of SAF that follows this
 
When the players arrived in India and saw the contract, they called Wavell Hinds, the WIPA representative who signed the MoU, and told him that they weren’t happy with the terms. The reduction was just too much, bordering on a loss of between 60 and 70%, depending on who you were. Hinds told them not to sign the contracts and that he would renegotiate a few things the players weren’t happy with.

If this is true, then Hinds is definitely the one to blame. How can he agree to a 70% cut in wages and not even bother to tell the players. Its one thing to not inform players when there is no increase in wages, but to not even tell the players (who he is representing btw), that you are going to have 70% lesser payment, is ludicrous.

Before committing to anything he should have called up the players and let them know, that the pay is being cut by 70%. To not discuss it with anyone and sign the deal anyway, smells fishy to say the least.
 

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