Worlds best spinners .

[Owzat]

THis is totally Warne vs Murali isn't it ?

Bound to be that myopic, especially given most people old enough to have seen the older generations live would think the internet is witchcraft!

I don't have the stats to hand, but I've broken down both Warne and Murali's stats in various countries and against various oppositions, and take away the spin advantages that Murali held and there's little between them.

The advantages include playing home games in Sri Lanka which I believe accounts for comfortably over half his wickets (?) He also picked up something like 100 wickets apiece against the zimmers and bangles while the aussies avoid playing them altogether.

I think both had equally poor records against or in India. I'll have a quick squiz

Murali vs ZIM/BAN : 176 wkts (out of 800) @ 15.10, vs rest : 624 wkts @ 24.88

An increase of over 2 runs per wicket on his normal average despite taking so many against the rest.

in Sri Lanka

Murali : 493 wkts @ 19.57
Warne : 48 wkts @ 20.46

Neither took more than 50 wickets in India and at a cost of over 43. Against the best side around in their home country (oz) Murali was ineffective and I vaguely recall some suggest scared of playing (12 wkts @ 75.42) Interesting that against the best sides/players of spin Murali took his wickets at over 30, and at 25 against Pakistan. Warne only really struggled against India, and for some reason West Indies

 

[spooony]

Bound to be that myopic, especially given most people old enough to have seen the older generations live would think the internet is witchcraft!

I don't have the stats to hand, but I've broken down both Warne and Murali's stats in various countries and against various oppositions, and take away the spin advantages that Murali held and there's little between them.

The advantages include playing home games in Sri Lanka which I believe accounts for comfortably over half his wickets (?) He also picked up something like 100 wickets apiece against the zimmers and bangles while the aussies avoid playing them altogether.

I think both had equally poor records against or in India. I'll have a quick squiz

Murali vs ZIM/BAN : 176 wkts (out of 800) @ 15.10, vs rest : 624 wkts @ 24.88

An increase of over 2 runs per wicket on his normal average despite taking so many against the rest.

in Sri Lanka

Murali : 493 wkts @ 19.57
Warne : 48 wkts @ 20.46

Neither took more than 50 wickets in India and at a cost of over 43. Against the best side around in their home country (oz) Murali was ineffective and I vaguely recall some suggest scared of playing (12 wkts @ 75.42) Interesting that against the best sides/players of spin Murali took his wickets at over 30, and at 25 against Pakistan. Warne only really struggled against India, and for some reason West Indies

There is no way a person can prove who was better by the way of stats. Conditions, circumstances, period played, form at different times, opposition faced and many more others are hidden by stats. The only guy who can tell us who was better is Brain Lara.

Lets ask this. Who is better Lara or Tendulkar. You do not have to answer that but you can imagine what personal wars that would start as I believe any person saying the one was better than the other got to be insane or extremely bias. Watch the best 5 knocks of either batsman and you will be as confused as a chameleon on a smarty box is who is better as both are poetry in motion in a different style. Yet the stats tell us a different story without taking hundreds of circumstantial evidence into consideration.

Like Murali and the trauma he went through in Oz and the controversy. That is hidden by the stats. So only one left to tell us who is better is Lara

 

[sifter132]

^Tend to agree. You can argue stats on both sides for both of those battles you've highlighted (warne vs Murali, lara vs tendulkar). Even the great players have flaws in their records eg. Warne in India, Murali in Australia. So there is no 'right' answer. But asking Brian Lara won't help - he is just ONE opinion. Many other batsmen have faced the pair.

 

[spooony]

^Tend to agree. You can argue stats on both sides for both of those battles you've highlighted (warne vs Murali, lara vs tendulkar). Even the great players have flaws in their records eg. Warne in India, Murali in Australia. So there is no 'right' answer. But asking Brian Lara won't help - he is just ONE opinion. Many other batsmen have faced the pair.

I agree many batsmen have faced them and have fallen to them but Brain Lara was thee best player of spin bowling in the modern era.
Brian Lara on Shane Warne & Muttiah 'Murali' Muralitharan spin bowling - YouTube

 

[StinkyBoHoon]

if you were to ask warne and murali who they thought was the best player of spin murali would say lara and warne would say tendulkar.

it's pretty easy to dig up the quotes supporting this so one guys opinion isn't that conclusive.

I've said what does it for me before, the 5-fers murali has.

there's been 2053* test matches ever. 1627 where at least one batsman has scored a 100. that has won the match for their team in 942 matches, drawn in 606 and lost 432 times.

there have been 1551 times someone has taken a 5-fer for their team. that's resulted in 969 wins, 447 draws and 559 losses.

so guys that take 5-fers are marginally more decisive than guys that score 100s. (though feel free to dispute if you think this arguement has a big hole in it)

bowlers take wickets in test cricket, they don't primarily look to restrict runs, thus average is an over-stated figure when statistically evaluating them. murali has taken 67 5-fers. statistically, this pisses on even tendulkars 51 tons.

*I just realised when I did these I took out the tied tests.

 

[War]

Have argued the Warne vs Murali thing for years and i've always said Murali was better by a whisker. I certainly think batsmen at their respective peaks found Murali ever so slightly difficult to handle than Hollywood.

Two instances turned my opinion towards Murali for me:



Firstly it was the 2005 ashes and sri lanka's tour to england in 2006.

While in the Ashes Warne bowled legendary and carried AUS attack on his own causing the English batsmen the world of havoc with some magic deliveries. In the 2006 series when Murali visited, i'd say without doubt England were more bamboozled by Murali in that series.

Secondly with regards to their records in India.

While both of them at their peaks were well handled by India's best generation of batsmen who could play spin in their sleep, averaging 40+ each.

Murali was still able even though it was only on one occasion to actually to run through India's batting on home soil, with his spell in the 2005 Chennai test.

That is something Warne never did. Warne's best in India was also @ Chennai 2004. But he toiled manfully for that haul though to be frank.

Although I would say if Warne wasn't unluckily injured for the 2004 Mumbai test on that spinners paradise, he probably would have spun through India on a wicket, in which Clarke's part-time tweakers took 6 wickets.

 

[spooony]

if you were to ask warne and murali who they thought was the best player of spin murali would say lara and warne would say tendulkar.

it's pretty easy to dig up the quotes supporting this so one guys opinion isn't that conclusive.

I've said what does it for me before, the 5-fers murali has.

there's been 2053* test matches ever. 1627 where at least one batsman has scored a 100. that has won the match for their team in 942 matches, drawn in 606 and lost 432 times.

there have been 1551 times someone has taken a 5-fer for their team. that's resulted in 969 wins, 447 draws and 559 losses.

so guys that take 5-fers are marginally more decisive than guys that score 100s. (though feel free to dispute if you think this arguement has a big hole in it)

bowlers take wickets in test cricket, they don't primarily look to restrict runs, thus average is an over-stated figure when statistically evaluating them. murali has taken 67 5-fers. statistically, this pisses on even tendulkars 51 tons.

*I just realised when I did these I took out the tied tests.

67 5-fers - Who where the batsman and against which country?

51 Tons. How many of them counted as the reason his team won? How many he of them to save a match? What circumstances where they scored. What period against who on what pitch? What was the pitch condition? How was the support around him and the teams morale strength etc etc and hundreds more. Stats do not show that

 

[Ahmad94]

Anyone else think Raza Hasan is looking a future prospect for Pakistan

 

[Sulaiman7]

Raza Hasan is a good talented young bowler .

 

[Epic]

Anyone else think Raza Hasan is looking a future prospect for Pakistan

Won't rate him till I see him in the whites, but yes, looks a good prospect.

 

[Rehan_24]

No doubt for me that Shane Warne is the best spinner Cricket history has ever seen, I still miss him in cricket. He left test cricket at his peak, He still had 2 to 3 years. Indeed spinner of the century. Brian Lara stated a wonderful difference between Murli and Warne. He said in an Interview that Murli was a better Spinner than Warne but there was a difference between the two that When you start hitting boundaries to Murli, His Morale used to go down and he becomes an average Spinner, However With Warne, When you hit him one or two boundary, He used to start getting lethal ball by ball.

Personally, I feel that Murli had never any comparison with Warne as Warne was by and large far ahead than Murli. Many a times, Aggressive batsmen made Murli looked so ordinary, While Shane was always special against each and every batsman. And except Sachin Tendulkar, I did not see a single Batsman who was comfortable against Shane Warne virtually. Brain Lara has had some good games against him but mostly Lara became his prey

 

[ChristopherHG]

Shane Warne is the best spinner indeed but guys like Anil Kumble were like Warnee or the Legends of spin as if it differs but Warnee was always a hostile cricketer WTD.

 

[spooony]

No doubt for me that Shane Warne is the best spinner Cricket history has ever seen, I still miss him in cricket. He left test cricket at his peak, He still had 2 to 3 years. Indeed spinner of the century. Brian Lara stated a wonderful difference between Murli and Warne. He said in an Interview that Murli was a better Spinner than Warne but there was a difference between the two that When you start hitting boundaries to Murli, His Morale used to go down and he becomes an average Spinner, However With Warne, When you hit him one or two boundary, He used to start getting lethal ball by ball.

Personally, I feel that Murli had never any comparison with Warne as Warne was by and large far ahead than Murli. Many a times, Aggressive batsmen made Murli looked so ordinary, While Shane was always special against each and every batsman. And except Sachin Tendulkar, I did not see a single Batsman who was comfortable against Shane Warne virtually. Brain Lara has had some good games against him but mostly Lara became his prey

Murali struggled against left handers. Also remember Murali at times had to take 7 wickets or remove the top order himself where Warne had help from McGrath dislodging the top order




Imran Tahir is the best IMO

 

[Sulaiman7]

No one voted for Jim Laker .

 

[Akul]

Shane Warne. Enough said.