Australian fans: Discussing the State of Australia's ODI/T20 team's

[War]

Agree, Bailey should be a fringe ODI player at this stage and no more.

I think Mitch Marsh is our long term successor to Shane Watson. I would certainly have him over Dan Christian at this point.

Well going forward, i think both M Marsh and Christian could play in the same ODI/T20 team you know.

----------

T20 wise Marsh has played his best at opener and Warner is a given as opener. Finch has shown he can play in the middle order and Wade is in the same boat. Hughes is the tricky one, he too looks best at opener.

If you are looking at ODIs you would have the same as above but less issues with whether it is Marsh or Hughes at 3.

It may come down to letting Hughes or Marsh batting opening with Warner and Watson batting @ # 3 in the long term, given the issues Watto highlighted in this link i posted earlier in the thread:

England v Australia, 2nd ODI, The Oval: Balancing act far from elementary for Shane Watson | Cricket Features | England v Australia | ESPN Cricinfo

 

[Aislabie]

Everyone is criticising George Bailey's presence in the team, but I think the real problem is Peter Forrest. Forrest made a good start to his career but was found out against quality bowling, but Bailey just became more and more of a clutch player in the England series.

 

[War]

Everyone is criticising George Bailey's presence in the team, but I think the real problem is Peter Forrest. Forrest made a good start to his career but was found out against quality bowling, but Bailey just became more and more of a clutch player in the England series.

Bailey ODI batting isn't really been criticized. He has been solid so far in that.

The issue is him in the T20 team, that is dead wrong since he is not one of best T20 batsmen in Australia.

As the case was when Clarke was T20 captain a couple years back, it threatens to mess up the team balance for the upcoming world cup.

 

[sifter132]

Bailey may end up doing well in T20 - he's probably better equipped than Clarke. But I think most of the uproar about Bailey is that his selection went against the Aussie principle ie. They've promoted Bailey because he's a captain, not because he earned his spot in the XI. If Cameron White had been in form, then I doubt Bailey wouldn't have gotten even a sniff of the team, because White would have remained T20 captain.

Agree about Forrest though, he's got a nice batting style, but he's the kind of player who gets bogged far too easily to play short form cricket.

 

[War]

Bailey may end up doing well in T20 - he's probably better equipped than Clarke. But I think most of the uproar about Bailey is that his selection went against the Aussie principle ie. They've promoted Bailey because he's a captain, not because he earned his spot in the XI. If Cameron White had been in form, then I doubt Bailey wouldn't have gotten even a sniff of the team, because White would have remained T20 captain.

Agree about Forrest though, he's got a nice batting style, but he's the kind of player who gets bogged far too easily to play short form cricket.

Honestly don't see him doing well at all. His captaincy is no different to Clarke and his batting is just as unsuited to the format.

Another reason why i think Bailey got the captaincy while White was out of form, was because Watson was injured at the time.

Watson captained effectively in the Caribbean when he came back and with other obviously better T20 batsmen around, making Bailey captain continuously is looking like Inverarity's worst selection blunder of his tenure so far.

 

[War]

Australia Twenty20 Squad | Pakistan v Australia T20I Series, 2012 | Cricket Squads | ESPN Cricinfo

. This is just crazy. If no changes are made for this squad ahead of the T20 world-cup, that will utter madness and a great shame.

 

[angryangy]

At least half the team is safe picks. I wouldn't say it's crazy to not pick someone like Travis Birt.

 

[War]

At least half the team is safe picks. I wouldn't say it's crazy to not pick someone like Travis Birt.

Well Birt hasn't gotten much of chance this year after his excellent BBL performances. So we don't know if he could be the real deal in T20 internationals.

Blokes like Finch, M Marsh really should be in this squad.

While without Lee now, the T20 need a proper spearhead which certainly is not Hilfy or Starc. Harris and Nannes would clearly be better.

No way should Doherty's place be safe, based on how poor he looked in England. The UAE series should be a last chance for him.

All of those issues don't even consider how messed up things can get if Bailey doesn't step up as a batsmen

 

[sifter132]

Well Birt hasn't gotten much of chance this year after his excellent BBL performances. So we don't know if he could be the real deal in T20 internationals.

Blokes like Finch, M Marsh really should be in this squad.

While without Lee now, the T20 need a proper spearhead which certainly is not Hilfy or Starc. Harris and Nannes would clearly be better.

No way should Doherty's place be safe, based on how poor he looked in England. The UAE series should be a last chance for him.

All of those issues don't even consider how messed up things can get if Bailey doesn't step up as a batsmen

Starting to see it your way mate I've got questions over roughly half the squad! Bailey, Christian, Maxwell, Doherty, McKay, Starc and Cummins are question marks for me. First 5 just based on quality ie. are those names really scaring any of the other teams?? Nope. Last 2 based on experience in T20 cricket - as you say Harris, Nannes, even Mitch Johnson are more worthy in my eyes. I don't mind Hilfenhaus, he's done pretty well in T20 stuff.

It's going to be very interesting what XI they trot out with. They've picked Christian and Maxwell perhaps with the idea of playing 1 or both at #7/#8, but I would probably ignore both: play Wade at #7 and use Watson as your 5th bowler, Dave Hussey as your 6th.

 

[angryangy]

Nannes might have a scary name but he hasn't done much in a long time, while Starc has. I'd sooner pick someone who is playing well and if the opposition are so full of hubris that they don't plan for it, then all the better.

 

[War]

Nannes might have a scary name but he hasn't done much in a long time, while Starc has. I'd sooner pick someone who is playing well and if the opposition are so full of hubris that they don't plan for it, then all the better.

It depends what you mean by he hasn't done anything in a while. Cause i saw him bowling here in England in Friends T20 competition in July and he looked quite normal pace wise.

Fact is the T20 attack now that Lee is retired needs a experienced spearhead in this format and Nannes along with Harris the best we have. Starc is youngster who skills as a T20 bowler is still questionable.

It's illogical to think both nor even one of them will not be in the world cup squad.

 

[War]

Starting to see it your way mate I've got questions over roughly half the squad! Bailey, Christian, Maxwell, Doherty, McKay, Starc and Cummins are question marks for me. First 5 just based on quality ie. are those names really scaring any of the other teams?? Nope. Last 2 based on experience in T20 cricket - as you say Harris, Nannes, even Mitch Johnson are more worthy in my eyes. I don't mind Hilfenhaus, he's done pretty well in T20 stuff.

It's going to be very interesting what XI they trot out with. They've picked Christian and Maxwell perhaps with the idea of playing 1 or both at #7/#8, but I would probably ignore both: play Wade at #7 and use Watson as your 5th bowler, Dave Hussey as your 6th.

Hilfy bowled well in the IPL yea surprisingly, but in the ODIs in the Windies and England he didn't look threatening at all. So that doesn't give me confidence at about what he can do in a T20 format and its highly perplexing what the selectors thought process behind picking him is.

I'm on with Christian, solid enough all-rounder with this format. If we had M Marsh, the two of them down the order would be real lethal.

Johnson nah, he is a mess at the moment can't be near to AUS teams in any format unless he shows tremendous improvement.

McKay's variation's as a bowler in ODIs gives me some closure that he could replicate that accuracy in T20s, while Cummins of all the young bowlers (Starc, Pattinson) i'm fine with him being in the squad.

Its crazy to think since the first 2007 T20 W-Cup, the squads AUS has picked for these tournament have been really poor. 2009 was a disaster and 2010 we got away withe Clarke blunder and got to the final because the other 10 players were brilliant.

I really fear this year will be a repeat of 2009.

 

[angryangy]

but in the ODIs in the Windies

Oh come on! How is that comparison more logical than picking players getting runs and wickets in English T20s

 

[War]

Oh come on! How is that comparison more logical than picking players getting runs and wickets in English T20s

Ahh not entirely sure what you are getting at here, Sir Angy..

 

[sifter132]

ICC World T20 2012 : ICC World T20 2012: Older, wiser Cameron White preferred to Steve Smith | Cricket News | ICC World Twenty20 2012 | ESPN Cricinfo

The quote I read with interest was this one from Inverarity:

"It's up to George Bailey, the captain, to work out the batting order but I think it's likely to be Matthew Wade probably at six, could well be Cameron White at seven and then either Glenn Maxwell or Dan Christian at eight," Inverarity said. "So there's a lot of depth and there's three left-handers in the top seven so the left-right combination which makes it more difficult for the opposing bowlers.

So basically they'll be playing 8 batsmen (or guys more known for their batting than bowling) and hoping like hell that Watson, Dave Hussey and Christian/Maxwell will bowl 8 reasonable overs, and hoping at the same time their other 3 specialist bowlers will do the heavy lifting. It would be a massive understatement to say that I'm worried about that attack... Especially when considering that our 3 specialist bowlers have NO stars - Hogg might be the best of the lot and he's only just returned to the game

I just think that's awful balance. To fix it you either drop White and play both Christian/Maxwell, or piss off both Christian and Maxwell so an actual bowler can play ie. as your 7 & 8 choose Christian + Maxwell or White + 4th bowler eg. Starc. Since I think Christian and Maxwell are both hackers, well its pretty obvious which way they should be going, White/Wade at #7 and play Starc, Hogg, McKay and Hilfy as your 4 bowlers. Doherty for McKay if it's a turner.

Then with the bat, they'll probably tell Warner and Watson to stick around and try and make 100s while they have 6 batsmen in the shed behind them...so if I see Australia 0/15-20 after 4 overs with 8 batsmen in the team, I'll scream If you're going to play 8 batters, I think you need to send some up to pinch-hit and make sure you are squeezing the most value possible out of a long lineup ie. attack the WHOLE time, zero consolidation. eg. open with Wade and tell him to go hard, send Maxwell up in the middle overs to attack and then have White and Christian to finish.

Rant over...