England and South Africa are the same

[ronny_kingsley]

At this moment in time.

Hoggy>Pollock. Pollock isn't anywhere near as good as he was..

What about Pollock's batting mate ????

At this moment in time.
Jones> Steyn AND Kruger.

Jones is injured and Steyn is winning matches for his team. So ????

At this moment in time.
Kallis bowling is very ineffective in comparison to Freddie, Although kallis is a better batsman..

In comaprison to Kallis then even Flintoff doesnt match upto his batting

At this moment in time.
Anderson isn't even our first choice.

I'd still put him over Steyn though.

ANderson hasnt won a Test for his team yet and Steyn has.

 

[Iron-Haggis]

You're all drawing very long straws trying to compare players who are completely different, comparing Flintoff and Kallis side by side is pretty ridiculous. Plus you're comparing a slightly weakened South African side to full strength English side. No Pollock and no Gibbs, two very good players.

 

[puddleduck]

The only comparison that can be drawn between the two sides is that England beat South Africa when they last played each other, and did so in South Africa. They also beat the Aussies and Drew to India in their test series there, none of those were acheived by South Africa.

However if you are talking about the Odi arena, then yes South Africa are a far better Odi side than England... with much of the above being reversed, they beat Aussies at home, beat England at home, and drew to India

 

[vizard]

I agree with Max that UCB made a mistake in hiring Micky Arthurs..It's bad enough having your skipper having a foot-in-mouth disease, why do u want to have a coach doing the same too. It really puts a lot of pressure on the younger guys in the team when prior to every match they come up with big comments n take potshots but seldom back it up. He's got it wrong with the team selections too and hasnt really managed Pollock well. He still can be a wicket taking bowler but he's now given the impression it's all handed over to Ntini. Do you see McGrath being told that even as Lee has taken over in last year. But i don't think he'll be fired before the WC..he has a chance to win a test series at last ..if SA manage to fight out for a draw in this test..and also put up a good showing in India later. 2-2 last year was a good result in India against their current lot, i think even Australia wouldve been happy with that.

 

[Sureshot]

What about Pollock's batting mate ????


True, Pollock is a much better batsman. But as a bowler hoggy is better.


Jones is injured and Steyn is winning matches for his team. So ????

Ntini won the game. And If Steyn won it with those wickets then I'll say the same about Jimmy at Mumbai, he took 6 there. Jones maybe injured but still has won us several test matches.


In comaprison to Kallis then even Flintoff doesnt match upto his batting


I know that. I'd rather have Freddie in my team though.

Over the last 3 years. 40 with the bat 24 with the ball for Freddie. 70 with the bat for Kallis his bowling would be higher than that.

ANderson hasnt won a Test for his team yet and Steyn has.

See above. Under Jones.

http://statserver.cricket.org/guru?...edhigh=;csearch=;submit=1;.cgifields=viewtype

3 4 wicket hauls and 2 5 wicket hauls.


So you could argue then that Anderson has won 5 matches for his team and Steyn 1 match.

.......

I won't though.

Steyn or Anderson?

Anderson all the time.

You're all drawing very long straws trying to compare players who are completely different, comparing Flintoff and Kallis side by side is pretty ridiculous. Plus you're comparing a slightly weakened South African side to full strength English side. No Pollock and no Gibbs, two very good players.

People have used Pollock in there comparisons, but with Hoggy, which isn't right in itself.

Gibbs test form is diabolical.

 

[Stephen Bailey]

What about Pollock's batting mate ????

It's good, but he's suppose to be an all-rounder.

Jones is injured and Steyn is winning matches for his team. So ????

Jones is actually back playing for Glamorgan in the current round of CC matches. Steyn aided Ntini in beating New Zealand, point out other matches he's won for his team. If you want to pick out a player that possibly won South Africa the game, then it should be de Villiers.

In comaprison to Kallis then even Flintoff doesnt match upto his batting

No one said Flintoff's batting is as good as Kallis', there aren't many better with the bat in the world than him. I was comparing them as all-rounders and then went on to say perhaps a comparison with Vaughan would be better. :

ANderson hasnt won a Test for his team yet and Steyn has.

Again, Steyn aided Ntini in winning that game, Ntini had a lot to say in the first and second innings, Steyn hardly won it for them. I like Steyn a lot, I think he's got some talent, I remember the ball he bowled Vaughan with in the first test of the 2004/5 series, absolute cracker. Both are young and have a long way to go however.

You're all drawing very long straws trying to compare players who are completely different, comparing Flintoff and Kallis side by side is pretty ridiculous. Plus you're comparing a slightly weakened South African side to full strength English side. No Pollock and no Gibbs, two very good players.

It's a good point, however, the last test century Gibbs scored came against England at Jo'burg I believe, that was in the fourth test in early 2005. Pollock has been batting better than he has been bowling, although I tend to agree with angryangy that if he can find just that bit more pace, he would be a threat again.

 

[BigCrickNan]

Again, Steyn aided Ntini in winning that game, Ntini had a lot to say in the first and second innings, Steyn hardly won it for them.

And I think England would of bowled teams out for under 100 on that track...

 

[aziz_4_ever2003]

yeah they are almost same

 

[usy]

England is a better test team and South Africa are better at ODI cricket.

 

[puddleduck]

*gives Usy a pat on the back*

Finally someone else with a bit of sense

If anyone wants to compare the two sides there is no better way to do so at the moment than to say in Tests England beat South Africa away, drew to India away and beat Australia at home. South Africa lost to England at home, lost to India away and lost to Australia at home.

In Odis South Africa beat England at home, drew to India away and beat Australia at home. England lost to SA away, lost to India away, lost to Australia at home.

Does it get any clearer?

 

[James_W]

I do hate the bias of English supporters, Flintoff would never get in a team in front of Kallis, and Steyn is better than Anderson as well.

 

[Adarsh]

Flintoff would never get in a team in front of Kallis

Sure he would!!

 

[ronny_kingsley]

I think in the long term (after 10-15 years after retierment) guys like Hoggard,Flintoff would not be comparable to Pollock,Kallis .

Kallis would make it to any team and even at the expense of Flintoff.

Also England won in SA long back.

Steyn picked up 5 wickets in an innings.If thats not good enough then what is ???????

Also loved all your Brit jokes that Hoggard is a better bowler than Pollock.

 

[puddleduck]

Granted I've been drinking... but in my rather limited opinion Ronny_Kingsley posts the most rubbish on this forum Apologies mate but it is just my opinion

If a batting allrounder is more valuable than a bowling allrounder I'll eat my cricket whites, England won in SA against, for all intents and purposes exactly the team that is currently their 1st XI, Steyn picked up 5 wickets in an innings, in a 2nd innings, didn't do nowt in the 1st innings did he?

And currently Hoggard being 4th in the test rankings does actually make him a more valued bowler than Pollock, obviously through their careers Pollock is on another level, but currently I know who I'd rather have, unless I was picking based on their batting abilities

 

[BigCrickNan]

Steyn picked up 5 wickets in an innings.If thats not good enough then what is ???????

Also loved all your Brit jokes that Hoggard is a better bowler than Pollock.

1st point, what if someone like Michael Vaughan picks up a random 5 wicket haul? Does that make him a brilliant bowler?

2nd on current form Hoggard is bowling a lot better than pollock...