England In India - October 2011/12

[Gaurav_7]

And thank you for proving in England that India suck anywhere outside the sub-continent. I don't really care if England lose this series 5-0, because end of the day India got royally thrashed in England in the test series you know that format which is the pinnacle of the game, I don't even care that we beat you in the ODI series.

End of the day look at you Indian fans, the biggest trash talkers ever. Before arriving in England we were going to get thrashed and humiliated, when you were loosing you were hating on your team calling for Dhoni's and the rest of their heads, and now you're back in the subcontinent and winning again you start with the Dhoni love and trash talk. Worst! Fans! EVER!

Well Tom, I agree some of the people here do go overboard. England outclassed us in Tests in England, surely. Accepted. Credit where due. But, I am sick of all the rubbish churned out by people about they don't care about ODIs and all that. Is it that difficult to accept the defeat that most of the people start talking they don't care. If you guys would have won, I am sure you would have cared. Also, I am not saying Indian fans are able to accept the defeat easily. But, I'd expect you to be a bit more mature.

 

[Gurjot95]

^ Ha, good one! And also do people seriously think we should praise a player for performing bad? That goes for every country and that's irony coming from English fan because when you won ODI you were going top of the world and now you are getting owned, you don't even care. Lol!

 

[Highlander999]

I genuinely can honestly say no one England gave much notice to us winning the ODI series. Yes, there was a bit of hype about becoming Test number 1 but that was it. I can counter your argument by saying the only reason you care about the ODI series is that you lost the test series.

And no, you don't praise a player when he plays bad, you guys though want to bloody well lynch the Indian team when you loose badly.

 

[Aditya]

Excellent performance from India but not taking anything away from England, they batted really well and I understand the fact that playing in Indian conditions and that too against good Indian spinners is tough and to be honest, England have done really well. This series is excellent for all the young players of both the teams, England youngsters are gonna learn how to play spinners because it's the fact that playing spin isn't something that can be learned easily. It takes time and the England team has actually done pretty well in playing the Indian spinners. Has been a good performance from England and on other hand, seeing India's performance, I'm very happy even though I believe that the batting still needs improvement.

Rahane did play well today but just one match doesn't prove anything. This is the only reason to worry but apart from this, it has been a fine performance from the Indian batsmen. Winning this series was important for Indian cricket, the England tour was horrible for us and this win will boost up the team confidence which was very necessary. It's time to give Unadkat and Aaron a chance. We've seen Unadkar quite a few times in IPL and CLt20 but Aaron has not really got much chance to show how good a bowler he is. I'm really looking forward to see Aaron bowl. Next 2 ODI's are gonna be more interesting.

 

[aayush93]

Why would India be any better with those players in out of curiosity? I actually think India are doing so well in this series because of the young vibrant batting lineup that runs singles hard and puts pressure on the bowlers. The players you are missing are all at the end of their careers and are in no way guaranteed to play any better than what is essentially you're future Indian team. This is not a "second string" Indian team, it is your future.

Not to mention the vast improvement in the fielding...

is yuvraj career ended ? :

he is still 30-31 and he was man of the series of world cup.. Ya but i agree sachin career is ended and even if he was fit he would have not played against poor england ODI lineup..

Zaheer still has few years left in him.. India do need Yuvraj for sure as he can bowl, good fielder and One of the best middle-order batsman in ODI.

 

[Aditya]

Tom, you're being a little too harsh. You must admit, that winning is winning. It isn't like whenever we travel England, we lose. In 2007 we did play well in England, both in tests and ODI's. I might be going a bit too far ahead but England has really not done too well in sub continent and this has been the case for quite some time now. I must also mention, I'm a big fan of the England cricket but what I believe is, a win is a win whether it's at home or away. You guys won at home and totally outplayed us, I admit this. Now, when we're doing good at our home tracks, you cannot just say that we perform well only in sub continent.

 

[puddleduck]

That's quite a good comparison, intellect wise at least. I think the average England football fan though expects to never win anything major though

True now, but if you go back a tournament or two, everytime we reached a tournament the press would somehow convince the average England football team that this year was our time, that the "golden generation" would roll through everyone in their path. The problem is, just because there a millions of Indian cricket fans, it just means there is more morons to talk rubbish. Fickle doesn't even come close.

So then, Finn seems to be developing very nicely, and for a bowler with such good test numbers, it's good to see him performing in India on pitches that don't have too much pace to them. Nice control, and he's really developed his pace nicely.

Trott continues to show that if he doesn't score runs, England don't score runs. Whatever the morons in the press keep saying about his scoring rate, he is clearly England's second best ODI batsman (the best one is unfortunately injured). Let us not ignore the fact that he keeps scoring runs wherever he goes.

However, there are some rather large cracks that shouldn't be ignored. Kieswetter has just 1 century and 4 50's in 26 innings. If you average around 30 at the top of the order, your strike rate has to be comfortably over 100. He neither averages 30 nor has a strike rate over 100. His keeping is average at best. To me that is a wasted position.

Dernbach, as I have already said is a liability. He has now played 13 games and has an average over 40 and an economy of 6.5. This includes 3-30 against Ireland. Even in England against an India side in turmoil, he got tapped all over the park. He seems to have no idea what he's bowling, no plan to his attack. He needs to go back to county cricket and learn how to bowl at 85mph again.

Samit Patel, well Sureshot said that Samit was not a number 7 and he proved that today with a much better batting performance with the time to come in and get set. However, he still looks highly unthreatening with the ball, and the reality is the question still remains, what is he in the team to do? Is he really good enough to be a batsman who offers a bowling option? Which also brings up Ravi Bopara, I don't think there is anyone in ODI cricket who looks as scratchy scoring their runs. He gets in, and never seems to be able to change his tempo. Fair enough if you provide the weight of runs that Trott does, but he doesn't. His bowling is useful, but is it more useful than Bell's clearly superior batting ability? Lest us not forget that in 63 innings, Ravi still has only 6 50's to his name. That is, quite simply, not good enough.

Other than that, a good game, and India mostly played well. Dhoni continues to look unmoveable in ODI cricket, and it's almost as if the tour of England has made him a stronger player. I feel India benefit massively from the new young and exhuberant batting lineup that with it brings a dynamic fielding side. I see talk of the old guard to return, but let's be honest. England would probably have scored 20-30 runs more due to easy singles, and India would not have picked up as many singles themselves. It is time India started looking to the future.

 

[Gaurav_7]

I can counter your argument by saying the only reason you care about the ODI series is that you lost the test series.

And no, you don't praise a player when he plays bad, you guys though want to bloody well lynch the Indian team when you loose badly.

That counter is baseless, I'd say. I was talking of ODIs in general and not just this series. You say you don't care when it comes to ODIs.

I agree with your second part there. Surely, one cannot praise someone when he plays poor. But, we (Indian fans) do go a bit far away. As far as calling for Dhoni to be stripped off his captaincy. Be it Tests, but that's just something I really can't digest.

 

[puddleduck]

is yuvraj career ended ? :

he is still 30-31 and he was man of the series of world cup.. Ya but i agree sachin career is ended and even if he was fit he would have not played against poor england ODI lineup..

Zaheer still has few years left in him.. India do need Yuvraj for sure as he can bowl, good fielder and One of the best middle-order batsman in ODI.

Well done, so you managed to pick one player that might play... A player who is notorious for going through massive peaks and dips in form... Really helps the argument that this is a second string team. By that argument this is an England second-string team because there is no Morgan? Hmm, quite.

 

[MUFC1987]

We were poor today. Bowling wise.

For once we got a good score that should/can be defended, but the bowlers let us down. Cook got the tactics spot on with Finn though. Bowling him at the start and then bringing him back in that 30-40 over mark is ideal, because he can take wickets then. Just hope Cook sticks to this. Not enough wicket taking from the rest of the side though.

Patel doesn't look a threat with the ball, Dernbach seems to struggle to get batsmen out, only doing well if they throw their wickets away, or get out on the slog. Bresnan and Swann seem to have gone off the boil too. I'm not really convinced by Bresnan with the new ball either, as I think he could do a better job as that first change seamer.

The worst thing about this for me, is that we will probably, once again, fail to learn from our mistakes and poor showings.

 

[Sureshot]

Bresnan has always been a bit meh in ODI's imo. Swann was unlucky, he had two other LBW's turned down which were out. Patel should have had a wicket today, but yeah, he's not going to be rolling sides over. If his bowling can be the 6th option, great. But that's not really feasible, we have to make do with what we've got, the fact is there aren't a huge pool of players in England who can do what Freddie did for us in ODI's.

Samit's batting today was fantastic. Although I felt we could have got 20 runs more today, it wasn't the batting which cost us today, but the bowling and fielding. Finn continues to look good, but both Bresnan and Dernbach were liabilities today (though Bresnan did get wickets) and Kieswetter's keeping just wasn't good enough. 2 drops and a failed run-out just isn't good enough.

Need to make a change or two for the last two ODI's. I think Dernbach can be what we need in ODI's, but he's too raw atm.

A combination of luck and missed chances cost us today, off the top of my head it cost us 5 wickets today. That was the difference between the sides. Good match, nice to see KP playing well today.

 

[aayush93]

Well done, so you managed to pick one player that might play... A player who is notorious for going through massive peaks and dips in form... Really helps the argument that this is a second string team. By that argument this is an England second-string team because there is no Morgan? Hmm, quite.

i think world cup is in 2015 and this series is held in 2011..

anyway i haven't said that this is india second string team at all in this thread yet..
Sehwag plays less ODI, so i haven't included his name.. About Yuvraj Form, then tell me any player who has always been in form in his entire Career. Yuvraj Is second to sachin in winning man of the series award in ODI for India.

India fielded same kind of squad against New zealand (who is far better than england ODI team) and NZ got thrashed 5-0. Even if sehwag, sachin, zaheer were fit they would have not played..

many People reckons this india side is a second string team just because we are playing without 3 experienced bowlers who plays regularly for india. (Zaheer, Harbhajan, Munaf) and 2 match winner batsman (Sehwag, yuvraj).

if there was sehwag, or yuvraj, then you can gurantee they will win one match each on their own only.. So, likes of rahane or parthiv don't have special abilities like sehwag or yuvraj who can hit 2-3 boundaries in a over so they need to take some tight singles..

 

[puddleduck]

Well than Aayush, I wasn't referring to you was I? I was referring to another poster, so it seems somewhat pointless to comment that my reference to this not being a Second String team, but pointing out that one of the players mentioned would actually play, to then concur with me that this isn't

 

[Aalay]

Well I think England should just stop playing ODI's if they don't really care about it and give poor Ireland a chance to enter there. Ireland can surely do better then England.

 

[Rohit Doshi]

Well I think England should just stop playing ODI's if they don't really care about it and give poor Ireland a chance to enter there. Ireland can surely do better then England.

Yes obviously they will do better, if players like Eoin Morgon join back Ireland.

Look at this England team without Kevin Pietersen, Jonathan Trott, Eoin Morgan.

If you dont care dont play. Give teams who really need players a chance to prove.

I completely agree you won and outclassed us in Tests 4 to NIL. That was embarrassing tbh but wait a second.. when have you won a test back here in India? 1984? Woho!! Thats way too back and you really suck at subcontinent. Wish we would have cancelled the West Indies tour and let them play test back here but BCCI thought of letting the England team enjoy the moment and we will show you next year!!