Nathan Hauritz role in the Australian test side. Should he really be playing?

[War]

Sure, Taylor got dropped twice off Hauritz, then he suddenly felt really comfortable! All I ask is why Bollinger's bad match didn't overshadow his career too? Not only did he get slogged by Taylor, but also Tim Southee.

Twice of Hauriz?. I coud be slightly wrong here but i remember Taylor being dropepd 3 times overall. Twice off Harris in the slips & once off Hauritz.

But that drop of Hauritz by Johnson was all down to Taylor's brain-freeze at the crease with a mixture of utter contempt towards Haurtiz's bowling - rather than anything special from Hauritz. Oterwise Taylor batting againts Hauritz pretty much proves my point, that good batsmen should not have any problem facing Hauritz. When he bowls accurately they should be good enough to negotiate/respect that - but at the same time when they want to make the transition to attack him it wouldn't be very risky at all.

That shot also was reministent of how Hauritz dismissed KP in the Cardiff Ashes test 1st innings. Where KP tried to be tried to play a cute sweep shot & ended up top-edging, instead of playing a comanding sweep shot like what he had done before againts the likes of Warne, Murali, Kumble, Harbhajan.


Not sure how Bollinger is relevant here..

 

[War]

I think Hauritz is playing his role well in the Australian team. In my opinion, playing five pace bowlers simply (the main four plus Watson) with North and Clarke as our part time spinners is simply too much of a risk, even on non-subcontinental pitches. The fact that part time spinners such as North and Clarke perform well when they do come on to bowl is due to the fact that they are part time spinners, I believe that the more you use them (such as making them your main spin options), the less effective they will become.

Hauritz' economical bowling is also complementary to Australia's attacking and sometimes expensive pace bowlers. Yes, sometimes Hauritz can be expensive at times as well, but that is the case with almost all spinners. As a finger spinner, being underrated is not necessarily a bad thing either.

Two very good points here.

Firstly yes if Australia do play a 4-man pace attack (plus Watson) none of them are metronomes at all. All are fairly attacking bowlers & on some days they are likely to cost runs. If Stuart Clark hadn't declined so much he would have been the perfect seamer for this role. Although i would say Ryan Harris potentially could be that "line" bowler to keep things quiet for Ponting in the all pace attack - instead of picking Siddle as poster aussie1st suggested.

So overall the fact that Hauritz is accurate & can block up an end is one of the biggest push factors to pick him, ahead of an all-pace attack.

But i think Australia can risk playing all those quicks even if non are exactly economical & will conceed the few extra runs from time to time. Since at least those guys will take wickets.



Finally what you said about Clarke & North, Katich is true. Their effective mainly is due to fact that they aren't used alot. But i dont mind losing that effectivness of those part-timers since their roles in a 4-man attack will just be to fill in a few overs basically. Plus when we get to the 4th & 5th day of a test match where Haurtiz can't run through sides. You have the likes of Watson & Hilfenhaus especially who can generate reverse swing on those detoriating surfaces - so AUS won't be losing anything.

I really don't think that's his job. I think it's a bonus if he can take 4th and 5th day scalps. But if they wanted a spinner to do job specifically they'd have kept Krejza. It's the pacemen's job to pick up the wickets now. Shane Warne has long retired mate, and to be honest there are maybe 2 spinners in world cricket at the moment who can run through teams. Swann and Murali. Vettori and Harris are no better than Hauritz at running through teams. Harbhajan can on his day but I wouldn't bank on it.

Actually i'd say Swann, Harbhajan, Harris, Murali (even in decline currently), Vettori (although his output in this area has declined slightly since his batting has taken off) & Al-Hasan. Would definately would run through opposition (quality opposition) sides on a 4th & 5th day deteriorating surface. All Hauritz has proven he can do in such conditions is be economical.

This has to be Hauritz main role in the team, since basically unless that spinner is Warne, Murali or O'Reilly (shoutouts to Grimmett, Underwood, Tayfield). Spinners generally don't come into their own on the 4th & 5th days of a tests. So if they can't be depended on to a sure wicket-taking force on a 5th day - he isn't doing his job in tests.

 

[sifter132]

^Well I'll show you. Here's a rundown of a selection of spinners in the 3rd and 4th innings of a Test. You tell me who runs through what:
Warne: 129 innings, 359 wickets @ 22.85, 19x5fers
Murali: 99 innings, 339 wickets @ 20.89, 28x5fers
Swann: 14 innings, 37 wickets @ 29.91, 2x5fers
Harbhajan: 69 innings, 156 wickets @ 24.53, 10x5fers
Harris: 23 innings, 43 wickets @ 28.67, 1x5fer
Vettori: 74 innings, 127 wickets @ 36.01, 6x5fers
Shakib: 12 innings, 18 wickets @ 37.77, 1x5fer
Hauritz: 14 innings, 32 wickets @ 26.84, 2x5fers
Table: Spinners in 3rd and 4th innings since 1990

Harris, Vettori and Shakib are pretty ordinary dude. Sure those figures are just stats which never tell the whole story, but my eyes certainly don't see those 3 doing anything that Hauritz isn't doing either.

But anyway, I think we'll always disagree on this Just wanted to bring some facts to the table.

 

[Robelinda]

Well, Hauritz has won me over, he really has done a good job, but I get the feeling when someone better comes along he will be dropped very quickly. Those stats show how average Vettori is too.

 

[MaD]

Hauritz may be a little overrated by the selectors but he does his job when he's needed and he improved a ton over the past few years

 

[hedger_14]

Agree with Gazza on this (That's a first) that Hauritz cops more than he deserves. Even if he is my favourite player. He is a very good spin bowler but has no luck. He bowls well and has dropped catches off his bowling, play and misses and mistimed strokes falling safely. He is a lot like Harris though who doesn't react too well when the pressure is put on him by batsman (as shown with one of his later overs against Taylor where he kept giving him gifts). His economy is probably his best statistic as said before, he helps the quick bowlers take wickets by tightening it up. He deserves his spot in the side

 

[Num]

Twice of Hauriz?. I coud be slightly wrong here but i remember Taylor being dropepd 3 times overall. Twice off Harris in the slips & once off Hauritz.

But that drop of Hauritz by Johnson was all down to Taylor's brain-freeze at the crease with a mixture of utter contempt towards Haurtiz's bowling - rather than anything special from Hauritz. Oterwise Taylor batting againts Hauritz pretty much proves my point, that good batsmen should not have any problem facing Hauritz. When he bowls accurately they should be good enough to negotiate/respect that - but at the same time when they want to make the transition to attack him it wouldn't be very risky at all.

That shot also was reministent of how Hauritz dismissed KP in the Cardiff Ashes test 1st innings. Where KP tried to be tried to play a cute sweep shot & ended up top-edging, instead of playing a comanding sweep shot like what he had done before againts the likes of Warne, Murali, Kumble, Harbhajan.


Not sure how Bollinger is relevant here..

I believe dismissals through the batsman underrating and/or attacking you are still valid (if not just as valid) in comparison to dismissals that come from something "special" (such as large amounts of drift and turn). As a finger spinner in particular, luring the batsman into underrating and/or attacking your bowling is probably how you're going to get a lot of your dismissals. It will be interesting to see how Hauritz goes against the best players of spin though.

 

[drainpipe32]

TBCH Hauritz performs just as well as Vettori. Vettori has of course played 6 times as many matches as Hauritz, but after 15 games he averaged 17 with the bat. TBF Vettori was 20 but Hauritz has had to bat at No. 9-10 his entire career, where Vettori averages 23.

And I'd rather have Hauritz bowling for my team than Vettori....

 

[pcfan123]

You have to give credit to the selectors for initially picking him for the National side when he was even struggling to get game time in state cricket. One of the better left field selections

 

[drainpipe32]

I think it might have been because other spinners were currently playing domestic games and they didn't want to interrupt, and Haury was lucky to be on the sidelines...

 

[brownies]

They should call back symonds. Then they will have an all rounder. They can use symonds to bowl spin/medium and He will field and bat excellently.

 

[pcfan123]

Performances in IPL do not count for ████ when thinking about Test cricket. Learn this fact and you will avoid lots of humiliation on this forum

 

[drainpipe32]

For the ODI team maybe.....

 

[brownies]

Symonds has an average of 40+ in test cricket. So why not? Also i aint counting the performances in ipl.

 

[pcfan123]

Then what recent form are you going by when you say

He will field and bat excellently.