Tendulkar v Inzamam TEST CRICKET ONLY

[shan111]

And are those averages overall career statistics?

I don't think so. Those are EXACT situations

Nope, they are'nt.
You were saying that the overall career stas are'nt anything.
I was only quoting the overall career average when Sachin or Inzi was playin at India and Pakistan respectievely. You see by overall average Inzi beats Sachin. But when it comes to 'break-down' average of series by series, Sachin beats Inzi.
Now you have two options. if you choose to hail inzi as a greater player than Sachin by 'looking closer' , then you would have to realise that Sachin is a greater player under pressure situation like Indo-Pak in home than Inzi. .
Otherwise if you go by the overall career stats then you will have to hail Sachin as greater player than Inzi. Althogh he averages a bit less in Indo-Pak face offs.
This shows that you are using the mode of stats which will make Inzi greater than Sachin. First you say ignore overall stars and 'look closer' in the overall stats.That shows Inzi averages more in Pak wins. Then when I come up with the overall stats abot a category which will make Inzi average greater than Sachin, then you choose to look at thet the overall stats, not to 'look closer'. But if one 'looks closer' it'll show Sachin averages greater than Inzi in that paricular category. This is probably why you did'nt choose to 'look closer'.
So which of the stats are you going to choose?

 

[khalek]

Using this way, I can prove many batsmen are better than Sachin.
for example: I can say that Masakadza (from Zimbave) is better than Tendulkar as he scored a century in his Test debut but Sachin didn't.

Its as simple as that.

Where did debut century come from? is that even a situation?

khalek added 1 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...

Nope, they are'nt.
You were saying that the overall career stas are'nt anything.
I was only quoting the overall career average when Sachin or Inzi was playin at India and Pakistan respectievely. You see by overall average Inzi beats Sachin. But when it comes to 'break-down' average of series by series, Sachin beats Inzi.
Now you have two options. if you choose to hail inzi as a greater player than Sachin by 'looking closer' , then you would have to realise that Sachin is a greater player under pressure situation like Indo-Pak in home than Inzi. .
Otherwise if you go by the overall career stats then you will have to hail Sachin as greater player than Inzi. Althogh he averages a bit less in Indo-Pak face offs.

There you go again, i would now like to smack Shoaib Akhtar for a huge 200 meter six in an Indian stadium once in my life

 

[King Pietersen]

I can agree with that about Lara and Ponting and Viv Richards to be fairly honest

Inzamam's led his country to more wins with the bat than those guys did.

To be fair, Lara batted very selfishly, and he was the captain. He decided to score 400, instead of giving his team a decent chance. Had he declared when he was on say, 300, he could have beat England by an innings and a TON of runs.

Why? - He bowled England out in their first innings, and England in their second innings were 5 down. Just another 2 or 3 hours, and WI could have won that game had Lara declared.

So it can be said that it is slightly Lara's fault for WI not winning more games. Viv Richards didn't face the bowling attack of this generation, so its difficult to compare.

Now here's an interesting situation. Ponting averages 63.75 in games Australia have won - now Australia have won 84 tests, and only lost 16 and drawn 19 (in the games Ponting has played in)

Now Ponting usually comes in at #3, so he only has to fight with #1 and #2 and possibly #4 to get those runs.

I would do the stats, but its too much work, and has NOTHING to do with this thread, as this is a Sachin v Inzamam thread, not Inzamam v everyone else thread.

Oh.My.God. I've seen some biased bullshit in my time, but this takes the biscuit. Inzamam Ul-Haq a better player than Brian Lara, Sir Vivian Richards and Ricky Ponting, you must be mental. They are 3 players who will be remembered forever. Lara and Richards are the 2 greatest West Indian batsmen of all-time, closely followed by Sir Garfield Sobers of course. There is no way that Inzamam is better than both of them. Then you have Ponting, who played in the same era, has again scored more runs, more hundreds, is a better ODi player, a better fielder and a better captain. Some of you Pakistani's need to take the green tinted glasses off before you make even further fools of yourselves.

 

[shan111]

Where did debut century come from? is that even a situation?

khalek added 1 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...



There you go again, i would now like to smack Shoaib Akhtar for a huge 200 meter six in an Indian stadium once in my life

What?!? A debut test against a potent attack is'nt a situation for a batsman?
Gee, you've got proper nerves of steel.

 

[Pranav]

Where did debut century come from? is that even a situation?

khalek added 1 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...



There you go again, i would now like to smack Shoaib Akhtar for a huge 200 meter six in an Indian stadium once in my life

Simple enough, you are limiting things in the same way.You are talking of pressure conditions,averages when the team won,averages of second inings etc.

By using this method I can prove that a crap batsman is even better than Sir Bradman.

 

[Amiya]

Neither i am fan of Tendulkar nor Inzamam... And there is no point of comparing two greats batsman...

 

[Pranav]

What?!? A debut test against a potent attack is'nt a situation for a batsman?

Exactly !

 

[khalek]

Come on guys give at least one situation where Tendy was better than Inzi in a match/series since 1998

 

[Amiya]

Comparing is done to show own's identity... And Tendulkar and Inzamam don't need that...

 

[khalek]

Simple enough, you are limiting things in the same way.You are talking of pressure conditions,averages when the team won,averages of second inings etc.

By using this method I can prove that a crap batsman is even better than Sir Bradman.

Debut is a situation, but do you expect all players to score a century in a debut match?

but you do expect a batsman to perform when the team is in trouble... as simple as that

 

[SciD]

Its better not to reply and then thread will die down itself.

 

[shan111]

Debut is a situation, but do you expect all players to score a century in a debut match?

but you do expect a batsman to perform when the team is in trouble... as simple as that

See, when a batsman come out to bat when team's in trouble that's what qualifies as a pressure situation. The pressure is of the expectation of you to lift the team from the dumps.
When a batsman is making his debut, the pressure is all nerves. He thinks that he has to score runs to prove selectors right, his captain right etc. Also he thinks that if he does not score runs it may end his career etc.
So those two situation makes a batsman play under pressure albeit having different reason. But it's the same pressure.

 

[khalek]

See, when a batsman come out to bat when team's in trouble that's what qualifies as a pressure situation. The pressure is of the expectation of you to lift the team from the dumps.
When a batsman is making his debut, the pressure is all nerves. He thinks that he has to score runs to prove selectors right, his captain right etc. Also he thinks that if he does not score runs it may end his career etc.
So those two situation makes a batsman play under pressure albeit having different reason. But it's the same pressure.

Lol Tendy only scored 15 in his debut against Pak and Inzy scored 8 not out, so does it make them bad batsmen?

 

[shan111]

Lol Tendy only scored 15 in his debut against Pak and Inzy scored 8 not out, so does it make them bad batsmen?

Now you're getting my point.
The debut match is just one of the many pressure situation one batsman has to go through. Some pass it with flying colours, some dont.
Likewise, in some pressure matches, a particular batsman score runs, sometimes he does'nt; but another batsman scores.
This is the way the game is.

 

[aditya123]

The stats paint a story. Sachin scores under pressure, it usually leads to an Indian loss or draw. When Inzamam scores, it leads to a Pakistani win or draw.

And thats a fact.

Yeah, you have got to blame Sachin for that !:
You fail to look beyond the basic stats like `Inzy scores and it leads to a Pakistani win` or `Sachin scores only when India loses` !

Now tell me, when are you under more pressure, when your teammates are failing to perform or when the team is winning ?
Sachin has a great average of 51 in losing tests and the reason was lack of bowling firepower and as you stress so much on test cricket, you would know that you need to take 20 wickets to win tests.
Let us now leave Tendulkar and Inzy out for a moment and assume we have 2 players `A` and `B`.

Player A and B have both played 10 tests. `A ` scored 8 hundreds and B scored 3.
All of `B`s hundreds came in winning causes while only 4 of `A`s hundreds came in winning causes !
Hey we`ve got some percentages here! When `A` scored a hundred, his team won only 50% of the times whereas when B scored a hundred, his team won 100% of the times.

Iam sure, it is only your bind attempt at proving that Inzy is way better that is coming in the way of you realizing that Tendulkar has played pressure knocks as well and many of them.You keep giving us 3 or 4 examples and make it look like that was the norm when Inzy batted. Yet, when we pointed out instances where Inzamam failed in situations where he was expected to rescue Pakistan, you come up with points like`he was not even set in those games and hence does not count as choking`.

I`m sure most Indians here would agree that Inzy was great under pressure but we would not agree to the fact that Tendulkar is utter crap under presure and way inferior to Inzy in that aspect.We all know how Sachin performed in the 90s when he was under pressure everytime he batted due to a poor bowling attack whih conceded 400+ runs each time even in helpful bowling tracks.
Hence many of his hundreds would not ahve resulted in an Indian win.
You only have to look up to the last India-AUS series to find three examples of Sachin performing under pressure.