The PlanetCricket View: Where does Sehwag stand?

Dare

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Sehwag's overall record in ODIs in New Zealand: (Now don't say that NZ have flat pitches)

Matches: 18
Innings: 18
Runs: 598
HS: 125*
Average: 54.36
SR: 103.1
100s: 3
50s: 2

As far as I can see Sehwag has played 12 matches in New Zealand.
And his best series in New Zealand in tests and ODIs came on Indias last tour to New Zealand where they had probably the worst pitches in New Zealand for a long time. You can ask any NZ person on the forums.
 

mohit_dude10

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As far as I can see Sehwag has played 12 matches in New Zealand.
And his best series in New Zealand in tests and ODIs came on Indias last tour to New Zealand where they had probably the worst pitches in New Zealand for a long time. You can ask any NZ person on the forums.

Baseless.

He scored 299 Runs @ 42.71 in 2002-03 series, where the tracks were much greener and against good quality NZ attack and FYI he was the top scorer in the series where no other batsmen scored 200 runs.
 

Dare

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Baseless.

He scored 299 Runs @ 42.71 in 2002-03 series, where the tracks were much greener and against good quality NZ attack and FYI he was the top scorer in the series where no other batsmen scored 200 runs.

Aight well 2002 was his best test return in New Zealand and this time around on flatter pitches against worse bowling he averaged 20, what to say now?
 

ZoraxDoom

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So one tour he does well and he is the best in the world, the next tour he does ████ because he cant bat there to save his life and he is in bad form. Got to make up your minds.
My comment was more tongue in cheek than serious. I wasn't even following the current debate :p

I stand by what I said. Sehwag is weak technically, but people are over-exaggerating it. He struggles where 90% of the batsmen in the world will struggle. He'll need to prove himself in these coming tours to deserve to be called an all time great.
 

AbhishekS

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We shall discuss further only after the South African tour. The only conclusion that I have come across reading the entire thread is that War surely is a jealous, racist (not in the typical way) and a bonehead.

He can post and write anything and everything to prove his wrong point correct.
 

mohit_dude10

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Aight well 2002 was his best test return in New Zealand and this time around on flatter pitches against worse bowling he averaged 20, what to say now?

Oh come on now, you expect him to replicate his aggressive performance series after series without failure? He has greater chance of failing because of his batting style and technical difficulties but still he performs excellent in 4 out 5 series and sets up so many matches in India's favour.
 

sohum

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Every great batsman, great bowler or great team in test history has had to show versatility & adaptability by performing @ home & away from home.

If Sehwag continues to just dominate in India & look like poor away from home outside of his comfort zone, that will prevent him from ever being considered a truly great opener. Since all the great openers in test history who have earnt that accolade in the psot-war era have had to score runs againts the best of attacks @ home & away from home.
That's a fairly orthodox definition of great. Sehwag is a fairly unorthodox batsman and is very unique batsman in modern-day cricket. In the future, I think we will see other batsmen emerge who are as devastating as he is at the top of the order given favorable conditions and I think they will be compared to Sehwag in terms of destruction.

Flat pitches have existed throughout history. Yes, they're probably flatter now. But what Sehwag manages to do in favorable conditions and the manner in which he does it is incomparable to any batsman in the past or present (except maybe Viv Richards though I haven't actually seen him bat).

Not acknowledging what Sehwag does is like taking credit for any scientific paper just because it did not win the Nobel prize.

sohum added 11 Minutes and 26 Seconds later...

So many in test hsitory by all the great batsmen i can't name all right. All of Tendulkar, Lara, Ponting, Viv Richards, G Chappell, G Pollock, Greenidge, Steve Waugh, Gavaskar, Dravid, Hayden, Neil Harvey, Kallis, Sobers etc etc etc etc etc@ some point in their careers scored runs againts a top pace attack in bowler friendly conditions. None ever looked so vulnerable againts such bowlling in such conditions like Sehwag did.
I agree with most of your post but you are entering murky territory here. Highlighted for emphasis is Ponting and how vulnerable he looked against Ishant Sharma in the 2008 series, where the conditions aided seam bowling. The Ponting issue can also be looked at from a different angle--spin bowling. He has struggled against the turning ball for a fair part of his career.

Every batsman struggles at some point or another in their career--that's why we measure form. Every batsman at some point or another looks clueless against some form of bowling. To claim that some batsmen are unstoppable even on the worst batting pitches is not inaccurate--it is false. The pitch wouldn't be a bad batting pitch if batsmen weren't struggling on it.

A batsman like Ponting was great because he was able to succeed in spite of having some limitations. So far, I'd say Sehwag has been fairly successful for India. He's playing in an era where Indian cricket is stronger than it was with Gavaskar--so obviously there isn't a fair compare available. If Sehwag proves to be even average in the upcoming tours to South Africa/Australia, I'd say he'd be pretty happy when he retires since he was dominant in conditions he was used to and decent in conditions that were alien to him.

sohum added 2 Minutes and 28 Seconds later...

We shall discuss further only after the South African tour. The only conclusion that I have come across reading the entire thread is that War surely is a jealous, racist (not in the typical way) and a bonehead.

He can post and write anything and everything to prove his wrong point correct.
Well, then you need to take off the blue-tinted glasses and read again. War's points make a lot of sense. Sehwag does have a lot to prove if he wants to be in discussions for the game's best ever openers. He doesn't have to be world-class in seaming/swinging conditions, but he's currently below average.

The only part I disagree with War is that he hasn't conceded that Sehwag is a very special batsman, yet. If what Sehwag did was not special, we'd not be excited every time we saw a greater than run-a-ball double or triple century.
 

shravi

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We shall discuss further only after the South African tour. The only conclusion that I have come across reading the entire thread is that War surely is a jealous, racist (not in the typical way) and a bonehead.

He can post and write anything and everything to prove his wrong point correct.

And you are what? Another blind fanboy? FFS you were using ODI statistics in a debate about his test credentials. How desperate is that.

While I don't agree with most of War has said, a lot of it is true. I think that Sehwag's greatest flaw is not an inability to play on bowler friendly pitches, but a lack of common sense, and perhaps a on a greater level, a lack of respect for the game and its nuances. He treats every bowler, pitch and conditions the same way, meaning that his game lacks that required adaptability. I do think he has improved over the last 2 years but India hasn't played outside the subcontinent much in this time so the degree to which he has improved will be severely tested on this tour to South Africa. This is the real litmus test.

However, that is not to say he isn't a very good batsman. Even if he has played on flat tracks, as sohum said, nobody dominates on them like he does. To do that requires a lot of skill and ability. However, if he is to move into the 'great' batsmen category, he is really going to have to prove himself in more testing conditions as Dravid and Tendulkar have done. While he may be India's second greatest opener, but Dravid, Sachin and Gavaskar are still in an entirely different class (as for now).
 
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Papa_Smurf

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Completely agree with all Sohum has had to say. Sehwag is indeed a special talent - this debate would be null if he wasn't.

Papa_Smurf added 3 Minutes and 47 Seconds later...

but Dravid, Sachin and Gavaskar are still in an entirely different class (as for now).

For me personally, Gavaskar is in a class of his own. Nobody, and I repeat nobody, annoyed the great Windies quicks like he did. The fact that he was the first of the Indian batting greats makes him all the more special. A true genius.
 

Dare

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Oh come on now, you expect him to replicate his aggressive performance series after series without failure? He has greater chance of failing because of his batting style and technical difficulties but still he performs excellent in 4 out 5 series and sets up so many matches in India's favour.

Oh come on now, if he is as good as you make him out to be then there should be no problem for him to do that.
He fails outside the subcontinent for the most part (Australia being the exception) and every time he goes to New Zealand, South Africa and England its "bad form" or the one "off series in 5".
 

Wizard

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Sehwag can the game away from opposition in one session.Yes he doesn't move his feet.Still he has done well in AUS & ok in ENG.Not much in SA & NZ apart from a hundred in SA.He is a match destructive match winner.I would have him as opener in a World test team of say last 2 decades.

Not really impressed with his ODI batting although he has good career stats.He hasn't done much in crucial matches.
 

Symptom_Control

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Completely agree with all Sohum has had to say. Sehwag is indeed a special talent - this debate would be null if he wasn't.

Papa_Smurf added 3 Minutes and 47 Seconds later...



For me personally, Gavaskar is in a class of his own. Nobody, and I repeat nobody, annoyed the great Windies quicks like he did. The fact that he was the first of the Indian batting greats makes him all the more special. A true genius.

A great player indeed but not that great against the WI really: he didnt face the full strength 4 prong attack many times at all. I'd rate Allan Border as a bigger thorn in their side.
 
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War

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A great player indeed but not that great against the WI really: he didnt face the full strength 4 prong attack many times at all. I'd rate Allan Border as a bigger thorn in their side.

Indeed. The great sunny only faced the might of the 4 prong home & away in 83/84 & one would have to say the WI quicks got the better of him. Even his great 236 not out everyone says he was out early & shocking home umpiring missed it.

Greg Chappell was also a more major thorn sort of too. His runs in the caribbean 79/80 in world series cricket is the stuff of legend.
 

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