Now tell me he isn't a chucker?!

[evertonfan]

Because one of your countrymen dragged him into it.

 

[andrew_nixon]

I didn't make a scientific statement or anything, I just said that he throws the ball regardless of the laws of the game, that were changed for his Doosra.

They were changed for EVERYONE!

Sadly, you beleive everything you read. Facts arent everything nixon, reality is what counts. And the reality is that he will always be looked at as controversial because.....

Reality is facts. The reality is that Murali does not throw. You are incapable of accepting reality.

I dont need facts, use your eyes. Watch him bowl. He bends his arm and then extends it. That is a throw isnt it? And don't say "Every bowler throws then" because they don't do it so its like a full on throw and it doesn't give them an advantage in a contest. But when Murali it does.

You don't need facts? Then you're an idiot. Use YOUR eyes. Look at ALL the evidence. ALL the evidence shows that the apparent extension in his arm is an optical illusion when watched at full speed.

My aim of this thread was to show the guys here a weird picture, not to start a debate on whether he throws or not.

Your thread title is "Now tell me he isn't a chucker." Are you saying that's not what you wanted?

 

[irottev]

Hooper. By refusing to post again he's show that he's been defeated, as he can't back up his claims that Murali chucks, because he doesn't.

It's a shame you lack the maturity to let it go.

You had to keep this going didn't you.

No one can deny Murili is good at what he does.

I'm quite neutral on it. I'm just saying his action does look bad you you see it. If the tests say he passed, then good. But i'm sure in all the tests and ODI's he has played, with such a unique bowling action his arm does illegally straighten at times. But hey, who cares. It's a strange game where stuff like this is going to pop up.

I'ts just an observation. And everyone should be allowed to give their opinion. I have no reason to say it. it's just my opinion. I'm in no way a Warne fanboy or anything. So there you go, a fair opinion. Don't like it? Then get over it.


And by the way, an optical illusion? Yeah right. I've seen 2 balls he has bowled in that video. NO fair test can EVER be conducted on a mere 2 balls. You can't deduce anything from that other then he's yet to be proven a chucker. Not that he defiantly isn't a chucker.

 

[smssia0112]

Look, fact is. Technology doesn't lie. Ok, they can be broken (bugs, etc.).

But when you have program after program after experiment after experiment testing him, and EVERYBODY and EVERYTHING saying that he doesn't chuck, then more than likely / most probably he doesn't.

Look, most of you who are saying Murali chucks is from Australia. Not to be blant or anything, but thats a very worrying sign.

Even Andrew Symonds, has said to you guys specifically (he said Australian crowd) to give Murali the respect he deserves. Just look at what happened to Hair, when he decided to no ball him. He couldn't umpire in games involving Sri Lanka, and soon after, Pakistan, or any other test side. Believe it or not - another Australian.

I cannot see what vandetta you guys (Australians) have against Murali. I am not saying all Australians are like this, I'm sure thats far from it, but most of the ones on this forum are certainly being a bit whiny about a legend who will take over their legend.

Even our PM says he chucks it

But seriously, we didn't imagine up the chucking thing. We called it how we saw it. So did Darrell Hair. We all know that he has an arm defect, it's the most overused excuse in the world. That still doesn't change the fact that the ICC relaxed its rules to help people like him. Not necessarily just him.

Whether he chucks it or not, this is just a discussion.

And for the record, the Warne fanboys comment goes both ways. Most Poms who say that Murali is better are only upset that Warne terrorised them for so long. Many people don't like Warne because he is arrogant. If you are going to make a call like that, you have to be prepared to say that it goes both ways.

Not to be racist, but most fans from the sub-continent much prefer their neighbours over Australians.

And going on with the 'Warne fanboys' remark, personally I can accept that Muralidaran will finish off with more wickets, that will never change my, and mnay others across the globe mind you, opinion that Warne is still the greatest.

 

[Hooper]

The bowling extension to 15 degrees for the doosra was primarily aimed at Murali. Its obvious.

Well, in my eyes he is a thrower. If you can't accept that I think that he is a thrower then you are sad. I know the rules blah blah blah. So stop pointing to facts, I dont need them.

 

[andrew_nixon]

Okay, I understand, and I always did, that he doesnt chuck it (illegally). But if you ever watched him bowl a delivery (particularly a Doosra) and haven't ever thought "damn, that was a bit of a throw".

Honestly? Yes. Then I looked closely at slow motion footage, and all the evidence gathered by EXPERTS and come to the conclusion that what I saw was an optical illusion. This is why facts matter.

He does chuck it, why else would he be No Balled, more then once and by more then one umpire for chucking.

He was no-balled because his action gives the illusion that he is chucking. When broken down into slow motion and the evidence from EXPERTS is looked at, he quite clearly doesn't throw.

Well, in my eyes he is a thrower. If you can't accept that I think that he is a thrower then you are sad. I know the rules blah blah blah. So stop pointing to facts, I dont need them.

You don't need facts? Then you are an idiot. Denying reality in the face of overwhelming evidence is just plain stupid. I am quite justified in calling you a complete moron.

 

[Hooper]

Even our PM says he chucks it

But seriously, we didn't imagine up the chucking thing. We called it how we saw it. So did Darrell Hair. We all know that he has an arm defect, it's the most overused excuse in the world. That still doesn't change the fact that the ICC relaxed its rules to help people like him. Not necessarily just him.

Whether he chucks it or not, this is just a discussion.

And for the record, the Warne fanboys comment goes both ways. Most Poms who say that Murali is better are only upset that Warne terrorised them for so long. Many people don't like Warne because he is arrogant. If you are going to make a call like that, you have to be prepared to say that it goes both ways.

Not to be racist, but most fans from the sub-continent much prefer their neighbours over Australians.

And going on with the 'Warne fanboys' remark, personally I can accept that Muralidaran will finish off with more wickets, that will never change my, and mnay others across the globe mind you, opinion that Warne is still the greatest.

These points here are so very true, well said Dean.

 

[andrew_nixon]

The bowling extension to 15 degrees for the doosra was primarily aimed at Murali. Its obvious.

Obvious to you maybe, but that isn't reality. But then it is quite clear that you and reality don't agree.

 

[evertonfan]

It's a shame you lack the maturity to let it go.

You had to keep this going didn't you.

*sigh* Is this another one of your tantrums? I didn't keep this going, it was going along pretty nicely without the aid of me. So please, put your toys back in your pram and call somebody else immature.

I don't like Warne because he's a womanizer, but as a cricketer he's the best spin bowler i've ever seen.

 

[Hooper]

You don't need facts? Then you are an idiot. Denying reality in the face of overwhelming evidence is just plain stupid. I am quite justified in calling you a complete moron.

Nope, I dont need fact, and Iam not a "moron".

How many times must I say this, to a man in his 20's?

"I know that the facts, evidence and all the record books say that he is a legit bowler, in my eyes he is a thrower. When I see him bowling I see a man who isn't bowling, I see a man bending his arm and imparting major spin on the ball that gives him an unfair advantage".

Please comment on Dean's post, Nixon. Go on, dissect it.

 

[Gilly Fan]

*sigh* Is this another one of your tantrums? I didn't keep this going, it was going along pretty nicely without the aid of me. So please, put your toys back in your pram and call somebody else immature.

I don't like Warne because he's a womanizer, but as a cricketer he's the best spin bowler i've ever seen.

I hate Warne as a person in general, but love him as a Cricketer. Only good thing I can think of off the top of my head that he has done as a person is his charity for kids. Besides that, he's done all the wrong things.

 

[evertonfan]

Exactly, if it wasn't for Warne's cricket he'd be a lowlife; He's cheated on his wife and his family so many times. On the other hand, Murali is one of the nicest men you could ever meet (and yes, I have) and how he manages to keep a smile on his face throughout a career dogged by these stupid claims that he chucks is unbelievable.

 

[Gilly Fan]

Exactly, if it wasn't for Warne's cricket he'd be a lowlife; He's cheated on his wife and his family so many times. On the other hand, Murali is one of the nicest men you could ever meet (and yes, I have) and how he manages to keep a smile on his face throughout a career dogged by these stupid claims that he chucks is unbelievable.

Can you actually believe that they might be getting back together?

 

[ZoraxDoom]

Firstly, Cricket is a game where human judgements and errors actually make it more appealing. I feel all this technology has made the game even tougher for fans to have an opinion and for umpires to umpire.

Let's remove all the technology. Back in the olden days, would Murali be able to bowl? If we take away the technology to test Murali and all the 'scientific facts', the only people who will be able to tell us if Murali chucks or not are the fans and umpires.
An ordinary umpire, like Hair or Emerson, saw Murali bowl when he was new. They didn't know how he did it, there was no science, nothing. They no-balled him for chucking, cause that is what they saw. Fans call him a chucker, cause that is what they saw. Yet, people came to Murali's defence without the technology. They said, keep an eye on his wrist. Thats how he spins it, not by 'throwing' the ball. They said he was born this way, he can't do it any other way, we should forgive him.
Now back in the olden days, days of uncovered pitches and no helmets, Murali would be allowed to live. Umpires would see him bowl, and when they felt he was chucking -like at the end of a day when he is tired, as I am sure he occassionaly does now- they would call it. However, they wouldn't ban him as common sense would prevail - he isn't a good bowler due to the throwing part and he has an abnormality, and if we ban him we are, in essence, banning players who have these abnormalities from playing cricket. Murali would go on to be a great wicketaker with a slightly unsual action, and all would be fine. Fans calling him a chucker would be labed 'Ignorant fools' by pleasant people such as Andrew. There would be no middle ground, either he is pure or completely foul.

But all this has stem from Technology. When this issue first cropped up, the ICC could have just stated Murali isn't cheating as his success isn't due to throwing, give umpires the freedom to call no-balls when the feel correct but not allow them to target him, and could have left it at that. But no, they brought in technology and tested him. And then went and changed the rules. Sure, all bowlers chucked according to what they found, but a normal fan who thought Murali wasn't fine, who heard he was being tested, and then heard the rules had changed, that is a minor fact. Obviously people would be outraged. They thought rules were changed for him (And in fairness, the new rules made his Doosra from previously illegal to legal). This dislike turned to hate, and spawned a battle of Murali vs. Warne. Not only that, but now Umpires were restricted from calling Murali for no-balls for chucking, cause if they did, that in essence would be the end of their career, considering the strength of the Asian Subcontinent.

I personally feel Murali is a fine person with a wierd action who may occassionaly chuck. But none of his wickets are due to this. He is a smart, hard-working, and ruthless bowler. He has a somewhat unfair edge over other bowlers with his rubber wrist, lets him give it big rip easier than other spinners, but even then he is a very good player.

 

[Hooper]

Exactly, if it wasn't for Warne's cricket he'd be a lowlife; He's cheated on his wife and his family so many times. On the other hand, Murali is one of the nicest men you could ever meet (and yes, I have) and how he manages to keep a smile on his face throughout a career dogged by these stupid claims that he chucks is unbelievable.

Your just a sad sack because Warne has destroyed England for the last 15 years .