England in Australia

[Chimp132]

well in the next ashes series australia wont have warne or mcgrath so we could win england could still win if they bat first then get a good score, then bowl the aussies out to either follow on or just before they get to englands score, thn england bat well in the 2nd innins, and choose monty to bowl on the day 4/5 wicket then he can get the turn he was getting over here in england

 

[Gunner786]

owais shah could be a decent number 3 if ian bell is promoted and also cook gets dropped,
scored 115 in the recent mach where vaughn failed

although this line up seems good enough to me while vaughn is injured and clark has worked out cook

strauss
bell
shah
collingwood
pieterson
flintoff
read
mahmood
hoggard
harmy/anderson
monty

solves the 8th batsman problem and also could challenge aussies much more than current team is

 

[Simbazz]

Giles is pure class, best spinner ive seen, i doubt anyone will every come close to what he has ahieved for his country.

Oh wait, i think i got that wrong, it Warne i meant to say

Giles should be dropped, dropped into a Vat of hungry lions, hopefully they'll get him in a spin.

 

[barmyarmy]

owais shah could be a decent number 3 if ian bell is promoted and also cook gets dropped,
scored 115 in the recent mach where vaughn failed

although this line up seems good enough to me while vaughn is injured and clark has worked out cook

strauss
bell
shah
collingwood
pieterson
flintoff
read
mahmood
hoggard
harmy/anderson
monty

solves the 8th batsman problem and also could challenge aussies much more than current team is

I agree with your bowling lineup but I wouldn't drop Cook.

 

[puddleduck]

At the end of the day Fletcher is the man responsible for things that go wrong, just like how the manager of a football team is. Maybe not as much input.

Who has more say the coach of 7 years or the stand in captain?

Yes indeed, Fletcher is the one who will have to take the flack and I think he had accepted that, and to be honest is prepared to do so. What bugs me though is that just about everyone on this forum was posting as though Fletcher is the sole reason for our shambolic performance, and that Freddie is some poor mistreated lad from Lancashire.

End of the day if Freddie isn't up to being captain, and by that I mean making his opinion known then he should resign as captain.

For the record, I agree with a lot of the criticism that is going Fletchers and Englands way. I have made it clear in my many 4 page rants that Panesar should have started, that the attitude given off by the England camp has always been negative, and have even questioned whether Fletcher has indeed reached the end of his shelf life.

The problem though is that everyone is so quick to jump on Fletcher as though he is the only problem, and whilst he has done himself no favours on this tour, and has partaken in some serious errors of judgement leading up to the tour, I think it is unfair for people to forget that he has presided over a first Ashes win in 20 years, and one of the most successful spells in English cricket in my entire life.

I also think it is slightly unfair that winning the Ashes was apparently all Vaughans mastery and excellence, yet here we are losing and all the blame falls squarely at Fletchers feet.

I seem to be saying this over and over, but Fletcher would have sent out a team that his captain felt comfortable with, and I firmly believe that Freddie wanted Giles ahead of Panesar. Funnily enough if, and I am obviously only speculating here, I think it is that mindset from Flintoff that is currently one of the reasons he is struggling so much with the bat, he felt he needed a stronger tail because he is currently not sure how many runs he will score at 6.

 

[evertonfan]

Simon, that's harsh on Giles. He's a poor spinnner, but you can't deny that he's been a loyal servant to England. Although I want him to be dropped like there's no tomorrow, I have nothing against him personally and have the utmost respect for him. It's not his fault he's getting picked over Monty is it?

 

[Gunner786]

i dont think it would make a blind bit of difference to fletcher if he gets flak for england losing ashes due to his selection

 

[Sureshot]

Yes indeed, Fletcher is the one who will have to take the flack and I think he had accepted that, and to be honest is prepared to do so. What bugs me though is that just about everyone on this forum was posting as though Fletcher is the sole reason for our shambolic performance, and that Freddie is some poor mistreated lad from Lancashire.

End of the day if Freddie isn't up to being captain, and by that I mean making his opinion known then he should resign as captain.

For the record, I agree with a lot of the criticism that is going Fletchers and Englands way. I have made it clear in my many 4 page rants that Panesar should have started, that the attitude given off by the England camp has always been negative, and have even questioned whether Fletcher has indeed reached the end of his shelf life.

The problem though is that everyone is so quick to jump on Fletcher as though he is the only problem, and whilst he has done himself no favours on this tour, and has partaken in some serious errors of judgement leading up to the tour, I think it is unfair for people to forget that he has presided over a first Ashes win in 20 years, and one of the most successful spells in English cricket in my entire life.

I also think it is slightly unfair that winning the Ashes was apparently all Vaughans mastery and excellence, yet here we are losing and all the blame falls squarely at Fletchers feet.

I seem to be saying this over and over, but Fletcher would have sent out a team that his captain felt comfortable with, and I firmly believe that Freddie wanted Giles ahead of Panesar. Funnily enough if, and I am obviously only speculating here, I think it is that mindset from Flintoff that is currently one of the reasons he is struggling so much with the bat, he felt he needed a stronger tail because he is currently not sure how many runs he will score at 6.

Just because people aren't criticising Freddie on here doesn't mean they aren't holding him partly responsible.

 

[puddleduck]

Just because people aren't criticising Freddie on here doesn't mean they aren't holding him partly responsible.

Fair enough, I am more referring to a group of posts that arrived many pages back now that seemed to be blaming anything from lack of 20 wickets through to the African Aids epidemic on Fletcher At the time I tried to point out that Freddie was just as responsible for selection as Fletcher was, but noone would listen to a word of it

 

[barmyarmy]

Fair enough, I am more referring to a group of posts that arrived many pages back now that seemed to be blaming anything from lack of 20 wickets through to the African Aids epidemic on Fletcher At the time I tried to point out that Freddie was just as responsible for selection as Fletcher was, but noone would listen to a word of it

IIRC I originally made that point two posts above you

 

[Simbazz]

Matt, it was a joke

To be honest, i want Panesar to play no part of this Ashes series. So when we lose 5-0 and the Aussies are rubbing our wounds in it, Panesar can have a laugh at Fletcher. For making two howling decisions, one, playing Giles over Panesar and two making Flintoff captain.

Flintoff batting has taken a hit, and no one can disprove it as he isnt his normal self, he seems reserved

 

[puddleduck]

IIRC I originally made that point two posts above you

Not so sure about that

I went back through and it seems I've made the point almost every couple of pages so you did probably post just above one of my countless rants! However this was as far back as i could be bothered to keep checking!

http://www.planetcricket.org/forums/showthread.php?t=26746&page=130&pp=15

Still great minds and all that

 

[surendar]

I am not sure whether its been discussed already,

Is MVaughan coming back to the test series? I came to know from cricinfo that, he looked sharp in net practice and also fair performance in some warmup game!

If Vaghny comes back, its doubtful whether he can continue the old dominating form! ( He was the only English batsman to dominate Aussies in Australia in last ashes, i guess ) So will be interesting to see him perform in upcoming matches if at all he returns!

 

[aussie1st]

Seems like he could be right for the boxing day test. He did play for the English academy team against the WA 2nd 11 yesterday so hes almost back.

 

[barmyarmy]

5 live in the UK are reporting a rift between Fletcher and several England players before the second test. Apparently Fletcher wanted to play Panesar (!) but the idea was strongly opposed by unnamed senior players. No more info yet but I assume that Freddie must be one. Jones, Collingwood and Strauss are being mentioned as well.