General Cricket Discussion

[icyman]

Lot of talk about SA sending a 'B' team to NZ for the forthcoming test series. I bet you anything, if SA whitewash NZ, these very experts will proclaim and hail them for such a master stroke.

Personally, I feel the end of Test cricket is near. I have been saying this for quite some time that Tests will die early. ODIs will still remain relevant. Financially poor boards have absolutely no motivation to keep playing, especially if their team hasn't been performing well/ have been subject to playing only 2 tests per series.

I soon foresee a scenario with India, England and Australia playing the longest format.

 

[Bigby Wolf]

 

[Bevab]

Lot of talk about SA sending a 'B' team to NZ for the forthcoming test series. I bet you anything, if SA whitewash NZ, these very experts will proclaim and hail them for such a master stroke.

Personally, I feel the end of Test cricket is near. I have been saying this for quite some time that Tests will die early. ODIs will still remain relevant. Financially poor boards have absolutely no motivation to keep playing, especially if their team hasn't been performing well/ have been subject to playing only 2 tests per series.

I soon foresee a scenario with India, England and Australia playing the longest format.

Nobody will proclaim it as a masterstroke if they win given that everyone knows that the only reason for the squad existing is because of the SA20. This isn’t a West Indies touring Bangladesh for Brathwaite’s debut captaincy series kinda situation.

Tests being financially unsustainable is a very worrying situation for international cricket. This current generation of players may still be enamoured with tests (Bedingham for eg pulled out of the SA20 because he was told he would be picked as a priority if he were available for the NZ tests) but I’m not sure that’ll be the case for a generation that’s grown on a diet of random T20 leagues everywhere.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2024

Tendulkar with the ball was underrated IMO.

 

[icyman]

Tests being financially unsustainable is a very worrying situation for international cricket. This current generation of players may still be enamoured with tests (Bedingham for eg pulled out of the SA20 because he was told he would be picked as a priority if he were available for the NZ tests) but I’m not sure that’ll be the case for a generation that’s grown on a diet of random T20 leagues everywhere.

Test cricket isn't pulling in as many fans nowadays. Don't think players want to play in front of empty stadiums. It will soon, just be the Ashes & BGT and Pataudi Trophy that will shape the international calendar(once every 2 years). If the game is moving towards the shorter format, don't think anything can be done to prevent it.

I already foresee full members like Afghanistan and WI giving up the format entirely in the coming years. Criteria for full membership might change to having a proper ODI/T20 league in the country.

Tendulkar with the ball was underrated IMO.

Massively under-rated! It was such a joy watching him roll his arm in the 2011 World Cup. Gues that was the last time we saw the little man bowl. Would have loved him to do more on the bowling front, but post Ganguly's captaincy, he kind of stopped it altogether.

 

[Bevab]

Test cricket isn't pulling in as many fans nowadays. Don't think players want to play in front of empty stadiums. It will soon, just be the Ashes & BGT and Pataudi Trophy that will shape the international calendar(once every 2 years). If the game is moving towards the shorter format, don't think anything can be done to prevent it.

I already foresee full members like Afghanistan and WI giving up the format entirely in the coming years. Criteria for full membership might change to having a proper ODI/T20 league in the country.

Massively under-rated! It was such a joy watching him roll his arm in the 2011 World Cup. Gues that was the last time we saw the little man bowl. Would have loved him to do more on the bowling front, but post Ganguly's captaincy, he kind of stopped it altogether.

New Zealand have a series in Australia coming up in a few years that has four tests if I remember correctly, it could be their big test series (akin to the Ashes 05) if they play their cards right and capture the spirit of the fans with the spectacle. From what I’ve seen even if their community isn’t as big they are pretty passionate about the longer formats of the game in contrast to their board. If they do wind up losing in a timid fashion again it’ll be for naught though.

Pakistan could also potentially get a thriving test scene if they were willing to invest in it now that they’re away from UAE. The real issue as you’ve said is that fans can’t be convinced unless the experience is good and it’s either prohibitively expensive or crap to watch live at the moment.

West Indies at the moment are producing two types of cricketers; one is a brand of T20 specialists who aren’t as good as the previous generation in core skills and so are not of much use in the other formats while the other is a brand of test only specialists who lack the versatility and wider skills to play in the other formats well. As long as the latter exist I don’t think they’ll stop playing test cricket, besides I also think the ECB won’t let them give up on it. We may get to a stage of only one or two test series with countries that aren’t interested in the format but I don’t see it completely stopping soon.

I’d say the whole nature of bilateral cricket is in bigger danger. The business suits want their own T20 carousel to run everywhere at all times possible and there may be a day where they decide that cricket boards are the middlemen in the interaction and cut them out entirely.

 

[icyman]

Introduction of the franchisees and proliferation of the T20s might be the death knell for cricket. It is hard to not to imagine a scenario wherein say an MI/CSK take up a management stake in affairs of say SLC, ZC or even Afghan Cricket. That'd turn the tables entirely.

While leagues do offer monies, I do not see them growing beyond a certain point, as cricket would eventually reach a saturation point. In my past posts, I've mentioned USA and China as bigger markets where cricket (rather the T20 franchisee) system could work wonders. This will spread the game, but don't see it operating beyond the current T20 format.

On the test arena- unless the ICC really puts its foot down and decides that 'enough is enough', things wont really see a sea change. To safeguard their interests, they need to invest in the game, game experience, etc. At present, I do not see the ICC doing anything of that sort. Some may argue that the marketing of the Test/ODI series be left to home boards and broadcasters, I feel, the ICC could try to push some bits at their end as well. Essentially, all roads point towards the striking of balance between T20 leagues and ODI/Tests.

 

[Bevab]

I don’t think tests are doomed as you believe. Apparently most of the tickets for the current test in South Africa are sold out. There’s plenty of interest in test cricket still but it’s up to the administrators to keep that alive and I do share your pessimism there.

There’s no world in which sporting bodies are taken over completely by private parties like you believe since there would be government interference by then, they would sooner see the boards completely destroyed before doing something like that. There’s nothing in such a move for those franchises either.

 

[noducksallowed]

Introduction of the franchisees and proliferation of the T20s might be the death knell for cricket. It is hard to not to imagine a scenario wherein say an MI/CSK take up a management stake in affairs of say SLC, ZC or even Afghan Cricket. That'd turn the tables entirely.

While leagues do offer monies, I do not see them growing beyond a certain point, as cricket would eventually reach a saturation point. In my past posts, I've mentioned USA and China as bigger markets where cricket (rather the T20 franchisee) system could work wonders. This will spread the game, but don't see it operating beyond the current T20 format.

On the test arena- unless the ICC really puts its foot down and decides that 'enough is enough', things wont really see a sea change. To safeguard their interests, they need to invest in the game, game experience, etc. At present, I do not see the ICC doing anything of that sort. Some may argue that the marketing of the Test/ODI series be left to home boards and broadcasters, I feel, the ICC could try to push some bits at their end as well. Essentially, all roads point towards the striking of balance between T20 leagues and ODI/Tests.

I disagree that test cricket will end soon as you put it a couple of posts earlier but it is already at the stage where many of us real cricket fans feared 20 years ago...almost irrelevant outside of England and Australia, and a cuple of India series (namely against Aus and Eng).

What I mean by this is that most countries play a two test series, at a stretch 3 tests and that's about it. That too with massive gaps between each series, so boards like the PCB, CSA, NZ, SLC etc will play maybe 2 test series a year, totalling no more than 5 tests at best.

The ICC did try and make test cricket more relevant and exciting by bringing in the WTC which introduced context to each test series being played. I think that is a great idea...but by not being brave enough to institute that India must play all opponents assigned to them, ahem Pakistan...and by not implementing a tier system with promotion/regulation, they didn't go as far as they should have and as far as the early drafts for the WTC suggested.

The biggest issue as you point out correctly is that T20 leagues offer lots of money for players on the fringes of the test arena, so not only do we have less test matches, we have less high calibre cricketers taking up the format. It's two death nails that have led to the current landscape.

 

[Bevab]

I disagree that test cricket will end soon as you put it a couple of posts earlier but it is already at the stage where many of us real cricket fans feared 20 years ago...almost irrelevant outside of England and Australia, and a cuple of India series (namely against Aus and Eng).

What I mean by this is that most countries play a two test series, at a stretch 3 tests and that's about it. That too with massive gaps between each series, so boards like the PCB, CSA, NZ, SLC etc will play maybe 2 test series a year, totalling no more than 5 tests at best.

The ICC did try and make test cricket more relevant and exciting by bringing in the WTC which introduced context to each test series being played. I think that is a great idea...but by not being brave enough to institute that India must play all opponents assigned to them, ahem Pakistan...and by not implementing a tier system with promotion/regulation, they didn't go as far as they should have and as far as the early drafts for the WTC suggested.

The biggest issue as you point out correctly is that T20 leagues offer lots of money for players on the fringes of the test arena, so not only do we have less test matches, we have less high calibre cricketers taking up the format. It's two death nails that have led to the current landscape.

Ah yes, test cricket is dying because India refuses to play Pakistan.

Wouldn’t surprise me if you blame one of the Indian cricket team, BCCI or Modi for your toast getting slightly burnt in the morning next.

 

[icyman]

The WTC is a failed concept. Believe we've discussed this quite a few times prior to your joining the forum. Should have, could have-lots of things that the ICC can be held accountable for.

In all honesty, if the council really wanted , they could have made the game interesting by employing a point structure similar to the one used during the Asian Test Championship in 1999. I agree with the relegation/promotion part of it as well. Baffles me why they didn't incorporate this earlier.

 

[icyman]

but by not being brave enough to institute that India must play all opponents assigned to them, ahem Pakistan.

India would have walked out of the series. We don't care if we don't qualify for the WTC Finals. In the eyes of the public, it is a mere trophy. It isn't similar to winning ,say a World Cup or a World T20.

 

[Bevab]

The WTC is a failed concept. Believe we've discussed this quite a few times prior to your joining the forum. Should have, could have-lots of things that the ICC can be held accountable for.

In all honesty, if the council really wanted , they could have made the game interesting by employing a point structure similar to the one used during the Asian Test Championship in 1999. I agree with the relegation/promotion part of it as well. Baffles me why they didn't incorporate this earlier.

Because there’s not much of a financial incentive for the tier two teams to be having test tours against each other without the payday from a big team touring. Unless all of that is covered by the governing body no team would agree to it and I don’t think the bigger sides would be keen on compensating the smaller ones given how myopic cricket administration as a whole is.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2024

India would have walked out of the series. We don't care if we don't qualify for the WTC Finals. In the eyes of the public, it is a mere trophy. It isn't similar to winning ,say a World Cup or a World T20.

He genuinely seems to think that the WTC is a big trophy and that Indian fans are treating it as sour grapes because we haven’t ‘won’ it rather than it being a meaningless concept. The Ashes rightfully exposed how silly some of the points system was.

 

[noducksallowed]

India would have walked out of the series. We don't care if we don't qualify for the WTC Finals. In the eyes of the public, it is a mere trophy. It isn't similar to winning ,say a World Cup or a World T20.

No it's not that easy. You may have forgotten BCCI a few years ago made similar threats about ICC events but backed off when no one listened.

Post automatically merged: Jan 3, 2024

Ah yes, test cricket is dying because India refuses to play Pakistan.

Wouldn’t surprise me if you blame one of the Indian cricket team, BCCI or Modi for your toast getting slightly burnt in the morning next.

I was going to make fun of you BUT I'll respond in a better way and take the higher ground.

I mentioned a couple of reasons for test cricket failing, neither of which was India not playing Pakistan. This is a genuine question, is English your first language?

 

[Bevab]

I was going to make fun of you BUT I'll respond in a better way and take the higher ground.

I mentioned a couple of reasons for test cricket failing, neither of which was India not playing Pakistan. This is a genuine question, is English your first language?

Must be the world’s tiniest hill, that high ground.

 

[noducksallowed]

Must be the world’s tiniest hill, that high ground.

I asked for a reason...because you failed to understand what I had written quite plainly which I assumed was a result of a lack of English comprehension on your part.

If that is not the case, then it seems you're just trying to be funny. Trying being the key word.