India Team Discussion

[NILAYSHAH60]

I won't posting anything on the cricket discussion untill Shastri is removed from the head coach which is 2 years atleast and who knows it may stay till the next world cup.

Good luck everyone on the Shastri - Kohli Rant .

Come on ! Atleast we can watch it for other players if not Shastri-Kohli. You can still enjoy watching Kohli's batting atleast. While the future stars like Shaw, Gill, Pant & Iyer are all players to watch out for. Also Bumrah, Shami, Kuldeep, Chahal aren't going anywhere. We also have bowlers like Saini, Mavi, Nagarkoti, etc. Indian Cricket is not just about Kohli-Shastri, it's lot more than you think.

 

[Villain]

To be honest I don't see a major path-breaking change all of a sudden magic if we had got a different coach, personally I of course don't like Shastri as our head-coach either but honestly in the end it's up to the players who are gonna get us the World Cup this is not to say the coach does not have any influence on the players but he isn't gonna bat or bowl for them. Our players failed to get us through in the WC 2019 how hard is it to digest the fact that they failed along with the management. Why are we blaming the management alone for the WC '19 loss, why not the players who were eventually playing the semi-final? And if you say this management did not back players or gave them confidence by giving them a consistent run then you better check our playing XI of that match we lost or our squad, KL, Rohit, Pant, Pandya, Chahal, Bhuvi, Bumrah, Kedar, Kuldeep and so on.. only DK I believe might have played under pressure as to not knowing will be he picked if he failed. These players were backed up consistently and have been given free run ignoring better options available. And I don't know if people know that the support staff and the selectors have their words too and not the Kohli-Shastri duo which people keep ranting about for months and every failure is considered to be theirs not the players playing? Sanjay Bangar was also part of the decision the decision to play Dhoni(fan of the guy since I don't even remember) down the order, it was a team decision. I'm not a fan of Kohli - the captain in limited overs but he isn't that bad either, he's a decent one but if there are any better options let the better one handle it and I believe it'll only better Kohli's batting game which is what India needs.

Tom Moody would've been a great choice but if you think getting a good coach alone will get you the Cup then you're wrong, the players themselves have to step up.

Losing at the knockouts/finals are nothing new to us as some gents keep ranting about that it is due to management and not the players?, who were the captains/coach when we lost:
2014 WC T20 Final
2015 WC Semi-final
2016 WC T20 Semi-final
2017 CT-Final.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Sanjay Bangar was also part of the decision the decision to play Dhoni(fan of the guy since I don't even remember) down the order, it was a team decision. I'm not a fan of Kohli - the captain in limited overs but he isn't that bad either, he's a decent one but if there are any better options let the better one handle it and I believe it'll only better Kohli's batting game which is what India needs.

I would like to add to this. We have seen Dhoni demoting himself for years when there was a batting collapse be it International Cricket or IPL or whatever form. So I don't buy this logic of Kohli demoting Dhoni in the WC Semi-final cost India. And it actually could've been Dhoni's decision not to come out in case of a collapse in a pressure game ?

 

[Aalay]

https://es.pn/2KN55cu

This is just comedy gold now.

Not surprising at all. Feel bad for Tom Moody. If I'm not wrong this is the second time he has been turned down for the same position and there's nothing wrong in that provided the better candidate won.

4. FOUR tweaking TIMES HE HAS BEEN TURNED DOWN.

Tom applied back in 2007, we hired Gary Kirsten.
He applied in 2016, we hired Anil Kumble
He applied in 2017 once Kumble quit and we hired Ravi Shastri when Ravi wasn't even on the tweaking list of the potential candidates.
He applied again this time around thinking things might be different. Guess what CAC told him? That's right, fearsome tweak off Tom Moody we have Ravi Shastri.

As I said in my last post, I would sue BCCI if I was Tom Moody especially for that 2017 incident.

 

[asprin]

To be honest I don't see a major path-breaking change all of a sudden magic if we had got a different coach, personally I of course don't like Shastri as our head-coach either but honestly in the end it's up to the players who are gonna get us the World Cup this is not to say the coach does not have any influence on the players but he isn't gonna bat or bowl for them. Our players failed to get us through in the WC 2019 how hard is it to digest the fact that they failed along with the management. Why are we blaming the management alone for the WC '19 loss, why not the players who were eventually playing the semi-final? And if you say this management did not back players or gave them confidence by giving them a consistent run then you better check our playing XI of that match we lost or our squad, KL, Rohit, Pant, Pandya, Chahal, Bhuvi, Bumrah, Kedar, Kuldeep and so on.. only DK I believe might have played under pressure as to not knowing will be he picked if he failed. These players were backed up consistently and have been given free run ignoring better options available. And I don't know if people know that the support staff and the selectors have their words too and not the Kohli-Shastri duo which people keep ranting about for months and every failure is considered to be theirs not the players playing? Sanjay Bangar was also part of the decision the decision to play Dhoni(fan of the guy since I don't even remember) down the order, it was a team decision. I'm not a fan of Kohli - the captain in limited overs but he isn't that bad either, he's a decent one but if there are any better options let the better one handle it and I believe it'll only better Kohli's batting game which is what India needs.

Tom Moody would've been a great choice but if you think getting a good coach alone will get you the Cup then you're wrong, the players themselves have to step up.

Losing at the knockouts/finals are nothing new to us as some gents keep ranting about that it is due to management and not the players?, who were the captains/coach when we lost:
2014 WC T20 Final
2015 WC Semi-final
2016 WC T20 Semi-final
2017 CT-Final.

The problem with the Kohli-Shastri duo is two fold:

1. The lack of acknowledgment that something is wrong. According to them, India had a great WC and one bad day cost us the cup. While I do not disagree with that fact, I'm also not oblivious to a trend that India seem to be displaying in knockout matches. It's not rocket science - we are often failing when the stakes are high. And this is something that the celebreated duo refuse to accept.
2. Committing one blunder after another and not learning from them. I think it was LongLiveAbd who had summarized this nicely.

So yes, you're partially right when you say the blame doesn't lie upon the coach and captain alone. But it is also evident that they are the major reason for unsatisfactory/shocking results due to the decisions made by them.

 

[Villain]

The problem with the Kohli-Shastri duo is two fold:

1. The lack of acknowledgment that something is wrong. According to them, India had a great WC and one bad day cost us the cup. While I do not disagree with that fact, I'm also not oblivious to a trend that India seem to be displaying in knockout matches. It's not rocket science - we are often failing when the stakes are high. And this is something that the celebreated duo refuse to accept.
2. Committing one blunder after another and not learning from them. I think it was LongLiveAbd who had summarized this nicely.

So yes, you're partially right when you say the blame doesn't lie upon the coach and captain alone. But it is also evident that they are the major reason for unsatisfactory/shocking results due to the decisions made by them.

Yes, you got my point absolutely right there which was not to blame the management and Captain alone while acknowledging the fact that losing at the knockouts have been an issue for the past few years and the players themselves are equally responsible. It's not that we won't lose a single match if we get a good coach which is the perception right now but having Ravi Shastri as a coach is no help either but I believe we can still win if the players themselves perform well and people look ahead rather than stop supporting the team due to management.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

So many options for batting and bowling coach

Spoiler

I would be pleased to have Paras Mhambrey as the bowling coach for India especially after what he did with India U19 during the 2018 U19 period by backing bowlers like Shivam Mavi and Kamlesh Nagarkoti

Get in Amol Majumdar as the batting coach. He has immense knowledge regarding this aspect of the game.

 

[Aalay]

I don't think they will replace Bharat Arun as the bowling coach. I actually don't mind that because whatever I have heard from our bowlers about him has been very positive and our bowling has been excellent under his watch so I have no problem with him being there.

For batting coach, the reports have been that Vikram Rathour is the favourite to get that position. He wasn't a very good batsman himself but again not all good players make a good coach so If he gets it, I hope he can improve our batting especially in test matches. We really need someone who can work with our test batsmen.

For fielding coach, I have never been a fan of Sridhar but the rumours are that he might be retained. There are only two people who have applied and one being Jonty Rhodes. Jonty hasn't coached any national team but he has worked with MI for almost 8-9 years so I won't mind if he comes in as the fielding coach.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

I don't think they will replace Bharat Arun as the bowling coach. I actually don't mind that because whatever I have heard from our bowlers about him has been very positive and our bowling has been excellent under his watch so I have no problem with him being there.

For batting coach, the reports have been that Vikram Rathour is the favourite to get that position. He wasn't a very good batsman himself but again not all good players make a good coach so If he gets it, I hope he can improve our batting especially in test matches. We really need someone who can work with our test batsmen.

For fielding coach, I have never been a fan of Sridhar but the rumours are that he might be retained. There are only two people who have applied and one being Jonty Rhodes. Jonty hasn't coached any national team but he has worked with MI for almost 8-9 years so I won't mind if he comes in as the fielding coach.

I wasn't aware about the retention policy.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Yesterday I watched a couple of videos on YouTube

One was of India v/s Pakistan in Singer Akai Cup 1997 at Sharjah. I noticed Saba Karim play and I realised his stroke play is so much similar to Rohit Sharma. Is it like Rohit idolized his playing style or there is something to do with both of them being from Mumbai ?

Second video was of Day 2 of England vs India Test at Edgbaston in 2018 where Kohli scored a ton. There was one such shot he played to Ben Stokes where he came few 6-7 feets outside his crease and played a forward defensive shot, you can say that it was an extension of it. I just can't get that shot out of my mind from the time I have watched it. Pure class that was!!

 

[SaiSrini]

Vikram Rathour is set to replace Bangar as batting coach. And I see that Dravid recently wanted Rathour in the NCA. I wonder what magic does Rathour possess? He played only 7 tests for India and was a major flop (similar in ODI's too).

I hope that if Dravid has seen something in him, then there must be something in him. Not surprised by Arun and Sridhar's retention. Arun specifically has been good (or atleast he hasn't spoiled the bowlers).

 

[Villain]

Vikram Rathour is set to replace Bangar as batting coach. And I see that Dravid recently wanted Rathour in the NCA. I wonder what magic does Rathour possess? He played only 7 tests for India and was a major flop (similar in ODI's too).

He has a fantastic FC record, some 11,000 runs at an average of 50.

 

[Bevab]

Vikram Rathour is set to replace Bangar as batting coach. And I see that Dravid recently wanted Rathour in the NCA. I wonder what magic does Rathour possess? He played only 7 tests for India and was a major flop (similar in ODI's too).

I hope that if Dravid has seen something in him, then there must be something in him. Not surprised by Arun and Sridhar's retention. Arun specifically has been good (or atleast he hasn't spoiled the bowlers).

Arun has even lesser credentials on the international and domestic stage but has been one of our best bowling coaches, possibly the first to not ruin any Indian bowler with the preference for accuracy at the expense of pace.

Sridhar has been decent, especially with the way Bumrah and Chahal’s fielding has improved compared to where they were once but our slip catching has been really poor in recent times which is a huge red flag.

 

[SaiSrini]

Interesting idea from Virender Sehwag to suggest Anil Kumble to be the next 'chairman of selectors'. Of course he says it with a rider, saying that the pay scale for the chairman of selectors should increase, in order for Kumble to accept it.

Personally feel that it would be great if Kumble accepts it. However I don't see it happening as the chairman of selectors has to interact a lot with the senior team captain and coach and just imagine Kohli and Shastri working with Anil Kumble, the three of whom share a very infamous history in Indian cricket.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

but our slip catching has been really poor in recent times which is a huge red flag.

It's been nearly the same post 2011 WC. Lack of playing Overseas matches is the reason why we don't have extra-ordinary slip fielders.