India tour of West Indies Aug-Sept 2019

[asprin]

Given India's history with the tail, is it silly to fear another wag? Holder is no muck with the bat and can score a useful 50 here.

 

[Aalay]

A bit surprised to see how people here feel about Ashwin's exclusion. Personally, I believe that it was a harsh but fair decision.

• The pitches in West Indies have changed drastically since the last time India toured. They are a lot more seamer friendly now and have become tougher to bat on. As a result, it makes zero sense to leave an extra pacer for Ashwin especially when they have been very impressive over the last few years. Added to that, West Indies themselves chose to go in with an all-rounder as their only spinner, choosing to omit Cornwall for a very average Cummins.

Agree with you that WI pitches have become a lot more seamer friendly recently but it will still assist the spinners in the later part of the game. The series that WI played against England earlier this year, Moeen Ali was the second highest wicket taker in it. You are definitely not going to leave out a seamer but you are bringing Ashwin in for Vihari.

Four full-time bowlers are more than enough for a test match

I disagree on this unless you are playing on a pitch which is bowler friendly. This pitch is not that bowler friendly, in-fact it is pretty up and down sort of surface. Our captain's strategy when he took over the captaincy in test format was to play 5 bowlers because that is the key to getting 20 wickets especially if you are playing on flat surfaces. Now we have a luxury of Hardik Pandya who can play the all-rounder role. Yes, Ashwin hasn't been the best with bat but I think he can still bat at number 8 with Jadeja at 7 because we don't have Hardik in this squad at the moment.

Test cricket is no place for those who wouldn't make it on the basis of one talent alone and Ashwin's role as another spinner even if he is world class is not required on a pitch like this.

I would love to have a world class spinner like Ashwin on this pitch. Let me make this clear again, I am looking at Ashwin as our number 1 spin bowler in test format. Our drunk coach said Kuldeep is number 1 spinner for India in away test matches after he took a five-fer in Sydney. Guess who plays the next away test as the number 1 spinner? Jadeja. I am not against Jadeja but I would rather see Ashwin as the premium spinner especially with the record he has against WI and the kind of form he is coming in with in county cricket.

I'm happy that we seem to have moved on from him being an indispensable option overseas and to have Jadeja play as the frontline spinner with our pacers being good enough to be the primary wicket taking options.

If your issue with Ashwin is that he can't control one end when pitches are not helping his bowling then let me tell you that he has better economy than Jadeja in both England and Australia last year. Even though we know that after the first test in England, he was injured and shouldn't have played another game until he got fully fit.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Agree with you that WI pitches have become a lot more seamer friendly recently but it will still assist the spinners in the later part of the game. The series that WI played against England earlier this year, Moeen Ali was the second highest wicket taker in it. You are definitely not going to leave out a seamer but you are bringing Ashwin in for Vihari.



I disagree on this unless you are playing on a pitch which is bowler friendly. This pitch is not that bowler friendly, in-fact it is pretty up and down sort of surface. Our captain's strategy when he took over the captaincy in test format was to play 5 bowlers because that is the key to getting 20 wickets especially if you are playing on flat surfaces. Now we have a luxury of Hardik Pandya who can play the all-rounder role. Yes, Ashwin hasn't been the best with bat but I think he can still bat at number 8 with Jadeja at 7 because we don't have Hardik in this squad at the moment.


I would love to have a world class spinner like Ashwin on this pitch. Let me make this clear again, I am looking at Ashwin as our number 1 spin bowler in test format. Our drunk coach said Kuldeep is number 1 spinner for India in away test matches after he took a five-fer in Sydney. Guess who plays the next away test as the number 1 spinner? Jadeja. I am not against Jadeja but I would rather see Ashwin as the premium spinner especially with the record he has against WI and the kind of form he is coming in with in county cricket.




If your issue with Ashwin is that he can't control one end when pitches are not helping his bowling then let me tell you that he has better economy than Jadeja in both England and Australia last year. Even though we know that after the first test in England, he was injured and shouldn't have played another game until he got fully fit.

I still don't mind Ashwin not playing unless we are getting a good result. You can see even Australia played their first Test in the on-going Ashes series without their best bowler for these conditions (Josh Hazelwood) and they still managed to win it by a comprehensive margin. You don't always have to see what the player is capable of but also see the team balance. Had we been a batsman short on this surface we wouldn't have managed even 250.

 

[asprin]

What is it with the overnight batsmen losing their wicket very early the next day? I wonder how much we will get if another wicket falls.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

What is it with the overnight batsmen losing their wicket very early the next day? I wonder how much we will get if another wicket falls.

The fact is bowlers have worked out the Batsman overnight with the technology they have these days. Also they are fresh to execute their plans early morning. The batsman also aren't settled at the crease after such a long break they had. So that is the reason they lose their wicket. I am sure Kohli would've been dismissed out LBW while he shuffled outside off stump to flick an in-swinger shaping in from outside off-stump.

Edit- So he got out caught at cover but off a similar shot that I thought.

 

[Aalay]

For all the talk about how good Indian players are against spin bowlers, in reality we are quite shit especially against finger spinners. We make Moeen Ali look like Murlitharan, we have struggled against Lyon and we are struggling against Roston Chase. I mean Chase is a decent defensive bowler but the way we have played against Chase is just atrocious.

Very happy with the way Rahane has played so far in this match. Yes he has got a bit lucky but you need that luck when you are coming from a bad patch. I really hope this can boost his confidence and we can see the old Rahane from here on. Vihari has played a very good supporting role to Rahane and he has played at a very decent pace which has kept the scoreboard moving. Declaring with the lead of 400 should be enough I think.

 

[asprin]

^ Agree with the above. Chase is not a primary spinner. He is a batsman who can bowl, very much like Moin Ali. And the fact that he is getting genuine batsmen and not lower order wickets says something about our ability to play spin.


India should declare as soon as Vihari reaches 100 or gets out in the process. Pitch seems to have eased a bit and we are gonna need overs and time to bowl WI out.

 

[Villain]

A good well deserved century for Rahane, should help is confidence going forward. Vihari fell just seven runs short off his debut international century, a very good innings from him as well. We need more like him in the team. At the moment we're in control, have to bowl exceptionally well and get the remaining wickets to start the Championship with a win.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

I still don't mind Ashwin not playing unless we are getting a good result. You can see even Australia played their first Test in the on-going Ashes series without their best bowler for these conditions (Josh Hazelwood) and they still managed to win it by a comprehensive margin. You don't always have to see what the player is capable of but also see the team balance. Had we been a batsman short on this surface we wouldn't have managed even 250.

Why don't we drop Virat Kohli then for the next test? If we win the test match, it's fine. No?

Your arguments are not supported with facts. Ashwin is a batsman in his own right in test matches and one of undisputed pedigree in these condition against this opposition. It will be nice, if you can't agree with people who are providing arguments with supported facts then to at least show respect for their opinion and not make silly claims like this.

Just because Australia won the first test match, it doesn't make it the right decision as I said in the Ashes thread back then.

 

[Aalay]

Well that was quick. Why did they not send Roston Chase who has clearly looked like their best batsman in the first inning.

 

[Villain]

WI 15/5... what did just happen? I was expecting this game to go till the last day at least.

 

[Bevab]

For all the talk about how good Indian players are against spin bowlers, in reality we are quite shit especially against finger spinners. We make Moeen Ali look like Murlitharan, we have struggled against Lyon and we are struggling against Roston Chase. I mean Chase is a decent defensive bowler but the way we have played against Chase is just atrocious.

The legacy of the team from 2000s has ensured that reputation still remains intact. It has been a long standing issue with this current side and a much more obvious weakness in ODIs and T20s given how important wrist spinners are there. Almost every one of our batsmen has some sort of weakness to one particular type of spin delivery (Kohli vs googlies, Dhawan vs off spin for example) and the only established players that one can safely call as good versus spin are Pandya and Pujara at the moment.[DOUBLEPOST=1566757777][/DOUBLEPOST]Well, that is some proper class bowling. Makes me so happy to see an Indian pace attack be this good overseas.

 

[SaiSrini]

That is some smashing. I thought that with the wicket easing out, this would be an interesting chase from the West Indies and I had even thought that a draw could be very possible. But this has been really shocking. I'd love to watch the highlights. Was it really amazing bowling or just plain shocking capitulation from West Indies?

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Why don't we drop Virat Kohli then for the next test? If we win the test match, it's fine. No?

Your arguments are not supported with facts. Ashwin is a batsman in his own right in test matches and one of undisputed pedigree in these condition against this opposition. It will be nice, if you can't agree with people who are providing arguments with supported facts then to at least show respect for their opinion and not make silly claims like this.

Just because Australia won the first test match, it doesn't make it the right decision as I said in the Ashes thread back then.

Blah blah blah, whatever. If you have problem with my posts then use ignore feature.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Blah blah blah, whatever. If you have problem with my posts then use ignore feature.

Really? That's your response? I just offered a simple comparison to make you understand something and you again took it personally and think blocking each other is a solution? Just trying to make you see things you ignore.