Jan 3-7: 5th Test: Australia v England at Sydney

[Owzat]

I'm a little surprised Collingwood has announced his retirement during his free ride through the Ashes. A whopping 83 runs in the series, would have been more decent of him if he had retired after the 3rd Test, when he should have been dropped anyway, with 62 runs from four innings @ 15.50

As for the Test, well the aussies are going down without much of a fight, in a match where three England batsmen made hundreds so far only one aussie in two innings has made a fifty. Three aussie batsmen have reached 30 but not gone on beyond 53, that makes it eight in the match. I think the fact that Hilfenhaus has been very average and been retained, likewise Clarke and that Smith should come in and be not only wicketless but also demoted below the keeper probably typifies this series.

No matter what War says, these batsmen aren't anything like as good as past aussie batsmen, the bowlers pale in the shadow of past aussie quicks even if you take the likes of McDermott, Gillespie and bowlers of that level rather than McGrath. Siddle has barely taken a wicket outside of his two 6wis, Hilfenhaus may have added a couple of wickets to his tally but seven expensive wickets don't lie - over five Tests don't forget, plenty of chances to take wickets. The spinner situation is a running joke, I'd retire if I was Hauritz to teach the aussies a lesson. They didn't find a better option than Hauritz, what made them think they would?

The aussies need a rethink and a rebuild, the batting needs to be addressed and they need to find two new bowlers minimum. While it might seem like Hussey should retire, I don't think the aussies can afford that right now. He needs to stay on a couple of years while younger players are brought in. They desperately need Clarke to find form, Ponting too, although Ponting is even older than Hussey!

 

[sami ullah khan]

Isn't that what Hauritz does?

Nah he is different He does it with the right hand

 

[Collingwood50]

Amazing interview by Colly

and don't be ridiculous, today was perfect. Who would have got out Hussey?

 

[War]

I agree that they have the ability and potential to be good bowlers and have shown that in their international careers previously but I don't think they've done that anywhere near as consistently as they should have done.

Which is basically my point.

I think Bresnan has done a pretty good job tbh as I said in that other post.

Ye no doubt he has & has probaly surprised a few. My simple shock is the fact that he has been able to cause AUS bats so much problem in the last two test mainly because of the hint of reverse-swing he has gotten. While the AUS bowlers (all which are better than Bresnan lets not kid ourselves) who can bowl reverse haven't been able to get the ball to do that. Just distgusting.

I guess we'll just have to wait and see but I think that the Aussie pace attack is a little overrated and this is shown by their averages.

Well that would depend on how you have heard them rated. Since id say my view on what most people have said about them in recent times, would suggest that they have always been rated fairly accurately.

Yep, I think KP is nearing that level now. However, even as one of his biggest fans I'll be a little cautious about this return to top form. No doubt he's got all the ability in the world but he doesn't do it justice at times.

I guess KP brash style of batting which would cause him to play the odd shot that may have us scratching our heads may be a feature of his career forever. But he certainly has the aura of a great/big name as much as Lara, Tendy, Ponting would have when they would come to the crease.

Yep, for sure Flintoff would make this an even stronger team. An all rounder is probably all that's missing (if anything).

Missing with be too strong a word i guess. Since with Anderson proving to be a bowler for all conditions with his mastering reverse-swing this Ashes & Swann slowly becoming ENGs best offie since Laker, its prety much a 4-man attack for all conditions now. Just that if Flintoff where around it would be more lethal.

De Wet is still a bit of an unknown. Sure, he impressed vs England but we've seen far too little of him to convince us that he's capable of replicating that consistently. Tahir is a complete unknown. He hasn't played any international cricket yet so I'll hold my judgment on him.

Well ive seen De Wet in county cricket before he played tests last year & im pretty confrotable with his ability to be a consistent threat in test level, if he is allowed to played.

Same thing goes for Tahir really. But fine if you wish to take the conservative approach & want to wait & see them play & perform to rate them, no issue.

Agreed on the back up though. I don't think you can call McLaren real quality. He's steady. Kuhn still hasn't played international cricket but while he may be a better batsman than Boucher, his keeping is said to be worse. Duminy also has to come back and prove that he's sorted out those technical deficiencies.

McLaren reminds of Craig Matthews. The seamer who did the donkey work in SA 4-man pace attack of the mid 90s which at times was Donald/Pollock or De Villiers/McMillan/Matthews.

Could see McLaren doing a similar role in current SA 4-man attack of Steyn/Morkel/McLaren/Kallis. That is if the SA selectors decide to go down this route.

Yes Kuhn is the better bat than Boucher, but the wrose keeper. But that doesn't mean his keeping is bad or sloopy to be fair.

No doubt on Dumminy. But he is back-up still & remember SA has other guys like Rudolph, Russou, Valdair, Ingram, Elgar around too which is better than ENGs batting depth quality which basically is just Morgan & Hildreth.

I just mentioned JP since of course since he coloured & talented & knowing how things go down in SA. He is gonna stay as the next best batsman to be chosen if Prince/Petersen fails, even if any of those other guys outperform him domestically.

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No matter what War says, these batsmen aren't anything like as good as past aussie batsmen, the bowlers pale in the shadow of past aussie quicks even if you take the likes of McDermott, Gillespie and bowlers of that level rather than McGrath. Siddle has barely taken a wicket outside of his two 6wis, Hilfenhaus may have added a couple of wickets to his tally but seven expensive wickets don't lie - over five Tests don't forget, plenty of chances to take wickets. The spinner situation is a running joke, I'd retire if I was Hauritz to teach the aussies a lesson. They didn't find a better option than Hauritz, what made them think they would?!

Holddd it there uncle. I never once said anything about the AUS batsmen. Especially comparing them to past AUS batsmen of the 95-2006/07 glory days. My talk has always been abt the bowling stocks.

If you want to compare the current quicks to the likes of McDermott & Gillespie. Bollinger at least has the ability to reach those levels & maybe Johnson & Siddle if they become more consistent.

Harris if he can be fit also could become another 2-3 year wonder like Stuart Clark was from 2006-2009.

I'm banning myself from talking abt Hauritz also.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

Gonna have to get up at 4AM tomorrow now, I want to see these final 3 wickets fall and England win the series live.

 

[ferg512]

Its actually quite amazing how Australia have just folded like this. They were always going to have problems bringing people in and out and not having a settled lineup like England. I feel that if they did have Katich it would've made quite a difference. It really has been quite sad how bad the Aussies are now. All they should do is try and get some tours to Bangladesh and the West Indies or something. Although, things are not going to get any easier. Playing Sri Lanka away and then India at home, there isn't too much time to rebuild.

Ponting most definitely will retire between now and the Sri Lankan tests. I just can't see him staying on. Then again he didn't he say something at the end of the last Ashes about how he wanted to play the next series in England?

I heard people say Hildreth could come in for Collingwood, but it will most certainly be Morgan won't it??

 

[formula1man]

Hughes and Smith needs to go.

 

[StinkyBoHoon]

Surely KP is on that level?. Plus once he keeps improving Swann will be pretty soon.

ENG would look superb & id be calling them the best already if Flintoff where around batting @ 6.

on these bits, I would honestly say no.

KP is an attractive man-boy cricketer. he'll have good series' and bad series', but muralitharan/tendulkar/ponting/kallis type? that's far too rich praise for someone who goes in and out of form like KP. was he still 26 or what yeah, you could say he will mature in to that, but he actually should be leading the english middle order, and he just doesn't.

and I don't think swann will improve much, honestly looking at his record he's struggles a little once the opposition has had a little more quality. a great player to have in your side with his personality and there's teams that would kill for a good spinner, but he's certainly not any more than that.

 

[barmyarmy]

Just pause for thought.
Swann has taken fewer wickets at a worse average than Johnson (albeit with a much better economy rate).

 

[Themer]

The economy rate is the big thing here though. Johnson goes for so many runs that he allows pressure being built at the other end to completely dissipate as he's going to the boundary. In contrast to when Swann has sat in and created wickets at the other end such as for Bresnan in the other test. Additionally pitches haven't been spin friendly at all in fact they have been seamer friendly on quite a few occasions.

 

[Will Browne]

Johnson at times purely takes wickets because of his sheer unpredictability.He'll bowl you a bouncer at your head, a short and wide ball, then a half volley on leg stump.

 

[War]

Ponting most definitely will retire between now and the Sri Lankan tests. I just can't see him staying on. Then again he didn't he say something at the end of the last Ashes about how he wanted to play the next series in England?

A good world cup performance for Ponting & AUS & he should certainly stay on.

I heard people say Hildreth could come in for Collingwood, but it will most certainly be Morgan won't it??

Ye should be & most likely will be Morgan.

 

[barmyarmy]

The economy rate is the big thing here though. Johnson goes for so many runs that he allows pressure being built at the other end to completely dissipate as he's going to the boundary. In contrast to when Swann has sat in and created wickets at the other end such as for Bresnan in the other test. Additionally pitches haven't been spin friendly at all in fact they have been seamer friendly on quite a few occasions.

Oh I agree that Swann has had a better series; I'm always intrigued by when the stats challenge our perceptions though.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

As someone who grew up watching England get roundly thrashed by the Aussies in particular and everyone else in general (both home and away), I can't get enough of seeing us rack up 500+ scores and then bowl the opposition out cheaply, coupled with absolutely World class fielding. This is a golden age in English cricket and most of the players are young enough for it to go on for years - and boy is it going to be fun!

 

[War]

on these bits, I would honestly say no.

KP is an attractive man-boy cricketer. he'll have good series' and bad series', but muralitharan/tendulkar/ponting/kallis type? that's far too rich praise for someone who goes in and out of form like KP. was he still 26 or what yeah, you could say he will mature in to that, but he actually should be leading the english middle order, and he just doesn't.

KP doesn't go in & out of form though. Between his debut in the 2005 Ashes - IND 2008 when he had & lost the captaincy. KP was very consistent & was being mentioned on level of a great batsmen. Even cricinfo during this period picked him in the greatest ENG all-time XI.

Its just in that before this Ashes a combination of him losing the captaincy in that dirty way & the injury he suffered during the 2009 Ashes, affected his run scoring for the last 18 months.

But in the current Ashes he is clearly back to somewhere near that 2005-2008/09 form.

and I don't think swann will improve much, honestly looking at his record he's struggles a little once the opposition has had a little more quality. a great player to have in your side with his personality and there's teams that would kill for a good spinner, but he's certainly not any more than that.

That hasn't happened in Swann's career to date since he started peaking vs South Africa last winder.