Need For Speed? - What's your opinion...

[QuickFire]

Hi There,

I am still using a Cyrix MII processor with no 3D graphics card at all and even then I can easily play BLC. But I know very well that the same won't happen with Cricket 2002. So, I have decided to upgrade my machine as soon as possible.

I am planning for a P4 1.3 GHz processor but along with that I will have to upgrade my motherboard and buy a graphics card as well. Someone told me to go for a Pentium 4 1.6 GHz along with the DFI NB70-SC motherboard. This combo along with a GeForce2 MX 400 class graphic card will be enough to take care of most games at a decent resolution.

But I want an economical solution to this may be a motherboard with built in 3D graphics card. If anyone of you have any idea on this, please help me out as soon as possible and suggest your choice as well. I can't even wait now to try out the Cricket 2002 Demo...

Regards,
QuickFire.

 

[Atul]

Well I'll suggest that you dont go for a P4 at all. Athlon XP is the real thing. If you look at real world performance of both Athlon XP and P4 (like frames per second in Quake III eg.) you'll see that Ath XP is way more powerful than a P4 at nearly half that price. And if you go for an Athln XP with a Gigabyte motherboard you will still save so much money over P4 that you can go for a decent Geforce2 graphics card as well.
See this AMD page
and this one too!

 

[QuickFire]

Hi Atul,

I think you're absolutely correct on the point that Athlon XP are cheaper in comparison to their P4 counterparts but then also AMD processors such as Athlon XP are known for their overheating problems. Also, I have heard that P4 is ahead of Athlon XP in terms of gaming performance which means that P4 based systems turn out more FPS while playing games like Quake III and all that. Athlon XP based systems are ahead on raw performance best for power hungry applications like Adobe Photoshop 7.0 and such...

Anyway, I am not an expert on all these things and if I am wrong on any of the above points, please point it out. Also, it will be nice if anyone of you can suggest a good processor & an integrated motherboard (inbuilt 3D accelerated graphics and sound) combination within Rs. 10000 (Indian Currency).

Regards,
QuickFire.

 

[Anonymous]

RS 10000?
u can't get a p4 comp.
list out ur current comp details.
if u want to go for p4 it could end up at above RS 17,000
u have u change ur psu,=rs 900
go for p4 1.6b(northwood with 512 kb) rs 8000
go for gigabyte mobe with ddr or sdr(ddr will be costly)(comes with onboard sound.
or go for cheap brands like,vesta,mercury,krpton
sdr=rs 67xx
ddr ram 128mb is RS 2500
till now no p4 mobe comes with onboard agp.(u have u select a desent graphics card like gf2mx400.

there may also problem with ur case.it should be atx for p4

 

[QuickFire]

Hi its me,

Thanks for your post. The current configuration of my PC is very minimal & in fact its one of the lowest end PCs around. That's why I am considering an update this time. Anyway, its something like -

IBM/Cyrix MII 300 MHz Processor
Socket 7 Based Motherboard (VIA Chipset)
Cabinet with AT power supply
128 MB SDRAM
Onboard Sound/Graphics (4MB shared)

I am sure that in any case, I will have to change my motherboard & processor. But I'm still not sure of upgrading to a DDR SDRAM or RDRAM. This will put serious pressure on my budget (which is about Rs.10000). I am thinking of retaining my SDRAM modules. A motherboard from Gigabyte will be fine but I'll still prefer the one with integrated sound & 3D graphics accelerator. Also, which processor will be better, AMD Athlon XP or Pentium 4 (still confused?) as both have their own advantages and disadvantages. Since, my budget is very limited, I may go in for an AMD based system. Any ideas please..

What about graphics card? If I don't find an integrated solution, I'll prefer GeForce2 MX 400 as I can't afford any more than that.

If you have any bit of idea or knowledge on any of the above mentioned components, please share your views and help me out.

Thanks & Regards,
QuickFire. :P

 

[Anonymous]

again quickfire.RS 10000 is not enough for a amdxp or a p4 comp.
u can take out.
cd drive
fdd drive
hdd drive.
128mb sdram(if its pc133)
from ur old comp.
u have change ur Cabinet and psu to minimum 300w
for RS 10000 u can onli get a p3 or celeron comp.

note4 min processor costs about 6500+

 

[QuickFire]

Hi,

Now, you know every details of my PC (please refer to the posts above) and also know my budget (about Rs.10000 - Rs.12000).

So, please list out the set of components which you think I should upgrade to such as the motherboard, graphics card, processor & speed, cabinet etc. keeping in mind the budget, of course.

I want a machine so that I can play all the current available 3D games at descent frame rates. Please list the expected prices alongside each component for a rough estimation of the total amount.

Kindly keep posting and help me out. I am still in a great deal of confusion. I can't figure out a balance between price and performance. If anyone can do that for me, please...

Regards,
QuickFire.

 

[Atul]

Sorry , but I'll again say that AthXP is much better.

P4 is ahead of Athlon XP in terms of gaming performance which means that P4 based systems turn out more FPS while playing games like Quake III and all that. Athlon XP based systems are ahead on raw performance best for power hungry applications like Adobe Photoshop 7.0 and such...

AthXp beats P4 hands down in raw performance. For gaming, AthXP is much much better than P4. Its true that some benchmarks give a better score to P4 in apps like Photoshop. But then again you have to makwe sure what you need your PC for, absolute performane in Quake III or great speeds in Photoshop. if former than Athl0nXP is the thing for you.



PS: Don't just beleive me search for a performance comparison betweenP4 and ArthlinXp on the net.

 

[Atul]

In any case, here is a comparison between various processors, as done by Digital Media Test & Research Center of Digit magazine and published in January 2002 issue of Digit.

Business Performance

Content Creation Winstone 2001

AthlonXP 1800+ 81.6
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 78.6
Athlon 1.4GHz 75.8
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 63.7
Duron 1.1Ghz 61.2
Celeron 1.2 GHz 61.2

Business Winstone 2001

AthlonXP 1800+ 59.5
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 57.7
Athlon 1.4GHz 57.8
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 49.3
Duron 1.1Ghz 45.0
Celeron 1.2 GHz 51.5

Gaming Performance

Quake III Arena (Normal Mode) (Demo Four) (fps)

AthlonXP 1800+ 276.4
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 314.1
Athlon 1.4GHz 266.7
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 202.1
Duron 1.1Ghz 196
Celeron 1.2 GHz 179.3

Quake III Arena (High Detail mode)

AthlonXP 1800+ 264.5
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 273
Athlon 1.4GHz 252.2
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 199.5
Duron 1.1Ghz 193.5
Celeron 1.2 GHz 178.4




3D Mark 2001

AthlonXP 1800+ 7060
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 6960
Athlon 1.4GHz 6765
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 5752
Duron 1.1Ghz 5579
Celeron 1.2 GHz 5470

Multimedia Performance

Video Encoding (seconds) (lower the better)

AthlonXP 1800+ 99
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 111
Athlon 1.4GHz 108
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 149
Duron 1.1Ghz 141
Celeron 1.2 GHz 164


Professional Applications

Adobe Photoshop 6.01
(21 filters) (seconds) (lower the better)

AthlonXP 1800+ 63.10
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 68.3
Athlon 1.4GHz 71.6
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 75.8
Duron 1.1Ghz 84.8
Celeron 1.2 GHz 76.4

POV Ray
3.1g (chess 2) (seconds) (lower the better)

AthlonXP 1800+ 440
Pentium 4 2.0GHz 516
Athlon 1.4GHz 462
Pentium III / T 1.13 GHz 618
Duron 1.1Ghz 586
Celeron 1.2 GHz 584

Now before you start firing off those hate posts on how fast the P4 is in Quake III, remember that the comparison is between Athlon XP 1800+ which runs at 1.53 GHz and Pentium 4 whch is running on 2 GHz. Still the Athlon is giving it some serious competition. Further, while a P4 2GHz is priced at around Rs. 27,500, the Athlon XP 1800+ is about Rs. 13,500. What you save here, you can easily invest in cool graphics and memory sub-systems, which will surely overtake a P4 system taken together.
I would say this, if you were really a rich bloke, buy a P4 but if you are unfortunately (like me) an average fellow, whose folks at home give a cold stare when you ask money for system upgrade, then go for an Athlon.
?and the argument continues?????????????.



Edited By Atul on May 09 2002 at 08:37

 

[Atul]

i've put up the complete test results at
http://www.geocities.com/atulybx/bench.htm
which contains a comparison between Athlon XP 1800+ 1.53 GHz, Athlon XP 1600+ 1.4 GHz, Athlon XP 1500+ 1.33 GHz, Pentium 4 2.0GHz, Pentium 4 1.7GHz, Pentium 4 1.5Ghz, Athlon 1.4GHz, Athlon 1.13GHz, PentiumIII/T 1.13GHz, Pentium III 800MHz, Pentium III 700MHz, Duron 1.1GHz, Duron 900MHz, Celeron 1.2GHz, and Celeron 800 MHz.

 

[QuickFire]

Hi Atul,

Thanks for the processor test results. I have seen the results and AMD processors really look impressive. Please clarify if there's any overheating issues etc. with AMD processors.

Also, suggest a good economical combination of processor, motherboard and graphics card (integrated 3D garaphics will be best for me. Isn't it?). What you think of integrated 3D graphics? I know they show poor performance in comparison to GPU but then they save your money. Don't they?

Regards,
QuickFire. :P

 

[Atul]

I'm myself upgrading my system and looking for a good CPU-mobo for around Rs.10,000 - Rs. 12,000. So most probably I'll go for an Athlon (not AthXP) with a VIA based mb. But the problem I'm facing is that not many vendors are dealing in AMD. And also the overheating issue is there as well. Some guy said in Digit magazine letter to editor that AMD processors don't have a transistor that automatically cuts off (kinda switches off) the processor and saves it from burning, which a Pentium has.
At the same time, there are many user reviews which say that they never had a trouble of AMD heating up even while using the PC at room temp (provided you inevest in good quality cooling system,ie the heatsink and the fan, I assume).
Once I was troubleshooting a friend's computer and forgot to plug in the power wires for the processor heat sink. The Processor (PIII 450) heated up and stopped working. Even then I didn't remember this ('cos I didn't know the cause of stopping was heat) and tried to 'reset' the computer 2-3 times. I found it out when again opened the cabinet. The point I want to make is that the Pentium survived that kind of treatment. Whether an AMD does or not, I'm not sure since I've never used an AMD system nor any of my friend has.
But I've not given up and still trying to find out the ideal motherboard for Athlon and the heat isuue. I'll keep you posted.

 

[QuickFire]

Hi,

Thanks a lot and I hope you'll definitely find out a solution to this soon. Don't forget me though... Please keep me posted on this.

If anyone else have any idea on this, please share your ideas here.

Regards,
QuickFire.

 

[ritwikgames]

hi guys,

quickfire perhaps you can try a p3{much cheaper than a p4 and still gives excellent performance} with an 810e motherboard.I can run all my games comfortably with that but in low detail.Also,you can have a p3 800 with an 810e{or something else with integrated sound}motherboard and buy a geforce mx gfx card for about 4500-6000{less if you buy from the grey market}.You can continue using your old ram,hdd,floppy,cd drive,keyboard and mouse etc.

I suggest this in keeping with your budget of 10000.



Edited By ritwikgames on May 09 2002 at 21:08

 

[QuickFire]

Hi Ritwik,

Yes, you're right I could have easily gone for a P3 solution but I'm afraid that this is not the time to go for a P3.

It may seem alright for the moment but think of the situation after only a year, I'll not be able to upgrade my CPU to a P4. I'll have to change my motherboard yet again. That's the main problem...

I'm thinking of going for a AMD Duron processor which is equivalent to P3 in performance and uses the Socket A interface, the same used by AMD Athlon processors which solves the compatibility problem for the future upgrades.

Regards,
QuickFire.