Papa_Smurf
International Cricketer
Ha, true 
Greatest Sportsmen of All Time
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pcfan123
Guest
agree 100%
Nobody dominated baseball the way Bradman dominated cricket.
Bradman should be the only cricket mention by a country mile in the list. He should be in the list simply because the next best guy has barely accomplished half of what the Don did.
Fenil
PC Cricket Leagues Legend
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Disagree. Don Bradman deserves to be in cricket and how come you think Messi is best? Even Sunil Chhetri has more goals to his name for his country than Messi if I'm not wrong.
puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
I think I could categorically state that had Messi been up against the mighty defences of Pakistan, Tajikstan, Vietnam and Malasia for his last 50 internationals, he'd quite likely have more goals than that
Fenil
PC Cricket Leagues Legend
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I think I could categorically state that had Messi been up against the mighty defences of Pakistan, Tajikstan, Vietnam and Malasia for his last 50 internationals, he'd quite likely have more goals than that
So true.
Even then it won't make Messi the best ever footballer.
Lee1981
International Coach
So true.
What would you bloody know?..
After your last post about Messi not being as good as some tit I've never heard of your opinion aint worth f all
My opinion is Messi is best player ever and from what I read and watched last season a lot of respected ex pro's rate Messi the best also.
It's like I said Scott Parker is the best player ever.
Bevab
Staff Member
So true.
73 goals and 29 assists in a single season. That does make him one of the best.
Still, maybe experience would be needed before he is called the best.
puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
Thing is Maradona still sits ahead of him because of firing Argentina almost single handedly to the World Cup. He also played for a range of clubs that weren't all the best teams in the world and took them to titles.
Pele as well scored over 1000 club goals, won international titles and delivered brilliance over an entire career. Messi will surely join them when he reaches the end of his career, but for now he still must continue to deliver over the next half as well.
Pele as well scored over 1000 club goals, won international titles and delivered brilliance over an entire career. Messi will surely join them when he reaches the end of his career, but for now he still must continue to deliver over the next half as well.
cricket_icon
International Cricketer
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Good posts guys. I didn't include Johnson in my lists because I think Lewis and Owens were better than him and Bolt is on his way to surpassing him, if he hasn't already.
It's good to see so many Bradman fans here and he was undoubtedly one of the greatest batsmen ever but he can not be the only cricketer ever because there was that one bloke from the West Indies who even many Aussies regard as the best cricketer ever.
In terms of Messi, I'm on the side of those who say "let's wait and see". He is a remarkable player, with a plethora of cups at club level and his broken almost every Barcelona goal scoring record I can think of. But, he is yet to prove himself on the biggest stage of all, the world cup, his last was abysmal, I don't think he scored a single goal, add to that 1 goal in 20 internationals in the build up to the 2010 tournament and you have a player who can't yet be compared to the likes of Pele, Maradonna and imo even the Ronaldo's (Brazilian) and Zidanes. Messi has a ways to go.
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This is in response to Puddleduck.
Many say Robinson was the greater fighter, I wouldn't really argue with them but for me it is Ali. He was the greatest heavyweight of them all, which is historically the greatest and most important of boxing's weight classes. That speaks volumes in itself. If we want to go into details, he was the best of the best, beating every single one of the greatest heavyweights in the world, in that divisions golden era. The fact that he is the only man to ever stop Foreman, beat Liston at just 22, beat Frazier twice, win the heavyweight championship 3 times, only losing it in the ring once, beat Norton, Shavers (regarded by many as p4p the hardest hitting fighter ever), and a whole bunch of top contenders including Chuvalo, Ellis, Young, Quarry and co. That puts him heads and shoulders above almost every fighter ever (barring Pep, Robinson and Armstrong). Good fact you should know, no heavyweight in history has beaten as many HOFers as Ali and only one boxer has done so (Robinson).
Now onto your at times misguided (at least I hope it's misguided and not purposeful) vision of what Ali did to Frazier. First of all, Frazier was no saint, in the build up to their first fight Frazier often times refused to call Ali by his then real name, much like Terrel had done years earlier, prompting Ali to call Frazier an "Uncle Tom". At no point did Ali ever lead a "lynch mob" to Fraziers house, don't be ridiculous. I know for a fact he bombarded Liston at his home with some rather childish japes, not sure if he went to Fraziers house to do that as well but it was all part of the promotion and often times, in front of the camera, Frazier was all too happy to oblige, knowing that the fight would make more money. There was a time when I think Ali went too far, in Manila, with the whole "Gorilla" chant which can be thought of as racist but it wasn't. He had a nick name for every guy he fought, calling Foreman the Mummy and Liston the bear (he even called Liston ugly, ohhh that's so bad). Ali, straight after their marathon battle in Manila apologised to Frazier and from Ali's part there was no bad blood.
Frazier however, was sadly, till his last days, a very bitter and at times duplicitous man. On camera, when ever Ali was about, he would say all is well and good and he loved the man, when Ali was gone, most famously in his documentary, The Thriller in Manila, he wished Ali dead and laughed at his disease, something even his son found uncomfortable.
Can't believe I even bothered arguing with you on this, seeing as your the new breed of Ali hater but the world remembers Ali as a hero and no one in particular really cares about the misguided, ignorant and most times, lying minority. I firmly hope your in the misguided category.
It's good to see so many Bradman fans here and he was undoubtedly one of the greatest batsmen ever but he can not be the only cricketer ever because there was that one bloke from the West Indies who even many Aussies regard as the best cricketer ever.
In terms of Messi, I'm on the side of those who say "let's wait and see". He is a remarkable player, with a plethora of cups at club level and his broken almost every Barcelona goal scoring record I can think of. But, he is yet to prove himself on the biggest stage of all, the world cup, his last was abysmal, I don't think he scored a single goal, add to that 1 goal in 20 internationals in the build up to the 2010 tournament and you have a player who can't yet be compared to the likes of Pele, Maradonna and imo even the Ronaldo's (Brazilian) and Zidanes. Messi has a ways to go.
----------
This is in response to Puddleduck.
Many say Robinson was the greater fighter, I wouldn't really argue with them but for me it is Ali. He was the greatest heavyweight of them all, which is historically the greatest and most important of boxing's weight classes. That speaks volumes in itself. If we want to go into details, he was the best of the best, beating every single one of the greatest heavyweights in the world, in that divisions golden era. The fact that he is the only man to ever stop Foreman, beat Liston at just 22, beat Frazier twice, win the heavyweight championship 3 times, only losing it in the ring once, beat Norton, Shavers (regarded by many as p4p the hardest hitting fighter ever), and a whole bunch of top contenders including Chuvalo, Ellis, Young, Quarry and co. That puts him heads and shoulders above almost every fighter ever (barring Pep, Robinson and Armstrong). Good fact you should know, no heavyweight in history has beaten as many HOFers as Ali and only one boxer has done so (Robinson).
Now onto your at times misguided (at least I hope it's misguided and not purposeful) vision of what Ali did to Frazier. First of all, Frazier was no saint, in the build up to their first fight Frazier often times refused to call Ali by his then real name, much like Terrel had done years earlier, prompting Ali to call Frazier an "Uncle Tom". At no point did Ali ever lead a "lynch mob" to Fraziers house, don't be ridiculous. I know for a fact he bombarded Liston at his home with some rather childish japes, not sure if he went to Fraziers house to do that as well but it was all part of the promotion and often times, in front of the camera, Frazier was all too happy to oblige, knowing that the fight would make more money. There was a time when I think Ali went too far, in Manila, with the whole "Gorilla" chant which can be thought of as racist but it wasn't. He had a nick name for every guy he fought, calling Foreman the Mummy and Liston the bear (he even called Liston ugly, ohhh that's so bad). Ali, straight after their marathon battle in Manila apologised to Frazier and from Ali's part there was no bad blood.
Frazier however, was sadly, till his last days, a very bitter and at times duplicitous man. On camera, when ever Ali was about, he would say all is well and good and he loved the man, when Ali was gone, most famously in his documentary, The Thriller in Manila, he wished Ali dead and laughed at his disease, something even his son found uncomfortable.
Can't believe I even bothered arguing with you on this, seeing as your the new breed of Ali hater but the world remembers Ali as a hero and no one in particular really cares about the misguided, ignorant and most times, lying minority. I firmly hope your in the misguided category.
Bevab
Staff Member
Yeah, I remember Maradona for taking that Argentina squad.
Maybe, Messi does need to move to some unfamiliar territories to prove that he is the best.
puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
How am I an Ali hater? History is written by the victors, and in Ali's case he was the victor and history elevated him above where he actually was. Fact of the matter is, Robinson was a better and more skillful boxer, whilst Ali certainly doesn't win any medals for his character. So if that's the case, why does your own personal opinion that one weight division is apparently more important than any other weight division stand with more credibility than my assertion? It's a good thing that boxing is now a far more varied sport, and that many fans actually appreciate the skill of the lower weight classes as opposed to the brutality of the heavyweights (Ali and the old heavys are probably closer to cruiserweights anywy).
Just because the heavyweight division used to be the top divison, doesn't diminish other boxer's skills. Just because it was the most popular division doesn't make the other boxers any less skillful. Ali was a great fighter, and became a great man, but he wasn't always a great man, most of all when he was a boxer.
When people get ill, or old, it's easy to gloss over the negatives and only remember the positives. I see your part of the ignorant and rose-tinted brigade who stick Ali on a pedestal, when in reality he was a man with flaws like everyone else (see, being a knob is easy
).
I like how you've decided it's perfectly acceptable for you to decide Frazier had to forgive Ali? That was up to Big Joe. You don't see the duplicitous nature of Ali receiving help from Frazier whilst abusing him in public? You don't appreciate that Ali's showboating and attempts to sell fights is what sees the likes of Haye and Mayweather committing the same acts today?
Ah yeah, you're correct, it was Liston whom he led a media circus to his house. Barracking him from outside. Is that really acceptable behaviour? To go to someone's house?!? You have no idea what Uncle Tom means and the connotations it carried I presume, as to have called Frazier that was to essentially have called him about the worst thing imaginable to a black man at the time.
At no point have I said I'm an Ali hater, but people elevate him far above other sportsman who achieved as much, whilst not needing to abuse their opponents with a complete lack of respect
As I said, I've watched more documentaries on Ali than I can remember and read more old clippings and interviews than someone without an infinite amount of time should You're welcome to your opinions that are clearly based on pro-Ali literature, just as I am having read a vast array of differing opinions. As I said, certainly some of the poor press comes from his conversion to Islam and the subsequent hatred of it in America, but there are two sides to every story and you apparently only believe the Ali one.
Just because the heavyweight division used to be the top divison, doesn't diminish other boxer's skills. Just because it was the most popular division doesn't make the other boxers any less skillful. Ali was a great fighter, and became a great man, but he wasn't always a great man, most of all when he was a boxer.
When people get ill, or old, it's easy to gloss over the negatives and only remember the positives. I see your part of the ignorant and rose-tinted brigade who stick Ali on a pedestal, when in reality he was a man with flaws like everyone else (see, being a knob is easy
).I like how you've decided it's perfectly acceptable for you to decide Frazier had to forgive Ali? That was up to Big Joe. You don't see the duplicitous nature of Ali receiving help from Frazier whilst abusing him in public? You don't appreciate that Ali's showboating and attempts to sell fights is what sees the likes of Haye and Mayweather committing the same acts today?
Ah yeah, you're correct, it was Liston whom he led a media circus to his house. Barracking him from outside. Is that really acceptable behaviour? To go to someone's house?!? You have no idea what Uncle Tom means and the connotations it carried I presume, as to have called Frazier that was to essentially have called him about the worst thing imaginable to a black man at the time.
At no point have I said I'm an Ali hater, but people elevate him far above other sportsman who achieved as much, whilst not needing to abuse their opponents with a complete lack of respect
As I said, I've watched more documentaries on Ali than I can remember and read more old clippings and interviews than someone without an infinite amount of time should
You're welcome to your opinions that are clearly based on pro-Ali literature, just as I am having read a vast array of differing opinions. As I said, certainly some of the poor press comes from his conversion to Islam and the subsequent hatred of it in America, but there are two sides to every story and you apparently only believe the Ali one.
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Sahil 7
Panel of Selectors
no pt usha or what ? 
Sulaiman7
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Well this rankings that Pele is the best footballer ever .
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