India's Tour of South Africa Dec 21 - Jan 22

Doesn’t matter who plays so long as crybaby-face is captain. India literally threw away the match from a couple of strong positions. Even Kohli looked listless today. There is a ”rebuilding phase” coming up for India for the next couple of years.
 
I am switching over to watching the U-19 lads. More energy, more positivity and better captaincy from Nishant Sindhu.
Well the original captain Yash Dhull and and VC Shaikh Rasheed also few others have been tested positive for Covid.

Seems like Both Junior and the senior team is facing with the captaincy issue. :D
 
Rohit is back at the top that means Rahul at 4.
You wanna join Kohli school of Captaincy?

I see no point to continue with Dhawan just because he averages around 70 but strikes at under 90.

Prithvi Shaw must play in absence of Rohit while Ruturaj is second in line. KLR must open at all costs with Rohit.

A batting order consisting of these will win you games

Rohit :c: :bat:
KLR :bat:
Virat Kohli :bat:
Shreyas Iyer :bat:
Rishabh Pant :wkb:
Hardik (if he bowls) / Venky Iyer
Ravindra Jadeja :ar:
 
Rassie is a serious LOs player. Definitely came onto the stage too late, imagine a 3-4-5 of Faf, Rassie and AB in their prime.
 
You wanna join Kohli school of Captaincy?

I see no point to continue with Dhawan just because he averages around 70 but strikes at under 90.

Prithvi Shaw must play in absence of Rohit while Ruturaj is second in line. KLR must open at all costs with Rohit.

A batting order consisting of these will win you games

Rohit :c: :bat:
KLR :bat:
Virat Kohli :bat:
Shreyas Iyer :bat:
Rishabh Pant :wkb:
Hardik (if he bowls) / Venky Iyer
Ravindra Jadeja :ar:

Not to nitpick but you do know that Dhawan has been striking above 90 since 2016 right? And your suggested replacement in Rahul as the opener has a strike-rate of below 90 as an opener.

To delve deeper into this, Rahul has only struck at a run a ball twice as an opener in his entire ODI career. Both of those instances were for 5 and 11 runs respectively nearly five years ago. I’m not even kidding, even during his supposed ‘purple patch’ Rahul has always scored close to a run a ball as the opener but never at or above it. This is including his centuries and fifties and this isn’t just an isolated convenient case of him scoring at or above par in low scoring thrillers. These performances have also come when India have scored 300+. Now I have no love lost for Dhawan but out of his seventeen centuries, only five have been below run a ball.

So does this mean Rahul doesn’t merit his place in the playing XI? On the contrary, there is a role out there that Rahul has performed superbly in and that has been at number five. Over the last three years for middle-order players striking at more than hundred, Rahul has the highest average. This list includes blokes like Buttler, Pooran and Maxwell. The best in the business. And Rahul has been better than them. And Rahul is far from an anomaly in this. Jos Buttler is similarly very good in the middler order in an ODI and equally devastating as a T20 opener. One theory is that these blokes simply function better when they walk in around the 30 over mark and approach the ODI game as a T20.

So why does India not play it’s very own desi Buttler, replete with gloves and ’leadership quality’ in the middle order? Why saddle him at the top of the order? He plays very similar to Rohit Sharma and we cannot afford two of the same type of players in a modern ODI as openers. The only benefit I see is that he can make the big individual scores and centuries as an opener far more than in the middle order. Does that really serve India better though? His fifty striking at well above hundred is of far more use and importance to the Indian side in getting those scores in excess of 300 and in the four times he has done that, India have scored comfortably above 300.

The counter argument to this is that India surprisingly does have a capable set of players for the middle order already and you wouldn’t be wrong. Jadeja, Pant and Pandya all strike above a run a ball and have averaged more than 35 in the last three years in the middle order. Out of the four options, Pant does have the best strike-rate (a humongous 137 bettered only by… Mark Adair?).

This does illustrate what the Indian management has been trying to do in the recent past in ODIs in the dying days of Shastri-Kohli duo. Have the traditional top three bat long enough with their 90+ SR so that the number four actually comes in at a number five situation and then voila, you have Pant and Rahul both ready to contribute with their T20-lite batting performances. This also allows India to play Pandya and Jadeja without any worry in the middle order, providing two all-rounders. Of course, the issue is that Pant when he walks in as a traditional number four does not seem to do as well as a Shreyas Iyer can do. The evidence for Rahul is a lot more sparse owing to lack of actual experience at four but I suspect he wouldn’t like facing quality middle overs spin right as he walks in to bat which is what a number four traditionally does.

I wonder if the previous management realised how good this XI could potentially have been which is why we saw an awful lot of Pant at four (in addition to Kohli’s love of left-right batting duo). Imagine a top three that can consistently give you 50+ scores at near a run a ball followed by two of the very best middle-order aggressors and two more finishers who are nearly as good too. You would have scores of 350+ consistently and couple that with the previous Indian ODI bowling line-up and that would have been a champion side. It is a shame that this never came to fruition though as we had all the ingredients for this back in 2019 but shoddy planning prevented it.

To come back to the present day, I do agree with your general sentiment of Dhawan’s consistent fifties at less than a run a ball being very good but not quite cutting it for this current side. What this Indian side IMO needs at the moment as an opener is a pure dasher. Someone like a Gilly, Sehwag or Sanath from the previous era or a Jason Roy from this one. We already have two blokes in Kohli and Rohit who like building an innings and teeing off (although both have declined in the latter aspect). Someone who can provide a quick start is an ideal foil to this duo, The two best options I can think of are Mayank Agarwal (for the more experienced hand) and Prithvi Shaw (for the inexperienced but boundless potential).

If it were up to me, I would get Shaw in and give him a long rope with some batting paradises in a couple of home series to see how he plays under the international spotlight and pressure. I would also get SKY and Shreyas to work on their part-time bowling a lot more often like Markram with the promise of more playing time because let’s face it, Pandya bowling at the moment looks like a distant dream. Jadeja in at seven could easily bowl 7 overs minimum and if we could get at most five overs from our part-timer, it would be ideal. I would keep Gaikwad in reserve with the intention of him replacing Sharma long-term as the more patient opener.

And because every post must end with a fanciful playing XI that is every fan’s dream, here is mine for the current moment (at least until Pandya gets back to bowling regularly). :D

Shaw
Rohit
Kohli
Shreyas/Pant
Rahul
Pant/SKY
Jadeja


Whew, that came out longer than I expected. Been a while since I made a post this big.
 
I think he did play well. It was more about how the surface was playing. It was actually hard to get going. He nearly played a run a ball for most part of the innings.
On this surface Rassie Van Der Dussen scored at > run a ball and Dhawan close to run a ball. I hoped and expected Kohli to impose himself on the opposition which didn’t happen. Once he was out the required run rate galloped.
 
The Kohli's 71st Ton is now getting the same level of Anticipation and hype as that of Tendulkar's 100 hundred.

Even if Kohli gets out for say 90ish figure people will be like missed by few runs or So Near yet so far kind of stuff.
 
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I see no point to continue with Dhawan just because he averages around 70 but strikes at under 90.

Prithvi Shaw must play in absence of Rohit while Ruturaj is second in line. KLR must open at all costs with Rohit.

Dhawan can get you big runs and can get them quickly. However, if we are looking to build a team for the future, then its imperative that one of the existing openers steps aside. India has long had this concern of playing too many openers. If the target is the CWC 2023, then the ideal case scenario would be to develop people for specific positions.

In the previous tournaments, we have gone in with a 'floater' mentality sort of mindset. This basically ensured the Top3 were frozen in ,with the rest adapting to the circumstance. It failed miserably cause the rest of the team hasn't been exposed to such situation in the past.

I agree with the assessment of Dhawan and Shaw and am gunning for India to play Shaw at the very top with Rohit. If he gets going, the scoring rate is going to be quite high initially, which basically means that the likes of Rohit and Kohli can play themselves in. This can be followed up with Shreyas at 4, KLR at 5, Keeper at 6.

The brand of cricket that India has played so far is highly out dated. We cannot eat up many deliveries at the very top in order for our batsmen to settle down. I get Rohit's game and I get why they want to play it out. However, this isn't helping our cause, as we dont end up putting many runs on the board, in the first case.

The ideal opening combo- Rohit- Shaw
What if either is injured? If Rohit is injured, get Ruturaj. If Shaw is injured, get Venky Iyer to open.

The middle order- Kohli and Shreyas ought to be fixed at 3 and 4. Numbers 5 and 6, will be the either of KLR, Pant or Kishan. Use this lot as floaters,as opposed to using the entire team.

No7- Hardik /Venky
No8 - Jadeja/ Ashwin
No9- Shardul
No10- Shami
No11- Jasprit

In an ideal world, you would get the required 10 over from the above. You might also want to have Rohit, Virat and Shreyas bowl a bit in the nets and try to get a 6th bowler out of them. In terms of the batting firepower, No#7 - #9, outlined above can provide some hard hitting here. The only catch being the question of consistency . Can a Jadeja, Pandya hold fort during tough situations? If not, we would probably go down the English way of winning some great matches + losing a few random games here and there.
 
@Bevab maybe my assessment got a strong influence from the way these guys play in the T20Is?

I see KLR striking at around high 130s in the Powerplay so I feel he can also do the same in ODIs. The fact is I want to see both of KLR & Pant while not necessarily compromising on Shreyas who bats at 4. I really felt good when yesterday when I saw that Shreyas strikes at over 100 being a middle order batsman. I was like "Wow he averages close to 45 & strikes at 100? This is something India has looked for over the years."

One thing I've seen with KLR-Rohit pair is that they always keep the run rate close to 6 and what is even better is that they put on those 120-130 run stands quite consistently. Now, that sets and ideal platform for Kohli to get things going straight away. Also most of the times Shreyas would get to bat atleast 15-18 overs. We all know how destructive is Shreyas Iyer against the spinners.

Also that innings of Dhawan against England where he scored some 90-odd in 110+ deliveries was the reason I felt Dhawan strikes under 90 most of the times. But maybe that was just one innings. But again Dhawan does lack that ability to hit the ball a long way. He is one of those guys that hits the ball powerfully but seldom looks to clear the ropes. We may bat KLR in the middle order but not anywhere apart from no.5 (where Pant bats) and that should be followed by a condition that we move on with one of Dhawan/Rohit. Considering Rohit is to Captain, Dhawan has got to go!
 
It's unbelievable how stats mask reality. Most people are going to look at Kohli's captaincy numbers and go "WOW."

Here we are after his tenure debating where the captain/vice captain of this team should bat?

Remove Rohit (basically started under Dhoni), Kohli (same as Rohit), Jadeja (duh) and Bumrah (started his white ball career under MS?) and nobody has a clue what our team is now.

Kohli's legacy is chaos. For me, a great leader, batsman, bowler, all rounder is one who leaves behind something for the next generation. Kohli has left behind chaos and I hope with all my heart some of the batters in 5-6 years time will pop up saying it was Virat who prompted them to become India cricketers (I know this will happen)

But dear lord this man has created pandemonium with his leadership!
 

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