Sachin Tendulkar vs Brian Lara

[aussie_ben91]

Lara didn't fail "allot", he had bad patches like many others in this sport. Some because of injuries others because mental or other issues. If he had failed allot he wouldn't be where is atm.

Yes, Lara did fail allot for someone who averaged over 50. This is what you don't get. When I'm talking about failures, I'm saying that he failed allot for someone who averaged over 50, I'm not saying that he was a failure.

I said Laras technique was fine for him, I also said that he had flaws in his technique just like any other batsman.

Read the god damn posts man.

Again with that one pic dude, like I said perfect deliver to a left hander. Get me one that's going to be able to play that ball out in those conditions.

Also as you can see that is a wet wicket, you can clearly see the wet spots on it.

Another post that you don't understand and LOL @ you for telling me to read the posts. Double standards, eh?

I'm talking about his TECHNIQUE >> not << the BALL THAT WAS BOWLED. I'm telling you to look at his HAND & BAT POSITION - >> NOT << WHAT HAPPENS AFTER HE PLAYS HIS SHOT.

Go and find Waqars 6-59 vs Australia in 01, look at the way Hayden played that yorker. Look at the bat and look at the position. Yorkers like the one Lara and Hayden got arent the easiest to play at all, nothing that can be done about them but hope that nothing gets broken. Dont judge on one ball. Or innings or series for that matter.

I'm not judging one ball. If you hadn't noticed, Lara does the exact same thing for every single ball he faces. Go watch him bat and specifically look out for the first picture I showed you. You'll see it everytime.

It's funny because you're having ago at me because you think that I'm trying to discredit Lara's acchievements. I've never even spoken about his acchievements for one minute, nor discredited. The one problem Lara did have was his consistency and that was because of his technique. If it was anyone else saying this then you'd be agreeing with them but you're just too stubborn to admit defeat to me. Sad.

aussie_ben91 added 4 Minutes and 2 Seconds later...

I don't think Ben is bashing Lara. I think what he's giving Lara respect by saying he could have been so much better if he altered his high bat swing a little. He's not disregarding any of his accomplishments, he just saying that Lara could have done even better if he fixed that.

:hpraise

Dare & WestIndian take notes.

 

[Chetan0304]

B Lara is retired now, even if he was playing Brian don't need tips from that guy. why he needs to be better ? i dont see a single cricketer who passed out four hundred record. it's very much easy to say "He could have been better if he......."

Uncles this days ....


I wish Lara could have played in the IPL especially in Mumbai Indians, imagine two legends in the same team :hpraise

 

[aussie_ben91]

Uncles this days ....

Only a 10 year old could come up with such a pathetic post.

 

[mrtwisties]

Re the incident where Lara shoulder-charged McGrath...

I think Lara's famous temper made him a better cricketer. Sledging, like it or love it, is a longstanding part of the game and a real source of competitive advantage. But you couldn't sledge Lara, because he'd get angry and score a double century just to make you look bad. Same with intimidatory bowling. If you bounced him, he'd turn round next delivery and whack one right past your head just to show you who's boss.

I've heard a bunch of cricketers (Hussain, Warne, McGrath) say they learned to only be nice to Lara, which means that even before the first ball was bowled Lara was dictating the terms of the game and dominating the attack. Depriving teams of sledging and intimidatory bowling, both key tools of the game? That's some serious X-factor right there...

 

[Harrypotter_fan]

Tendulkar doesn't need to reply to sledging because it doesn't come his way . Bowlers are already awed by him to do any sledging.

@ Dare and WestIndian, there is no need to get personal at Ben. Disagree with the views, not the person.

 

[shravi]

LOL so you don't consider calling his technique, shocking, appalling, horrendous, flawed and whatever else bashing a guy.

I'm not going to go find the posts where he did but I'm sure he did slip in some praise somewhere. You can still have a "flawed" technique and be a great of a the game as shown by jordox's example of Don Bradman.

 

[Dare]

Yes, Lara did fail allot for someone who averaged over 50. This is what you don't get. When I'm talking about failures, I'm saying that he failed allot for someone who averaged over 50, I'm not saying that he was a failure.

What exactly do you classify as a failure? I consider him to be really consistent for a guy who had such a bad, flawed, awful technique.

Another post that you don't understand and LOL @ you for telling me to read the posts. Double standards, eh?

Understood it fine, I actually read all your posts real well desperately hoping for one that makes sense.

I'm talking about his TECHNIQUE >> not << the BALL THAT WAS BOWLED. I'm telling you to look at his HAND & BAT POSITION - >> NOT << WHAT HAPPENS AFTER HE PLAYS HIS SHOT.

Yea I can clearly see that he raises the bat high, one of many in cricket that does it/did it and turned out to be successful. If you look at Sobers he had a high back lift (not as high as Laras). Laras was also greatly exaggerated because he crouched very low as the ball is being delivered.

I'm not judging one ball. If you hadn't noticed, Lara does the exact same thing for every single ball he faces. Go watch him bat and specifically look out for the first picture I showed you. You'll see it everytime.

Where exactly did I say that Lara doesn't have a high back lift? And where exactly did I say that Laras technique is perfect?

It's funny because you're having ago at me because you think that I'm trying to discredit Lara's acchievements. I've never even spoken about his acchievements for one minute, nor discredited. The one problem Lara did have was his consistency and that was because of his technique. If it was anyone else saying this then you'd be agreeing with them but you're just too stubborn to admit defeat to me. Sad.

Actually I would still be debating with them because anyone saying Lara wasn't consistent deserves a reply.

Admit defeat for what, not like we are fighting or playing some sort of sport. What is it with you and asking everyone to admit defeat, are you insecure with yourself and need something to make you feel better every day.

Dear lord me I have been defeated by ben, he is the godknowitall of everything if Im not mistaken he might put this into his sig to make himself feel better every day.

 

[mrtwisties]

Still with the personal attacks, Dare.

My definition of "failure early in the innings" = scoring less than 10.

How often did Lara do it? How often did Tendulkar? What would Lara's average have been like if he was as consistent as Tendulkar? Good questions...

They've all been answered above.

 

[Dare]

Still with the personal attacks, Dare.

lol if you or him consider those personal than you are really insecure...

 

[mrtwisties]

On the contrary. If you don't consider these personal attacks, then you don't understand the definition of the term:

I actually read all your posts... desperately hoping for one that makes sense.

are you insecure with yourself and need something to make you feel better every day.

I have been defeated by ben, he is the godknowitall of everything if Im not mistaken he might put this into his sig to make himself feel better every day.

If you went back and edited this sort of content out of your posts, they'd be much more persuasive. Why? Because the use of ad hominem remarks is usually taken as an indication that a person is losing an argument.

Now, where are we in this debate?

Lara is better

• His high scores were higher - when he was on fire, he dominated bowling attacks more completely than Tendulkar.
• He had a flashy, attractive, high-risk technique.
• He had more natural talent.
• He played more match-winning innings than Tendulkar (although note that he had more opportunities to, playing for a rubbish team).

Tendulkar is better

• He was a more consistent run-scorer, both from innings to innings and in different countries around the world and over the course of his career.
• He had an elegant, classical, low-risk technique.
• He made better use of his natural talent.
• He sometimes choked when a match-winning knock was required.

Did I miss anything?

 

[manee]

You said that his technique is fine. But it's not. It's not the same technique that you would teach to a child. He gets his bat & hands into an awful position. Look at his hand and bat position.

Indeed, no one will disagree with you in that it is not a classical technique, but to call it plain wrong is to claim to understand a great deal about batting techniques. It is far more complex than bowling techniques, as you see many batsmen with techniques far removed from the textbook doing well, such as Dhoni, Trescothick and Sehwag, to name but three. One could argue that no one fully understands batting techniques as it is partially about harnessing hand-eye coordination to focus on the ball, something infinitely complicated.

I must note here that this is more my general rant about critiquing batting techniques at Test level, and has no other agenda in the thread (ie. to rate Lara above Tendulkar).

 

[aussie_ben91]

Indeed, no one will disagree with you in that it is not a classical technique

Except Dare who does disagree and is hell bent on proving this theory wrong.

As I've been saying all along, Lara had a poor batting technique, which strongly contributed to why he failed so often. Had he been more consistant then he would've without a doubt been better then Tendulkar and had he had a better technique then he would've been more consistant.

The technique arguements ties up with Lara's inconsistency and furthermore relates to my reasoning why Tendulkar was better then Lara. So it does have some relevance to this discussion.

I've said this about 10 times in this discussion and everyone else see's where I'm coming from except the one-eyed West Indies supporters.

 

[WestIndian]

where I'm coming from except the one-eyed West Indies supporters.

You know it would be just around here I would reply, and then manee would delete my post like he did yesterday, so I will leave you to your fancies, you are indeed right, you guys are the majority, so you say what you want and there is no contest. Sail along you little pitch!!!

 

[manee]

Not going to delete any of the above posts, this time, just a warning to calm down!

 

[WestIndian]

Not going to delete any of the above posts, this time, just a warning to calm down!

Yup, got you that's my last on this one, am out!!!