Top 4 All Rounders Ever

[ZoraxDoom]

Sobers, Kallis, Imran, Botham.

Miller misses out for me. Probably 5th on the list.

 

[War]

Sobers/Imran
Botham
Miller
Hadlee
Kapil


Shout out to Mike Procter & Clive Rice. They would have been right up there if they had played more test cricket.

 

[aussie1st]

Pretty much agree with the top 3. Kallis would be 4th for me, his batting is up there with Sobers but his bowling isn't quite as threatening which has him down the list for me. Stats wise Kallis is 2nd behind Sobers.

Pollock didn't bat enough in the top 6 to be considered as an all rounder in my books. If he did he could well have been up there with the top 3. Vettori is heading down that road too but his recent move up the order could help him in the future. Vettori will probably be like Botham and Dev by being handy in both forms but not outstanding in one or the other.

 

[Cricketman]

1. Sobers
----
2. Imran
3. Kapil Dev

Kapil over Kallis for me. Kapil was India's first ever REAL fast bowler. He bowled on pitches suited for the spinners, in a land where the only role of the medium pacer was to scuff the ball up for the spin trio. He changed the whole mindset. He was fast, he was quick, and he threatened batsman everywhere with sheer pace. No Indian had ever done that before (or has done it since)

His batting too was destructive. He could take games away in just a few overs. Kapil's batting could win you games but I doubt Kallis' bowling could do the same. Throw in the captaincy to win us a World Cup, and you have one hell of an allrounder.

Don't know much about Miller. Haven't really seen Botham play but I have heard he was basically an Andrew Flintoff who could bat better (which is pretty sweet). But not enough information to judge him vs Kallis.

 

[sifter132]

It still staggers me that people underrate Kallis. The man is slammed for his bowling, yet he's average and strike rate are better than Sobers, while Kallis is supposedly playing in a batsmen's era. I'd say Sobers edges him in batting, but gee Kallis is a pretty fine batsman too.

My top 4:
1. Sobers
2. Kallis - not as far off Sobers as every thinks.
3. Botham - had a great but fairly short peak in the late 70s, early 80s. Otherwise wasn't particularly awesome, but you gotta respect him at his best.
4. Miller - opened the bowling and batted #5, doing pretty well at both. That's a good all-rounder.
Honourable mention: Aubrey Faulkner, a South African leg spinning all-rounder in the early 1900s. Great player by all reports, but I can't in all fairness name him in a top 4.

Close but no cigar:
Imran - never had both his batting and bowling working at the same time. By the time he'd worked out his batting, his bowling had gone off a bit.
Kapil Dev - Just an average Test all-rounder IMHO, but his value was inflated because he was such a good ODI all-rounder.
Flintoff - only really played a couple of good series.
Benaud and Hadlee were never good enough batsmen.

 

[sami ullah khan]

Sobers
Imran
Miller
Kallis
If Andrew Flintoff had played more cricket, he would have broken into top 4. Another player that I thought was great with both ball and bat was Chris Cairns. He could be a lethal bowler on his day and could smash any attack with the bat. Injuries kept these two players from realizing their true potential.

 

[drainpipe32]

I would swear I made a post here. Anyway, I can't be bothered reapeating it, so I'll just point out, a great allrounder should be judged on the positive difference between their batting average and bowling average. For Sobers and Kallism that's very high.

 

[Harishan]

Sobers
Imran
Miller
Kallis

I don't know too much about Miller as an all rounder but from what I have read about him he sounds like a really complete player. I mean for someone who was brought in to the team as a batsman but took up bowling for the betterment of the side then to go on and become a great bowler and a high class batsman is quite amazing.

Imran Khan during his peak was simply sensastional. From 1980-88 in tests, he averaged 17 with the ball and just over 40 with the bat. Arguably the greatest peak for an all-rounder in test history.

 

[Dare]

Sobers, Imran, Miller, Kallis (dont hate on this guy)

 

[rahuldravidfan]

Kapil Dev
Imran Khan
Gary Sobers
Jacques Kallis

 

[Bublu Bhuyan]

Kapil Dev
Imran Khan
Gary Sobers
Jacques Kallis

Man, it's criminal to even think of leaving the great Keith Miller out of the top 3 all rounders list. Anyway, it's your opinion.

 

[rahuldravidfan]

Don't know him much. Just googled. Seems good.

 

[War]

It still staggers me that people underrate Kallis. The man is slammed for his bowling, yet he's average and strike rate are better than Sobers, while Kallis is supposedly playing in a batsmen's era. I'd say Sobers edges him in batting, but gee Kallis is a pretty fine batsman too.

My top 4:
1. Sobers
2. Kallis - not as far off Sobers as every thinks.
3. Botham - had a great but fairly short peak in the late 70s, early 80s. Otherwise wasn't particularly awesome, but you gotta respect him at his best.
4. Miller - opened the bowling and batted #5, doing pretty well at both. That's a good all-rounder.
Honourable mention: Aubrey Faulkner, a South African leg spinning all-rounder in the early 1900s. Great player by all reports, but I can't in all fairness name him in a top 4.

Close but no cigar:
Imran - never had both his batting and bowling working at the same time. By the time he'd worked out his batting, his bowling had gone off a bit.
Kapil Dev - Just an average Test all-rounder IMHO, but his value was inflated because he was such a good ODI all-rounder.
Flintoff - only really played a couple of good series.
Benaud and Hadlee were never good enough batsmen.

Dont worry about the stats my friend, Kallis is great player but he is by no means comparable to Sobers as an "complete all-rounder".

A complete all-rounder meaning a player who at the players "all-rounder peak" could score a hundred & take 5-wicket hauls consistently.

Kallis hasn't taken a 5-wicket haul againts a quality test opposition since Trent Bridge 2003 vs ENG. Kallis is basically this decade has been a top-class batsmen who can contribute effective with the ball depending on conditions (mainly bowler friendly conditions - on flat decks his bowling is generally ineffective). Kallis never could put two together over a series. His bowling in test has always been that of a 5th bowler, especially since his began took off around 2003/04.


Sobers peak as complete all-rounder was between Australia 60/61 to ENG 1969 in tests. Once could include the Rest of World vs England matches in 1970 as well here.

In that period Sobers averaged 55 with the bat & 31 with the ball. Which included that tremendous all-round series vs ENG in 1966 where he scored 722 runs @ 103 & 20 wickets @ 27. Which is argubaly the greatest single series individual performance other than Bradman 974 runs in Ashes 1930. Kallis can only dream of having such a comparable series as an "all-rounder". Sobers bowling in this period unlike Kallis was good enough to part of 4-man attack along with Hall/Griffith/Gibbs too.

Kallis really even cant compare with Sir Gary as batsman either. Sobers is argubaly one of top 3 batsman of all time. Kallis can't make a top ten of the best batsmen in cricket history.

Thats stats dont tell the truth in Kallis vs Sobers. It makes it seem close - but Sobers is way ahead.




On Imran Khan he actually did put his batting & bowling working at the same time to be honest. Between Lahore 1980 (when he scored his 1st test hundred) - Bridgetown 1988 (the last series in test when he was bowling 90 mph). He averaged 40 with the bat & 17 with the ball. After WI 1988 when his bowling declined, then his batting took off even further which gives the myth as his cricinfo profile suggest that..."he averaged 50 with bat & 19 with the ball" as a all-rounder.

Imran & Sobers should be considered the best all-rounders ever - given that their peaks as all-rounders where the best ever. Sobers being more batting orientated all-rounder - while Imran the bowling all-rounder.

 

[ballers101]

^I agree with War on this one I think that Imran Khan is probably the best player to ever play for Pakistan, he was the biggest reason why we won the World Cup in the first place. Also, Kallis is good but he also doesn't play great in big game situations if you don't know what I mean. I am referring to the nickname of South Africa, they are known as the chokers because they never get to the the finals of big tournaments, if Kallis was better than Imran Khan as an All Rounder I think at least one of those games, South Africa would have won and they probably wouldn't have that nickname.

 

[Dare]

Not fair to point out that South Africa choke in big tournaments and then only mention the name of Kallis. Its not Kallis only that chokes its the entire team. In the last World Cup he was the best South African batsman in the tournament.

if Kallis was better than Imran Khan as an All Rounder I think at least one of those games, South Africa would have won and they probably wouldn't have that nickname.

I find this to be one of the most ridiculous comments I have seen on these forums for a while now.