Vettori or Kallis?

[CG123]

Im surprised that there is doubt that Vettori can be classified as an all-rounder.

The man has 3492 runs and 303 wickets! What more do you want?

Exactly!!!

 

[irottev]

This is why I don't like these threads. Everyone has different opions. Some are ridiculous like King Pietersens and it just turns into arguments.

Vettori is a genuine all-rounder. He averages 44.65 with the bat in the last 5 years and 33.5 with the ball (for a spinner is a decent average though maybe 1 or 2 runs high)

Plus he doesn't have the luxury of forming partnerships with Greame Smith and other good batsmen. He often gets stranded with Chris Martins and has to bat aggressively sometimes giving his wicket away. Sure he comes in late in the innings, but as we saw in this game and as is often the case it's usually when the second new ball is taken. If batting #6/7/8 was a huge advantage every side would have their best batsman down there. Sure, sometimes you come in with an early wicket lost and have to face tough bowling, but you also have the opportunity to form partnerships with better players and bat for a long time. Often Vettori comes in at 150/6 type scores and totally resurrects the innings.

With the ball, people think he's over-rated, they think that because he gets hardly any spin. He doesn't seem like he should be dangerous but he is because he changes his pace and flight so well as well as having the best arm-ball in the game. He very rarely gives anything away. He creates pressure. Name a better spinner in the world right now? Murili and nobody else is close. Don't say Mendis, look at him plummet now that the surprise factor is gone. Fact is Vettori would make any side in the world as would Kallis.

How about we just decide they're both pretty damn good. in the last 24 months Vettori has been the leading all-rounder in the world though and that's the point.

 

[Dare]

Fact is Vettori would make any side in the world as would Kallis.

Vettori would make the side because of the benefit of Kallis being the ll-round pace bowler. If Kallis wasn't in then there would be a need for 3 pace bowlers and that would leave just one spot for a spinner and it goes to Murali.

Kallis is a sure thing. Vettori I'm not so sure about.

 

[Bluebagger]

Vettori is about the third decent player NZ have ever had but jesus the way they crap on about Vettori you would think they were talking about Keith Miller, Imran Kahn or Sir Garfield Sobers.

 

[irottev]

Vettori would make the side because of the benefit of Kallis being the ll-round pace bowler. If Kallis wasn't in then there would be a need for 3 pace bowlers and that would leave just one spot for a spinner and it goes to Murali.

Nothing wrong with 2 spinners. Heck, SL are playing 3 in their latest match. With the flatness of pitches these days. Nothing wrong with 5 bowlers, especially if 2 are all-rounders. Especially if the top 5 and keeper is strong.

Vettori is about the third decent player NZ have ever had but jesus the way they crap on about Vettori you would think they were talking about Keith Miller, Imran Kahn or Sir Garfield Sobers.

Oh come on, we had to put up with Australia's Hussey crap, then Hughes and now Siddle. Why can't the NZ fans enjoy having a world class player for once.

 

[Howsie]

Vettori is about the third decent player NZ have ever had but jesus the way they crap on about Vettori you would think they were talking about Keith Miller, Imran Kahn or Sir Garfield Sobers.

Huh? .....

 

[aussie1st]

Im surprised that there is doubt that Vettori can be classified as an all-rounder.

The man has 3492 runs and 303 wickets! What more do you want?

Some people, myself included, look towards where they bat in the order. I've always seen an all rounder as one that bats in the top 7 and is more than a part timer with the ball. Those that bat below the top 7 are more bowling all rounders for me and if Kallis or Flintoff batted at 8 I would probably feel the same about them.

 

[Bluebagger]

Oh come on, we had to put up with Australia's Hussey crap, then Hughes and now Siddle. Why can't the NZ fans enjoy having a world class player for once.

Vettori is a better batsman than he is a bowler but he takes most of his wickets from bowling a truck load of overs and has a very poor strike rate for the frontline bowler of the NZ attack, head to head with Johnson and Johnson has him covered.

And with the 3000 runs and 300 wickets does that make Shane Warne an all rounder? He scored a few 50's in his day and a couple of 90's that should have been 100's but I would hardly call him an all rounder.

 

[TumTum]

Although I see Kallis as a batting all-rounder.

 

[Howsie]

Vettori is a better batsman than he is a bowler but he takes most of his wickets from bowling a truck load of overs and has a very poor strike rate for the frontline bowler of the NZ attack, head to head with Johnson and Johnson has him covered.

And with the 3000 runs and 300 wickets does that make Shane Warne an all rounder? He scored a few 50's in his day and a couple of 90's that should have been 100's but I would hardly call him an all rounder.

Johnson? He's a decent bowler but he has way too many bad games with the ball to make up for his batting which isn't anywhere as good as Vettori's.

With Shane Warne, how many games did he play again. I'm guessing it was more then 90.

 

[Bluebagger]

Johnson has 114 wickets at an average of 28 and a strike rate of 55, far superior to Vettori and he hasn't had the luxury of plundering Bangladesh yet.

Funny how you connect Shane Warne's runs to the tests he played when the exact same logic applies to Vettori with wickets and overs.

 

[Dare]

Nothing wrong with 2 spinners. Heck, SL are playing 3 in their latest match. With the flatness of pitches these days. Nothing wrong with 5 bowlers, especially if 2 are all-rounders. Especially if the top 5 and keeper is strong.

Nothing wrong with it, I would love a lineup with both of them but unless its in the subcontinent I wouldn't take it.

 

[Howsie]

New Zealand's bowling attack for the most part of Vettori's career has been pop-gun like. If your've watched NZ play test cricket in the last two years or so you would have noticed that the batsmen just sit on Vettori and make sure they don't get out, then go after the weaker bowlers.

 

[Bluebagger]

Keep the excuses rolling.

 

[Howsie]

Keep the excuses rolling.

Typical. Surprised you didn't go to your usual hahahahaha when you don't have anything to come back with :sarcasm