Who is the 2nd best Australian batsman of alltime?

Who is the 2nd best Australian batsman of alltime?

  • Allan Border

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Mark Taylor

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Neil Harvey

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Doug Walters

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Ian Chappell

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bill Lawry

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bob Simpson

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Ian Redpath

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Damien Martyn

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Dean Jones

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Arthur Morris

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Clem Hill

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Victor Trumper

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lindsay Hassett

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Stan McCabe

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bill Woodfull

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Bob Cowper

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Jack Ryder

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Sid Barnes

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    39
What are you saying? You don't think Hayden can be considered as Australia's 2nd best batsmen of all time?

Hayden came to his prime form after 2001 right? During that Indian tour. Before that I have seen his matches where he just bats soooo horrible and worst. His struggle against Ambrose/Walsh is one such example.

Hayden may be the best in particular era, but when the overall criteria comes, Stevie is far better. Stevie, McGrath, Warne, Gilchirst, Bevan(except his last stages) were some of the fews who were dominant/threatening almost throughout their carreer. I mean the players whom I have seen playing. As I said, I don't believe in stats from net. Since i have never watched some of the old players including Bradman, I can't comment on them :)
 
Steve Waugh didn't dominate throughout his whole career. He didn't get his first ton until a few years into his Test career.
 
Steve Waugh didn't dominate throughout his whole career. He didn't get his first ton until a few years into his Test career.

Oh, Interesting!:)

Atleast from 96-03, he has dominated to the extent I was just amazed how can a player be like this? :eek: Seriously.. how in the hell he can make a century/50 partnership with guys batting at 10 and 11th position.. is what I used to get frustrated many times. But after knowing his off-field contributions like charity and some others, I developed lots of respect in him :)
 
Well, I haven't seen Victor Trumper playing but from what I've read in books, he used to be a great man, both on and off the field.
 
surendar said:
Oh, Interesting!

Atleast from 96-03, he has dominated to the extent I was just amazed how can a player be like this? Seriously.. how in the hell he can make a century/50 partnership with guys batting at 10 and 11th position.. is what I used to get frustrated many times. But after knowing his off-field contributions like charity and some others, I developed lots of respect in him

Yeah, I agree he is a great player, and he even though he took a while to get his first ton he was facing up against the fearsome West Indies attack, and he was only young. I forget what I read in his book but I'm pretty sure it was a year or 2, but he had to play the West Indies twice in that period of time I think.
 
Hayden came to his prime form after 2001 right? During that Indian tour. Before that I have seen his matches where he just bats soooo horrible and worst. His struggle against Ambrose/Walsh is one such example.
He didn't struggle against the West Indies. Averaging 35 isn't struggling. He would've gotten a permanant spot in the Australian side had Mark Taylor not been captain. You obviously haven't watched Sheffield Sheild cricket where Hayden used to tear apart Warne & McGrath during the 1990s.
 
He didn't struggle against the West Indies. Averaging 35 isn't struggling. He would've gotten a permanant spot in the Australian side had Mark Taylor not been captain.


Ok, I don't have a cricinfo since it's blocked here in my office. Can you post the stats from cricinfo of Hayden against Windies, till Walsh-Ambrose retirement period. I am curious to know out of interest irrespective whether he has struggled or not.

And great player won't have a average 35 in test level that too a player whom you call a big man, big century maker and match winner, test average of 35 is definetly below par average to me especially against a collapsing team like Windies. I am damn sure, Aussies have very dominating record against Windies ( in both Aus and in WI) and in that dominating era, with that average of 35, you can't call it a great if you ask me! :cool:


You obviously haven't watched Sheffield Sheild cricket where Hayden used to tear apart Warne & McGrath during the 1990s.

No, I haven't watched but I have heard of people saying that Hayden used to smash McGrath. I think there is also a incident like one of those two blokes have pushed the other during a match. I don't remember exactly, but I remember hearing that in PC only.:)
 
ponting can't play spin...so...it has to be steve waugh or allan border
 
He didn't struggle against the West Indies. Averaging 35 isn't struggling. He would've gotten a permanant spot in the Australian side had Mark Taylor not been captain. You obviously haven't watched Sheffield Sheild cricket where Hayden used to tear apart Warne & McGrath during the 1990s.

Just saw cricinfo,

Code:
[U]Hayden(during Walsh period)[/U]

Span  	         Mat  	Runs  	HS  	Bat Av  [COLOR="Red"][B]100 [/B][/COLOR] 	Wkts  	BBI  	Bowl Av  	5  	Ct  	St  	
1996-2001  	8  	413  	125  	[B]31.76[/B]  	[B][COLOR="Red"]1[/COLOR][/B]  	0  	-  	-  	0  	11  	0  	

[B][U]Filter[/U][/B]

[B]Opposition team:[/B] West Indies
[B]Start of match date:[/B] less than or equal to 19 Apr 2001

So he gets the average 30 in 8 matches. And 1 hundred at Jan,1997. Interesting stats for a great player right? :rolleyes: ( I don't want to bring Tendulkar here.. but I am not able to resist myself.. If you are interested in knowing an extra info, Sachin has played same 8 test matches from 94-01 against West Indies with scoring around 700 runs with 63 batting average :D Anyways, just an extra info of Sachin during the same Walsh/Ambrose period )

After Walsh/Ambrose Windies became worse than Bangladesh & Zimbabwe with either Lara or Chanderpaul or Hooper struggling to bring the team to top & with non effective/inconsistent bowlers.

Here is Hayden's stats,

Start of match date: less than or equal to 3 Jan 2001

Code:
Span  	         Mat  	Runs  	HS  	Bat Av  100  	Wkts  	BBI  	Bowl Av  	5  	Ct  	St 
1994-2001  	13  	536  	125  	[B]24.36[/B]  	[B]1[/B]  	0  	-  	-  	0  	16  	0

He has had a horrible starts to his career though he played 13 tests since his debut, 1994.

And below is the peak period I was talking about,

Code:
2001-02 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]71.85 [/B][/COLOR] 	
2002-03 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]61.82[/B][/COLOR]
2003-04 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]81[/B][/COLOR]
2004-05 - 43
2005-06 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]52[/B][/COLOR]
2006-07 - 44
2007-08 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]57[/B][/COLOR]
2008-End - [COLOR="Red"][B]28[/B][/COLOR]

Obviously to people who have started to see cricket in late 2000, Hayden will look more than Bradman. Hayden attained his prime/peak form after that 2000-01 series Vs India. I never denied the fact of his peak form over 6 years.

But to Ben's point of saying that I was wrong in " Hayden struggled against WestIndies during Walsh/Ambrose period " is invalid. :p

In other end, Steve Waugh has outsmarted his own team mate in getting around 2000 runs against West Indies with average of around 50 during Walsh/Ambrose period(where West Indies indeed had their BEST bowlers).
 
Last edited:
I not know all austrilia cricket people but i only choose justin Langer. He is very good batman and i am very like him a lot. i enjoy watch him play crickets. This is reason i not know all because i start watch cricket since 2004 and grow watch more cricket. so i am wish go back to 2000 and watch because i really want watch Waugh and Bevan in ODI. I heard Waugh have interesting character and fight spirt.
 
I not know all austrilia cricket people but i only choose justin Langer. He is very good batman and i am very like him a lot. i enjoy watch him play crickets. This is reason i not know all because i start watch cricket since 2004 and grow watch more cricket. so i am wish go back to 2000 and watch because i really want watch Waugh and Bevan in ODI. I heard Waugh have interesting character and fight spirt.

Haha, for an Englishman your English is horrible :p


Here's my non-Bradman list of best Aussies batsmen (Test matches only):

1. Ricky Ponting - I feel a little bad because he's a current player, they always get overrated in all-time discussions. But look at his average and sheer weight of runs and it's hard to say anyone has been better. I'm sure you can find holes in his record, but EVERYONE has holes in their record. Even the Don cops flack for his Bodyline performance.
2. Allan Border
3. Greg Chappell
4. Neil Harvey
5. Steve Waugh
6. Clem Hill - great #3 from just before WWI.
7. Matthew Hayden
8. Arthur Morris
9. Dougie Walters
10. Victor Trumper

Oh and Phil Hughes of course :D


If you want ODIs, Dean Jones and Michael Bevan are legends. Ponting also has a pretty good ODI record.
 
Having not seen the older guys and not knowing much on there stats I will go with the players I have seen. Of that lot Ponting gets my vote, his ability to continue convert his 100s into big ones impresses me along with his ability to counter attack or play the fighting role.
 
Exactly hence the only stats I will trust is for Bradman. Other than that only the legends can really answer this question with a lot of creditability.
 
Just saw cricinfo,

Code:
[U]Hayden(during Walsh period)[/U]

Span  	         Mat  	Runs  	HS  	Bat Av  [COLOR="Red"][B]100 [/B][/COLOR] 	Wkts  	BBI  	Bowl Av  	5  	Ct  	St  	
1996-2001  	8  	413  	125  	[B]31.76[/B]  	[B][COLOR="Red"]1[/COLOR][/B]  	0  	-  	-  	0  	11  	0  	

[B][U]Filter[/U][/B]

[B]Opposition team:[/B] West Indies
[B]Start of match date:[/B] less than or equal to 19 Apr 2001

So he gets the average 30 in 8 matches. And 1 hundred at Jan,1997. Interesting stats for a great player right? :rolleyes: ( I don't want to bring Tendulkar here.. but I am not able to resist myself.. If you are interested in knowing an extra info, Sachin has played same 8 test matches from 94-01 against West Indies with scoring around 700 runs with 63 batting average :D Anyways, just an extra info of Sachin during the same Walsh/Ambrose period)

After Walsh/Ambrose Windies became worse than Bangladesh & Zimbabwe with either Lara or Chanderpaul or Hooper struggling to bring the team to top & with non effective/inconsistent bowlers.

Here is Hayden's stats,

Start of match date: less than or equal to 3 Jan 2001

Code:
Span  	         Mat  	Runs  	HS  	Bat Av  100  	Wkts  	BBI  	Bowl Av  	5  	Ct  	St 
1994-2001  	13  	536  	125  	[B]24.36[/B]  	[B]1[/B]  	0  	-  	-  	0  	16  	0

He has had a horrible starts to his career though he played 13 tests since his debut, 1994.

And below is the peak period I was talking about,

Code:
2001-02 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]71.85 [/B][/COLOR] 	
2002-03 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]61.82[/B][/COLOR]
2003-04 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]81[/B][/COLOR]
2004-05 - 43
2005-06 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]52[/B][/COLOR]
2006-07 - 44
2007-08 - [COLOR="DarkGreen"][B]57[/B][/COLOR]
2008-End - [COLOR="Red"][B]28[/B][/COLOR]

Obviously to people who have started to see cricket in late 2000, Hayden will look more than Bradman. Hayden attained his prime/peak form after that 2000-01 series Vs India. I never denied the fact of his peak form over 6 years.

But to Ben's point of saying that I was wrong in " Hayden struggled against WestIndies during Walsh/Ambrose period " is invalid. :p

In other end, Steve Waugh has outsmarted his own team mate in getting around 2000 runs against West Indies with average of around 50 during Walsh/Ambrose period(where West Indies indeed had their BEST bowlers).
Hayden struggled against South Africa before he was settled into world cricket but after he was settled he hammered the same bowlers around the park for years on end. Can you see a pattern?

Tendulkar averages under 40 in the most difficult conditions in world cricket - South Africa, against Donald, Pollock, Steyn, etc. I suppose his overrated and wouldn't average over 40 in a bowler friendly era without a helmet. Maybe there is a pattern to this. Tendulkar struggled against McGrath, Donald, Pollock, Wasim & Waqar. Maybe Tendulkar can't play pace bowling? [/Sarcasim King Cricket]
 
Hayden struggled against South Africa before he was settled into world cricket but after he was settled he hammered the same bowlers around the park for years on end. Can you see a pattern?

Tendulkar averages under 40 in the most difficult conditions in world cricket - South Africa, against Donald, Pollock, Steyn, etc. I suppose his overrated and wouldn't average over 40 in a bowler friendly era without a helmet. Maybe there is a pattern to this. Tendulkar struggled against McGrath, Donald, Pollock, Wasim & Waqar. Maybe Tendulkar can't play pace bowling? [/Sarcasim King Cricket]

No 1: There's no such thing called "Sarcasim"
No 2: You don't have to write this thing again and again
No 3: As you see, I have stopped arguing with you.
No 4: Have a good day, as from now on I will neither quote nor reply to any of your posts.
No 5: Good to see that you have changed your sig.
No 6: Just to tell you, I didn't change to a rooster, neither did I fly to Scotland.
 

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