evertonfan
Chairman of Selectors
Enough is enough, I always end up dragging this debate into other threads so I thought it'd be best to start a thread for it. Now close it if you must, but i'm interested in seeing people's opinions on this.
Afridi - Brainless Slogger or Marvellous Hitter?
- Thread starter evertonfan
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wolf
International Cricketer
He is both mindless and brilliant. That is what makes him so exciting.
evertonfan
Chairman of Selectors
I wondered how long it would be before that 'on the fence' answer would come out. 
:
:puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
I've voted mindless. Now I'm reasonably torn on the whole Afridi debate. I think he brings enough to the side in Odi cricket through his bowling and obviously strike rate for his batting. However I think he's a waste of space in test cricket.
I've gone for mindless because when the situation dictates that someone sees the innings through, he more often than not just gives his wicket away. People often say he is a special once in a lifetime player, but the fact is he has no other way of playing. Someone like KP or Freddie could average a good 10-20 runs less and do a very similar job of swinging mindlessly, but they don't because they are more intelligent cricketers who read the situation of a match.
Afridi on the other hand, seems incapable of playing any other way than slogging, and whilst it might come off every so often, much less so in recent times, more often than not you are left with you a spin bowler who isn't massively threatening and batsman who gets out cheaply.
I think one of the things I dislike most about him, is the way he is stuck on a pedestal in Pakistani cricket by the fans. Seeing a stadium empty just because he's gotten out is appaling, because I would far rather go and watch someone masterful like Yousef or Inzaman than someone who basically just has a good eye, not much technique and very little self control.
I've gone for mindless because when the situation dictates that someone sees the innings through, he more often than not just gives his wicket away. People often say he is a special once in a lifetime player, but the fact is he has no other way of playing. Someone like KP or Freddie could average a good 10-20 runs less and do a very similar job of swinging mindlessly, but they don't because they are more intelligent cricketers who read the situation of a match.
Afridi on the other hand, seems incapable of playing any other way than slogging, and whilst it might come off every so often, much less so in recent times, more often than not you are left with you a spin bowler who isn't massively threatening and batsman who gets out cheaply.
I think one of the things I dislike most about him, is the way he is stuck on a pedestal in Pakistani cricket by the fans. Seeing a stadium empty just because he's gotten out is appaling, because I would far rather go and watch someone masterful like Yousef or Inzaman than someone who basically just has a good eye, not much technique and very little self control.
wolf
International Cricketer
puddleduck said:
You can't hold that against him though, it is not his fault.
puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
No I know I can't, but rightly or wrong I do. The constant talk from Afridi fans about how amazing he is, and how once in a lifetime he is, how talented he is and that noone in cricket has his talent. I think that rubs off on my opinion of him as a player, even though it shouldn't.
I'm sure he is decent bloke who sees himself as what he is, and would love to have the talent of an Inzaman, Yousef, Ponting, Dravid etc...
I'm sure he is decent bloke who sees himself as what he is, and would love to have the talent of an Inzaman, Yousef, Ponting, Dravid etc...
evertonfan
Chairman of Selectors
Puddle, that's the main reason why I dislike Afridi; The fans. Whenever he fails with the bat the usual "oh well he hit a 37 ball hundred" always resurface and it's just to mask what a poor cricketer he can be at times. I've nothing against the man personally, but he's way over-hyped. Again, no fault of his own though.
plympilgrim
International Coach
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2006
- Online Cricket Games Owned
on his day he is absolutely amazin, the problem is he has very few good days and he gives his wicket away too easily, like when he hit that 37 ball 100, why he didn't then try to bat at a run a ball i'll never know, but any way he is stupid the way he bats sometimes
Probably because he could get it in 37 ballsplympilgrim said:
: .He plays some stupid shots sometimes. On his day he is maybe the most destructive batsman in world cricket, however recently, his best days are few and far between.
An example, I think it was on the 1st day of the test match this summer at Old Trafford, Pakistan were struggling at something like 105-6 and Afridi tries to slog Monty to the Kellogs factory next door, he ends of mis-hitting it and Pakistan fell quickly after there.
He is a good one-day bowler as well, I think Pakistan should continue to play him in ODI's but unfortunately neither his bowling or batting is up to it in Tests.
Alright, my turn:
Afridi is fabulous. Why do we like him? Same reasons we like India or England. The personalities clash, from friendly and amiable people, to downright low down and do-anything-to-win kinds, to charming to cunning and sly. Afridi is all of these, his personality draws you into wanting to listen to him, into watching him bowl and field, chattering with the batters. He could sledge you one minute, run to your aid the next, then scuff up the pitch or ball and claim innocence. In this day and age of walking and polietness and fining for over-appealing, he is a breath of fresh air to watch. He also brings in enthusiasm, never shutting up in the field, consistantly clapping, and sometimes he just looks cool and unruffled, like King Viv or Steve Waugh, like he has everything in control, to nonchalent and almost unamused by what's going on, like he has better things to do. He's a mixed bag.
Then you go to his batting. it's fabulous. Again, comparisions with your favourite team. Heck, he symbolises Pakistan for christs sake. Brilliant, talented, stunning and marvellous to ugly, ungamely, horrid, and downirght frustrating. His batting is fantastic, effortless, so brilliant and amazing to watch when on form. But at the same time, you feel he is wasting away, doesn't care about the team's situation, just playing for himself or would rather be elsewhere. That's what makes him great to watch, he may get out for a duck, but then club and 25 ball century the next.
Now lets look at the brainless aspect. The fact that people say he is selfish, stupid, incapable of doing nothing but slogging.
Did you know, he always wanted to just bat at 5, build an innings, and bowl some spin? That's what he wanted his role to be. But look at the decade or so he has given to Pakistani circket. He has batted everywhere, from opening to all the way down at 9. He has never got a specific spot in the team. He isn't either the allrounder, or the spin bowler, or the batsman who bowls a bit. He's all 3. No consistency. But if you look at his stats when he gets to bat at 5 and play the role he wants, they are better than his career. Just recently his outbursts of "No, I will not open!" are due to all the frustration he has stored up over the years. He has given everything he had, but has been in and out, up and down, round and round, etc.
Bob Woolmer promised him he could be who he wants. It hasn't come true. He had a consistent spot for a while in Australia and did brilliantly. THen, he got shuffled up and down, and now is dropped.
All his years he has given everything to the team, it's about time he got something back. So he is not selfish.
So why does he slog so much? Why play idiotic, brain-dead shots?
He has admitted, everytime, he walks out to bat, he wants to play a long knock. He says to himself, "I'll bat out the first 10, 15, asses the pitch, then go after the ball". But when he gets out there, he loses it! he loves the game, he loves what he does. He can't help himself, he just gets the adrenaline pumping. He is a crowd pleaser, and seeing all the people, cheering for him, he feels and wants to gie them waht they want. Call that irresponsible, but it is part of the Afridi package. After all, to him, it's just a game, and that's what is his most appealing aspect. Because despite all the shuffles up and down, all the criticism, all the pressure, all the offield dram, when he walks out and takes guard, or goes out to field, he wants to have fun. The crowd wants to have fun. We play cricket to have fun. And in this age of technological analysis, jam-packed tours, and mental breakdowns, to see a cricketer who bats with all the entusiasm of a little kid and treats the game for what it is -a game-, one who wants to entertain fans all over, it's rare. That is Afridi. Fantastic and complex guy, fantstic and complex cricketer. He is immensely talented, and by God it's great to watch him. He is just a marvellous guy, marvellous cricketer. He epitomizes what cricket is. The ups, the downs, the scandals, the brilliance. He has all that romance of cricket to him, that school-boy dream at 16, that vicious scandal, the off-field incidents, yet the match winning innings, the crowd pleaser, the one that brings people all over the world to watch him. He's brilliant, he's Afridi.
Afridi is fabulous. Why do we like him? Same reasons we like India or England. The personalities clash, from friendly and amiable people, to downright low down and do-anything-to-win kinds, to charming to cunning and sly. Afridi is all of these, his personality draws you into wanting to listen to him, into watching him bowl and field, chattering with the batters. He could sledge you one minute, run to your aid the next, then scuff up the pitch or ball and claim innocence. In this day and age of walking and polietness and fining for over-appealing, he is a breath of fresh air to watch. He also brings in enthusiasm, never shutting up in the field, consistantly clapping, and sometimes he just looks cool and unruffled, like King Viv or Steve Waugh, like he has everything in control, to nonchalent and almost unamused by what's going on, like he has better things to do. He's a mixed bag.
Then you go to his batting. it's fabulous. Again, comparisions with your favourite team. Heck, he symbolises Pakistan for christs sake. Brilliant, talented, stunning and marvellous to ugly, ungamely, horrid, and downirght frustrating. His batting is fantastic, effortless, so brilliant and amazing to watch when on form. But at the same time, you feel he is wasting away, doesn't care about the team's situation, just playing for himself or would rather be elsewhere. That's what makes him great to watch, he may get out for a duck, but then club and 25 ball century the next.
Now lets look at the brainless aspect. The fact that people say he is selfish, stupid, incapable of doing nothing but slogging.
Did you know, he always wanted to just bat at 5, build an innings, and bowl some spin? That's what he wanted his role to be. But look at the decade or so he has given to Pakistani circket. He has batted everywhere, from opening to all the way down at 9. He has never got a specific spot in the team. He isn't either the allrounder, or the spin bowler, or the batsman who bowls a bit. He's all 3. No consistency. But if you look at his stats when he gets to bat at 5 and play the role he wants, they are better than his career. Just recently his outbursts of "No, I will not open!" are due to all the frustration he has stored up over the years. He has given everything he had, but has been in and out, up and down, round and round, etc.
Bob Woolmer promised him he could be who he wants. It hasn't come true. He had a consistent spot for a while in Australia and did brilliantly. THen, he got shuffled up and down, and now is dropped.All his years he has given everything to the team, it's about time he got something back. So he is not selfish.
So why does he slog so much? Why play idiotic, brain-dead shots?
He has admitted, everytime, he walks out to bat, he wants to play a long knock. He says to himself, "I'll bat out the first 10, 15, asses the pitch, then go after the ball". But when he gets out there, he loses it! he loves the game, he loves what he does. He can't help himself, he just gets the adrenaline pumping. He is a crowd pleaser, and seeing all the people, cheering for him, he feels and wants to gie them waht they want. Call that irresponsible, but it is part of the Afridi package. After all, to him, it's just a game, and that's what is his most appealing aspect. Because despite all the shuffles up and down, all the criticism, all the pressure, all the offield dram, when he walks out and takes guard, or goes out to field, he wants to have fun. The crowd wants to have fun. We play cricket to have fun. And in this age of technological analysis, jam-packed tours, and mental breakdowns, to see a cricketer who bats with all the entusiasm of a little kid and treats the game for what it is -a game-, one who wants to entertain fans all over, it's rare. That is Afridi. Fantastic and complex guy, fantstic and complex cricketer. He is immensely talented, and by God it's great to watch him. He is just a marvellous guy, marvellous cricketer. He epitomizes what cricket is. The ups, the downs, the scandals, the brilliance. He has all that romance of cricket to him, that school-boy dream at 16, that vicious scandal, the off-field incidents, yet the match winning innings, the crowd pleaser, the one that brings people all over the world to watch him. He's brilliant, he's Afridi.
plympilgrim
International Coach
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2006
- Online Cricket Games Owned
sorry i meant after he got to 100, he could have plodded along and accelerated again later, but he gave his wicket away.PhilD123 said:Probably because he could get it in 37 balls
He plays some stupid shots sometimes. On his day he is maybe the most destructive batsman in world cricket, however recently, his best days are few and far between.
An example, I think it was on the 1st day of the test match this summer at Old Trafford, Pakistan were struggling at something like 105-6 and Afridi tries to slog Monty to the Kellogs factory next door, he ends of mis-hitting it and Pakistan fell quickly after there.
He is a good one-day bowler as well, I think Pakistan should continue to play him in ODI's but unfortunately neither his bowling or batting is up to it in Tests.
puddleduck
Chairman of Selectors
Zorax your second paragraph just highlights what we're all saying. He is a slogger. That however far he can hit a ball, when he gets into the middle he doesn't have the mental application to actually play an innings.
I think you'll find the reason he has been moved around the batting order a lot and doesn't get to pick his spot is because there are far more talented batsman in the squad that bat from 3-5. A highest score in Odi cricket of 109 should be higher really for all this supposed talent. I notice as well that nearly all his career defining knocks have gone on Pakistani flatbeds or in other batsman friendly conditions in the Sub-Continent.
Whilst Pakistan cricket fans might think that just being able to hit the ball out the park is the be all and end all, in England we look at it very differently. How many times has KP been critiscised for giving his wicket away? This despite averaging a lot more than Afridi and pulling it off on far more occassions.
I think you'll find the reason he has been moved around the batting order a lot and doesn't get to pick his spot is because there are far more talented batsman in the squad that bat from 3-5. A highest score in Odi cricket of 109 should be higher really for all this supposed talent. I notice as well that nearly all his career defining knocks have gone on Pakistani flatbeds or in other batsman friendly conditions in the Sub-Continent.
Whilst Pakistan cricket fans might think that just being able to hit the ball out the park is the be all and end all, in England we look at it very differently. How many times has KP been critiscised for giving his wicket away? This despite averaging a lot more than Afridi and pulling it off on far more occassions.
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m_vaughan
Chairman of Selectors
Some excellent posts here.
I think every team has one of these "hitters" who have the ability of the light up the game. They are as important to modern day game as your technical players like Yousuf and Dravid.
But the other hitters like Justin Kemp of SA, Kevin Pietersen of England, Mahendra Dhoni of India, etc. have the ability to adapt to the situation and play an innings totally uncharacteristic of them to get the job done for their team. This is where Afridi fails to earn my respect, as in he remains just a one dimensional cricketer.
Despite this he still remains one of the finest one day performers and according to me is a crucial member of the Pakistani team and is as important to them as Yousuf or Inzamam.
I think every team has one of these "hitters" who have the ability of the light up the game. They are as important to modern day game as your technical players like Yousuf and Dravid.
But the other hitters like Justin Kemp of SA, Kevin Pietersen of England, Mahendra Dhoni of India, etc. have the ability to adapt to the situation and play an innings totally uncharacteristic of them to get the job done for their team. This is where Afridi fails to earn my respect, as in he remains just a one dimensional cricketer.
Despite this he still remains one of the finest one day performers and according to me is a crucial member of the Pakistani team and is as important to them as Yousuf or Inzamam.
plympilgrim
International Coach
- Joined
- Aug 19, 2006
- Online Cricket Games Owned
what you got to consider as well as players like Lara and Tendulkar have the ability to bat very quickly, its just that they adapt to the situation instead of slogging straight form the off
