Ashes-2023 England VS Australia 16 June-31 July

[WubbaLubbaDubDub]

Sad but true!

 

[Paranoid Kendroid]

It ain't the deep

Kid named the deep:

 

[Croadyman]

Sad but true!

Yeah we are a complete shambles over there since 2010/11 and that's not acceptable. There is no doubt we blew this completely by batting on too long,almost wish we had been bowled out quicker rather than relying on a declaration from Stokes. We needed time to get them out with such an iffy forecast but no was all about personal milestones wasn't it. Thought we are the team who believe we can chase anything well it certainly didn't show.

 

[T.J.Hooker II]

If they'd been 8 or 9 down when the overs ran out then batting on would def have been the wrong call.

As it is, Aus weren't that far off making England bat again with 5 down. The runs that England got by batting on were scored when the going was good and the run rate was high, and the batsmen were on top and giving the bowlers a good thrashing - as opposed to trying to get those same runs in the 4th innings after a load of rain and when delays might make getting into a hitting groove more challenging.

If they'd declared and immediately got a bunch of wickets then fair enough, that would have been a winning move. But assuming a similar bowling / batting performance I think the game still ends in a draw.

 

[Croadyman]

If they'd been 8 or 9 down when the overs ran out then batting on would def have been the wrong call.

As it is, Aus weren't that far off making England bat again with 5 down. The runs that England got by batting on were scored when the going was good and the run rate was high, and the batsmen were on top and giving the bowlers a good thrashing - as opposed to trying to get those same runs in the 4th innings after a load of rain and when delays might make getting into a hitting groove more challenging.

If they'd declared and immediately got a bunch of wickets then fair enough, that would have been a winning move. But assuming a similar bowling / batting performance I think the game still ends in a draw.

This game was effectively a 3 day test not 5 day one but clearly didn't register with England. They didn't need nearly 600 runs when Aussies only got 317. They should have been focusing on having the time to bowl them out as we had to win.

 

[T.J.Hooker II]

The Aussies had 530 something runs in the game with 5 wickets left. How many fewer runs than 600 do you think England needed to win?

 

[wasteyouryouth]

This game was effectively a 3 day test not 5 day one but clearly didn't register with England. They didn't need nearly 600 runs when Aussies only got 317. They should have been focusing on having the time to bowl them out as we had to win.

It was only Friday afternoon, or whatever day 3 was, that the forecast for Day 5. Prior to that it looked like there could be more time in the match than there ended up being.

 

[Croadyman]

It was only Friday afternoon, or whatever day 3 was, that the forecast for Day 5. Prior to that it looked like there could be more time in the match than there ended up being.

You say that but then Stokes referenced in his presser that they mat have to be more aggressive,therefore clearly he was aware it would be affected but unfortunately didn't show it

 

[Bevab]

Trying to force a result in three days on a pitch that isn't a paradise for bowlers is extremely difficult. I don't think there's any decision you could have taken in that test that would have resulted in an England win without the benefit of hindsight that would have also conceded a massive advantage to the Aussies. Now that is a valid play to make but you'd be absolutely torn apart if it fails and given that they already made a blunder in the first test with the premature declaration I can see why Stokes erred a bit on the side of caution this time.

The one thing England could have done was to make the pitch something resembling the South African ones under Gibson.

 

[wasteyouryouth]

You say that but then Stokes referenced in his presser that they mat have to be more aggressive,therefore clearly he was aware it would be affected but unfortunately didn't show it

I don't know what more they could've done. Trying to win in three days isn't exactly easy. Declare 30 overs earlier and the lead is halved, and Australia could easily have batted another 90 overs, which could leave England needing 150 in what could've turned out to be 10 overs.

Won't add anymore, @Bevab covered it.

 

[Croadyman]

Trying to force a result in three days on a pitch that isn't a paradise for bowlers is extremely difficult. I don't think there's any decision you could have taken in that test that would have resulted in an England win without the benefit of hindsight that would have also conceded a massive advantage to the Aussies. Now that is a valid play to make but you'd be absolutely torn apart if it fails and given that they already made a blunder in the first test with the premature declaration I can see why Stokes erred a bit on the side of caution this time.

The one thing England could have done was to make the pitch something resembling the South African ones under Gibson.

Yeah I am not disputing they had to take crazy risks like a ridiculously low declaration but it was the only way with such limited time. The problem was England thought we could bat Aussies out of the game and still have time to win.

 

[icyman]

Hansie Cronje's South Africa would have taken on Bazball with ease. Afterall, Cronje could convince. Nasser to declare on zero.

Expect,the English to try that out in the next Test...

 

[Ed Smith]

Hansie Cronje's South Africa would have taken on Bazball with ease. Afterall, Cronje could convince. Nasser to declare on zero.

Expect,the English to try that out in the next Test...

Hansie would have only been interested if he was getting the brown envelopes though...

 

[Paranoid Kendroid]

 

[pillowprocter]

The "retaining the Ashes" thing is a bit of a stupid concept in itself. If a team wins the Ashes and then the other team gets to their level and ties every series for 12 years, it'll go down as one team holding the Ashes for 12 years. It's just letting teams rest on their laurels.