General Cricket Discussion

[icyman]

Man! This guy and his whimsical accusations. While I am not a big fan of Bangladesh, its quite appalling that their board president stoops to such disgraceful levels. It has happened in the past with this fellow and his predecessor (which resulted in him not awarding the ICC trophy to the winning team).

Nazmul went to the extent of stating that he isn't allowed to sit down with the players. Thank Goodness for that! I mean, how much cricket has he played to make such wild statements?

If such mentality continues, Bangladesh will be back to their pre-2007 World Cup days.

 

[Satan666]

I have been critical of BCCI in the past but they have made a very good gesture, good work by the Pandya bros as well!

BCCI to donate 2000 oxygen concentrators towards India's Covid relief

Meanwhile, the Pandya brothers are also dispatching oxygen concentrators to the centres dealing with the crisis

www.espncricinfo.com

 

[Aislabie]

I figure this is a good place to dump random cricket thoughts

I've been watching the Sky Sports Cricket lockdown videos again, and the one where Rob Key picks his 2005-present World XI is absolutely criminal. Obviously it's without the likes of Ponting, Tendulkar, Lara et al as they're in the 1990-2004 XI, but even then it's not great. For example, he talks about not rating any of the spinners from this era and then when pushed picks Nathan Lyon, despite the fact that Jadeja and Ashwin - two of the top 10 spinners of all time - exist.

For what it's worth, my XI - which diverges from Key's from number five downwards:

Graeme Smith
Virender Sehwag
Kumar Sangakkara
Steve Smith
AB de Villiers
MS Dhoni
Ravindra Jadeja
Ravichandran Ashwin
Pat Cummins
Dale Steyn
Jimmy Anderson

In the original XI, de Villiers was picked to keep, but I felt a specialist keeper was more important and Dhoni was second to none when it came to keeping against spin. That brought it down to picking just one of AB and Kohli to bat at five, and I stuck with the more versatile player. But it's the spinners - Jadeja and Ashwin, with Jadeja averaging 36 as a batsman in the all-rounder's slot - that really set this side apart and it baffles me that they weren't in the original side.

I also reckon that a finger-spinning strategy for India's T20 bowling would be a decent one too:

Ravindra Jadeja
Ravichandran Ashwin
Washington Sundar
Axar Patel
Jasprit Bumrah
... another seamer I guess

That's a solid set of bowlers

 

[Bevab]

The fact that the top three are the oldest members shows how difficult batting has become for openers. Warner, Latham, Cook, Tamim and Karunaratne deserve a lot more credit than they receive for being outstanding in this period.

 

[ddrap14]

Cook

Which one?

 

[Aislabie]

The fact that the top three are the oldest members shows how difficult batting has become for openers. Warner, Latham, Cook, Tamim and Karunaratne deserve a lot more credit than they receive for being outstanding in this period.

Fully agreed

I think the reason I picked that particular opening pair is that Graeme Smith is my first-choice captain, and Sehwag being the ultimate match-winner. But Warner, Cook and Latham definitely would be the next cabs off the rank as I think they're head and shoulders above the other 2010s openers

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Which one?

Definitely not Stephen

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

The fact that the top three are the oldest members shows how difficult batting has become for openers. Warner, Latham, Cook, Tamim and Karunaratne deserve a lot more credit than they receive for being outstanding in this period.

If Vijay's injuries and Rahul inconsistencies were managed better they too would've been one amongst these. Lot of Vijay's 2013-16
performances aren't recognised as they should've been.

 

[Aislabie]

Today's thought-dump, a Welsh "Test" XI:

1. Phil Salt (Sussex)
2. Brad Wadlan (Swansea CC)
3. Nye Donald (Hampshire)
4. David Lloyd (Glamorgan)
5. Kiran Carlson (Glamorgan)
6. Callum Taylor (Glamorgan)
7. Chris Cooke (Glamorgan)
8. James Harris (Middlesex)
9. Prem Sisodiya (Glamorgan)
10. Michael Hogan (Glamorgan)
11. Lukas Carey (Glamorgan)

(Cooke and Hogan have both been with Glamorgan for plenty long enough to represent Wales, if such a team were to exist)

They wouldn't exactly be a world-beating team, but I still firmly believe that such a team would be a valuable addition to the cricketing landscape

 

[Satan666]

Today's thought-dump, a Welsh "Test" XI:

1. View attachment 250180 Phil Salt (Sussex)
2. View attachment 250180 Brad Wadlan (Swansea CC)
3. View attachment 250180 Nye Donald (Hampshire)
4. View attachment 250180 David Lloyd (Glamorgan)
5. View attachment 250180 Kiran Carlson (Glamorgan)
6. View attachment 250180 Callum Taylor (Glamorgan)
7. View attachment 250180 Chris Cooke (Glamorgan)
8. View attachment 250180 James Harris (Middlesex)
9. View attachment 250180 Prem Sisodiya (Glamorgan)
10. View attachment 250180 Michael Hogan (Glamorgan)
11. View attachment 250180 Lukas Carey (Glamorgan)

(Cooke and Hogan have both been with Glamorgan for plenty long enough to represent Wales, if such a team were to exist)

They wouldn't exactly be a world-beating team, but I still firmly believe that such a team would be a valuable addition to the cricketing landscape

I beg to differ, as we’ve seen with all the teams since Bangladesh’s grant of test status they have been wasted and downgraded the value of test cricket. I think people dont realize the skill level of test cricket, this aint fast food T20!

 

[Aislabie]

I beg to differ, as we’ve seen with all the teams since Bangladesh’s grant of test status they have been wasted and downgraded the value of test cricket. I think people dont realize the skill level of test cricket, this aint fast food T20!

What downgraded Test cricket was the imperialist nonsense of trying to keep it within a select band of teams, and of so many nations never being properly represented at all.

 

[Satan666]

What downgraded Test cricket was the imperialist nonsense of trying to keep it within a select band of teams, and of so many nations never being properly represented at all.

Really? Look if they want to put test cricket in a tier system then I am all for including a couple more teams but with the current system it simply does not make sense. Its already ludicrous as it is with Afghanistan having test status and they lack good local infrastructure!

So you want a Welsh test team, next you’ll want a Barbados Test 11 as well?

 

[ddrap14]

What downgraded Test cricket was the imperialist nonsense of trying to keep it within a select band of teams, and of so many nations never being properly represented at all.

I wholeheartedly agree with you. In my opinion the only way to improve nations is to give them more access to higher quality cricket. Bangladesh sure aren't Australia or India yet but they've come a long way from the days of Khaled Mahmud and co. And the one team that bucks this trend, Zimbabwe, have good reasons why they've bucked it.

 

[Satan666]

I wholeheartedly agree with you. In my opinion the only way to improve nations is to give them more access to higher quality cricket. Bangladesh sure aren't Australia or India yet but they've come a long way from the days of Khaled Mahmud and co. And the one team that bucks this trend, Zimbabwe, have good reasons why they've bucked it.

Yes certainly Bangladesh have come a long way indeed, winning 14 test matches out of 123 since gaining test status 20 years ago.

Countries need to have a strong first class system and proper facilities/cricket grounds before being given test status else we end up having a team still ranking at number 9 amongst test playing nations after 20 years!

 

[Aislabie]

Really? Look if they want to put test cricket in a tier system then I am all for including a couple more teams but with the current system it simply does not make sense. Its already ludicrous as it is with Afghanistan having test status and they lack good local infrastructure!

So you want a Welsh test team, next you’ll want a Barbados Test 11 as well?

I certainly would not oppose the West Indian nations representing themselves, though ultimately if the players' interests, career prospects and wellbeing are better served by the West Indies remaining together, then that is how things should remain because I've no interest in compromising people's livelihoods.

However, if we are looking at which teams I feel should have been allowed into the fold to play Test cricket and when, then that list would include:

1. England (1877*)
2. Australia (1877*)
3. United States (1878*)
4. Scotland (1882*)
5. Ireland (1888*)
6. Wales (1888*)
7. South Africa (1889*)
8. Barbados (1891)
9. Guyana (1891)
10. Trinidad & Tobago (1891)
11. Jamaica (1896)
12. Argentina (1912)
13. Canada (1913)
14. India (1926)
15. New Zealand (1926)
16. Fiji (1948)
17. Zimbabwe (1946, originally as Rhodesia)
18. Pakistan (1952)
19. Combined Islands (1961^)
20. Sri Lanka (1975)
21. Bermuda (1972)
22. Bangladesh (1986)
23. United Arab Emirates (1994)
24. Kenya (1996)
25. Netherlands (1996)
26. Namibia (2003)
27. Hong Kong (2004)
28. Uganda (2004)
29. Nepal (2005)
30. Afghanistan (2009)
31. Papua New Guinea (2014)
32. Oman (2019)
33. we are here...

* the concept of what a Test was would only be outlined some time later, with seemingly arbitrary distinctions made by a journalist. But we'll take his word for it
^ the Combined Islands team is in lieu of the tiny West Indian islands each having to field a team of their own - though they would have the right to do so if, like Antigua and Barbuda in the 1970s and 1980s, they had the infrastructure and/or players to make it happen.
Just because a team has the right to play in Test cricket does not mean that they are mandated to play Test cricket. To force present-day Argentina into a Test match would be silly - but with such opportunities, who is to say that Argentina would be in the position they are today?

Honestly, I would happily add more teams to that list. I probably have missed some, but you get the general idea. No team should be forced to play Test cricket, but every team should have the opportunity to play Test cricket. It is inarguable that many of those teams would ultimately have drifted out of Test cricket, but the important thing I keep stressing is that cricket gets nowhere by shutting itself away in its ivory tower and denying teams the chance to improve and players the chance to make a living.

I would also see Test cricket be organised with far more of a tournament structure, reminiscent to how international rugby is structured with the Six Nations and Rugby Championship, and a quadrennial World Cup in the format; rugby is a particularly apt comparison owing to the necessity of time off to allow players' bodies to recover between games - much like is needed between Test matches. The Six Nations sees teams play five games in seven weeks as more than that would be physically unachievable.