India Team Discussion

[Targaryen]

Does it really make sense to label someone a poor choice when he/she hasn't received an opportunity?

Correction. He HAS received many opportunities to show his Captaincy skills. But unfortunately he pulls out of all the important series in the last moment. This has been frequent from the time he was handed over the full time captaincy in all formats.

 

[Bigby Wolf]

Then there is no point cribbing about poor performances and player unavailability at all - it is all linked to the monster than is IPL

In Stranger Things terms: International cricketing world is Hawkins and IPL is the upside down. Baby Shah is Vecna and Dada is mind flayer. Better accept it because aint go no Eleven

Wait What?

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Correction. He HAS received many opportunities to show his Captaincy skills. But unfortunately he pulls out of all the important series in the last moment. This has been frequent from the time he was handed over the full time captaincy in all formats.

Oh so you are a part of Indian team or its management?

Once again the problem here isn't Rohit, but since he Captained MI that won 5 titles. And as usual people are going to hate on them!

The problem isn't even MI but the whole of Mumbai which is the epitome of Cricket history in India. What do you call it "Mumbai lobbying" right?

 

[Targaryen]

Oh so you are a part of Indian team or its management?

Context?

It's a fact. He has missed out on all the important series. You said he didn't get opportunity. On a contrary, he did get opportunity. Him not playing a series for whatsoever reason doesn't mean he did get opportunity.

 

[abhi_jacko]

Once again the problem here isn't Rohit, but since he Captained MI that won 5 titles. And as usual people are going to hate on them!

The problem isn't even MI but the whole of Mumbai which is the epitome of Cricket history in India. What do you call it "Mumbai lobbying" right?

LOL - this is just bizarre. Where is this coming from really?

Not everything is about mumbai indians. Are you saying you are okay with Rohit skipping yet another series because he needs rest and then cribbing about him not getting any chances to showcase his captaincy in India colors? Take off those MIPaltan glasses mate

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Take off those MIPaltan glasses mate

Lol is it what you came up with? Do you think I would care about MI more than Indian side after following Indian Cricket ball by ball for more than a decade?

Context?

Context? Right there you go.....

Yuzvender Chahal says 'I have a good relationship with Rohit bhai and Bhabhi', Jayant yadav says 'Rohit as a captain gives me a freehand.' and many others.

Thats called lobbying. Asking yourself to be heard and acknowledged. Persuading Rohit and BCCI to pick you. Having seen how calm and innocent Rohit is compared to Kohli, he might fall for this buttering. If they are deserving, you are more than welcome to give them the chance. But if they are not and you bring them in, that's where the problem arise. We have already experienced that with Pandya being picked in WC team for his stats even after his poor performance in IPL. Kohli failed there. Same shouldn't happen with Rohit. That's my point. All this praising thing happened when Rohit was picked and Kohli was kicked. My question is why now?

You had problems with players praising Rohit right? So it can be the reason that you might be critical of him for this Mumbai lobbying thing.

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

Are you saying you are okay with Rohit skipping yet another series because he needs rest and then cribbing about him not getting any chances to showcase his captaincy in India colors?

You assumed everything by yourself and then posted like those are my views. Seriously? When did I post those exact words?

 

[Targaryen]

Context? Right there you go....

Again, context? You asked me a question about Indian Team member or the BCCI. So I'm asking from where did it come. Not dig up something that still doesn't explain why you came up with that question.

I'll say my take on this and why I'm not happy with what's going on. I have been shouting out loud since this whole captaincy thing started last year.

Kohli stepped down from T20I captaincy stating he wants to concentrate more on ODI and Test. BCCI sacked him stating there cannot be two captains for limited overs. It's funny as to how we have been switching captains for different formats since Kohli was sacked.

Kohli was not convinced to stay which Kohli himself stated in press. His decision to step down was taken positively. Dada lied to the media about convincing him. Having not groomed any future captain under Kohli, it went to Rohit. Rohit is our future captain who can lead for next 5 yrs? Why sack Kohli and hand it over to injury prone Rohit? Just because Kohli didn't win any ICC trophy sack him. Mind you he has won most of games in ICC tournaments except for the playoffs.

It's not about who is favourite or who is the best captain here. If you were to replace Kohli atleast make sure you had a very good captain to replace him. Undoubtedly, Rohit has won 5 IPL titles and blah blah blah... But can he lead India full time just like Dhoni, Kohli did in their tenure? From current situation, it's clear Rohit won't be playing all the games. I know players need rest, but not when team needs you the most.

Just admit that Rohit is not the right candidate for captaincy considering his age & fitness. He has given all the reasons for that.

Management's reason to sack Kohli has backfired as they are not sure who will lead the team now. Pant, KLR, Rohit, Bumrah, Hardik, Dhawan.... Game of Thrones...

If Rohit can lead the team in all the games in all the 3 formats, and obviously rest against potentially weaker teams then all this discussion we are doing here will be proved wrong. And this way he can groom a youngster in next two years who can take over from him. All this is possible if he plays as a regular captain.

 

[WubbaLubbaDubDub]

I am big Rohit Sharma the captain fan but I completely agree to most what has been said here, BCCI need to admit they goofed up on captaincy or let Rohit know that they need to groom for future and given your injuries, we are moving on.

I think our captain ODI and T20 captain should be either Hardik or Pant. No matter what anyone tells me KLR should not be close to the captaincy. For test matches, if Pant is our keeper, let him captain all 3 formats. If Hardik makes it to the test side, make him the captain.

Also Kohli needs to stop doing musical chair. He has to be part of all the series that gets played as he has had plenty of rest in the last few years. We too are expected to show up at work as normal humans and get weekends and holidays off, it should be the same with Cricketrers.

Look at Baseball, they freaking play 160 games in one season starting March up until October. I get it they are not playing all 12 months but they play almost every day. The time they are off, November, December, Jan and Feb is 120 days. That is amount of days cricketers might be getting anyways.

 

[Bevab]

Am I the only one who struggles to understand the hoopla or smoke that has been blown about this issue?

Firstly, the lack of planning for replacements is something that has been present for a long, long time. The reason? We've certainly given in to too much player power over the previous decade. Remember MSD carrying on in the white ball formats way beyond his peak? This denied any chance for a proper replacement being groomed in the supposed transition period prior to his retirement as any such thing was taken as a perceived insult or threat to his spot in the side. And guess what? We've struggled to actually replace him in white ball cricket since. The most natural replacement in Pant still has question marks over his ODI spot and his T20I record is awful.

The second one? The supposed phasing out of our finger spinners in white ball cricket. We were told that they would no longer be a part as we would seek more attacking spin bowling options instead. Guess who got called up for the last white ball tournament of ours?

And finally the elephant in the room. Captaincy. Kohli's deputy for the longest of times in both the longer and shorter formats were players in his age bracket (who also happened to be actually better than him in their limited appearances). The next bloke in line was a certain Dhawan and he was even older! The other blokes like Ashwin and Bhuvi were never really given serious backing. It is also important to note that certain players like Vijay, Pandey, Raina and Nair were indeed earmarked as future leadership material but never really progressed to the point where they were considered serious leadership prospects in the case of Vijay or never really managed to break in the playing XI consistently like Nair or Pandey. Raina had his own demons to battle physically and mentally too. I'm not even sure if it's worth mentioning the fact that we had our veterans in Gambhir, Sehwag and Zaheer act as captains in the IPL in their twilight years which robbed us of even more captaincy options.

In a nutshell the first serious captaincy option we did eventually get was Shreyas Iyer when he got to lead Delhi Daredevils after his domestic stint with Mumbai's state team and we seem to have exploded in options over the last year or so. Which is the way it should have been over the past decade. Instead, we've had no proper grooming approach for taking over from Kohli just like we did with Dhoni. Was it again over it being perceived as a threat to his role in the side? We'll never know now. What I do know is that it is squarely the previous management's fault for not leaving behind a proper succession setup. And I do believe we're already on our way to rectify this in the IPL. Kohli's already stepped down from his role as RCB captain, Dhoni did give it a shot (quite unsuccessfully) and we learned that Jadeja is not captaincy material even for a transition period in the meantime. No worries though as it feels inevitable that Gaikwad will one day become captain at CSK. Rohit Sharma seems to have a padawan in Kishan already with a potential temporary leader in SKY if the need arises. Pant, Shreyas, Rahul, Mayank and Hardik are all in their supposed prime ages and are leading franchises themselves.

As for the decision to select Rohit Sharma, honestly who would have been your pick a few months ago when this decision was supposed to have been made? I know it has become a bit of a meme to mention it again but winning five IPL trophies does matter if a bloke like Pandya can get into contention on the back of winning just one with no other real previous domestic experience. Sharma's shown plenty of skills to be considered as an excellent white ball captain for one. His calculated risks have generally paid off which to me is a key and often underrated aspect of captaincy. He has been shown to be a more composed figure as a leader which suits our team's profile (although he has appeared anxious and angry quite often compared to his usual standards in Indian colours ever since becoming captain). It is a bit difficult to judge given the strength of the famed Mumbai lobby but he is well respected as a player and person which helps in player management. And finally, his tactics in white ball cricket have always been pretty good. I don't think he is as good as Dhoni is, especially when it comes extracting the maximum from a minimum but I don't think he needs to be when we've got a high quality squad that just needs some proper backing, coaching and tactical planning.

It also makes sense to go for the tried and tested approach because we do have two white ball tournaments back to back. The second of these happens to be held in India too. Given the fact that the last three ODI WC's have all been won by the host nation there will be no doubt that we will be regarded as the favourite in this one by the media and fans alike. Managing that sort of pressure and expectation is no mean task. Just read up the accounts of how difficult it was already back in 2011 with a squad full of legendary players and rising stars who all were well versed in managing that sort of pressure. We need our best man on it and is there any doubt as to it not being Rohit Sharma? I genuinely don't think throwing a new man into the helm with just one white ball tournament under his belt and a year's worth of international leadership experience where there'll already be heavy scrutiny to make up for the previous failure would be any wise. It could potentially derail an entire player's career if they are not capable of stepping up to it, not to mention the impact it'll have on the rest of the squad. In adddition, this is a certain set of players who'll mostly bow out after the 2023 WC or be phased out steadily by many accounts. It would be a lot better if we actually give the new man a fresh start without this baggage to shape a new team in his image with a new core.

The biggest criticism I've seen Sharma face is to do with his absence rather than presence funnily enough. The amount of cricket the Indian side plays is quite insane these days. We're third on the list of most matches played in the last three years (West Indies and England are the only ones higher) and like England we've sometimes played two series quite close to each other or concurrently which means multiple squads and more players and potentially more captains. I also find it funny that it is the same Indian fans who criticize our senior players for taking breaks or sitting out certain series' whilst also supporting other countries' players individual rights to represent themselves on the biggest stages as something that they should only decide. Think back to how much criticism CSA received for not bending to AbD's very own non-committal ideas, Faf and Tahir's phasing out and also how much everyone was in support of QDK's sudden test retirement without warning. Not to mention the flak the West Indies board received for attempting to rein in their T20 stars. I'm not suggesting that these boards were faultless, indeed some of their handling was questionable but it is funny how the players get criticized mercilessly in India and how the players are treated completely differently by these same fans? Pretty sure it has nothing to do with a certain Indian T20 league....

I do think his injury record is a concern and it will have to be managed but for what should be at max a year's stint if everything goes according to plan? I don't mind him sitting out the odd series versus West Indies or Ireland or even South Africa at times if it means he's fully fit for when it matters. As long as shows that he hasn't lost touch and appears to be in good form with the backing of his players, support staff with the results and right approach on the ground to his leadership, I think Rohit Sharma is our best bet until the 2023 WC. Him missing out on these smaller series' does also mean more experience for the next guy in line which helps even more with the inevitable transition as an unintended consequence. I do agree with him being on the teetering edge of slipping out being unavailable too often at the moment and it is good that the decision for him to return to the squad for the West Indies series is being considered.

The eighth captain in the eighth series' does feel like another meme worthy point but if you just dig deeper into it you'll find that a large part of it has been due to an injury pushing our first choice captain out of the side or his deputy. The only other time this has happened is when we've had two series' in close proximity to each other making it quite difficult logistically, physically and mentally to do the job concurrently. A bit of bad luck and coincidence has led to this situation and reading too much into it achieves no purpose. For comparison's sake, South Africa and Australia have had six captains in this decade. I do hope that all of this talk of wanting Rohit Sharma out is just frustration from him missing out on too many games and not something seriously considered as an actual plan.

Finally, notice how I've made no mention of Sharma the test captain? That is because I do think he should have never been the permanent test captain. We shouldn't be doing one captain for all formats given that none of the other six sides to have played the most number of matches this decade do so for one. I do understand that Rahane's terminal decline in form has necessitated this move but we should have phased the latter out earlier expecting this and tried to groom someone else for the leadership role even before that. I still think the wise move would be for Sharma to focus on white ball cricket and his leadership there. The wisest move with the current mess in place would be to give your potential captaincy options some Ranji Trophy experience and monitor their progress whilst Rohit Sharma gets done with the Aussie series at home as a temporary leader. We should ideally have decided on the next captain by then.

 

[SaiSrini]

Kohli asks to be rested for Windies T20Is; Ashwin set for recall

Former captain Virat Kohli has asked to be rested from the entire limited overs series against the West Indies next month, including the five T20Is, BCCI sources said.

m.rediff.com

If this is true, selectors should ask Kohli to take a call on his limited overs career. There hasn’t really been that much cricket that he seems to have played, and these breaks are getting very frequent. He wants to skip a T20 series, just months away from the World Cup.

To me, it clearly looks like he’s not interested in the T20 format anymore. I think the time has come for BCCI to seriously think about moving on from Kohli, atleast in T20s for now. There is still time to drop him from the WC this year and not lose anything. Hooda is doing well, Hardik is back, SKY is there and DK has staked a huge claim.

 

[icyman]

Kohli asks to be rested for Windies T20Is; Ashwin set for recall

Former captain Virat Kohli has asked to be rested from the entire limited overs series against the West Indies next month, including the five T20Is, BCCI sources said.

m.rediff.com

If this is true, selectors should ask Kohli to take a call on his limited overs career. There hasn’t really been that much cricket that he seems to have played, and these breaks are getting very frequent. He wants to skip a T20 series, just months away from the World Cup.

To me, it clearly looks like he’s not interested in the T20 format anymore. I think the time has come for BCCI to seriously think about moving on from Kohli, atleast in T20s for now. There is still time to drop him from the WC this year and not lose anything. Hooda is doing well, Hardik is back, SKY is there and DK has staked a huge claim.

TOI reported that the selectors have given an ultimatum to him regards his form in the limited overs format. If he is unable to showcase his skills in the current Eng series, he might be out of reckoning.

To your point on T20- I believe that for the first time since 2007 we have gotten an exciting line-up. The side that played yesterday can be refined further and bolstered with the addition of a few specialists. However, from what I have seen, this team that took on Ireland and England yest, we are playing fearless cricket- there's no longer the run accumulation that happens at the to- easing of the batsmen in- the way Rahul and Rohit do. Taking this squad to the World Cup might be a good idea.

Just riding on the 1st point, maybe the time has come for the selectors to push out Kohli, Rahul from the T20 side. This is purely based on the fact that the likes of Samson and Hooda are giving the side much needed impetus in terms of scoring. I wouldn't ask to remove Rohit as he deserves a fair urn until the WT20, post which it ought to be Hardik all the way.

 

[icyman]

Happy to see this. No matter how many people berate these guys, I'm 100% in agreement here.

Sourav Ganguly and Jay Shah unhappy with Virat, Rohit and Bumrah - Report

Since playing in the ICC T20 World Cup in 2021, Rohit has missed out on both home and away series against South Africa.

crictoday.com

 

[abhi_jacko]

Lol is it what you came up with? Do you think I would care about MI more than Indian side after following Indian Cricket ball by ball for more than a decade?

Definitely sounded like it once you started defending Rohit and his regular unavailability with bizarre victimisation that people are jealous of his 5 IPL wins

Folks in this thread seem to be not understanding the critique being made of Rohit here. It has nothing to do with his talent and no one is doubting his captaincy or even his place in the side. In fact, on the contrary, the critics want to see him in the side. The problem has been Rohit's long list of injuries which are often fitness related (hamstring, calf, etc) and then the frequent rests that he avails - it just hasn't let us have a settled lineup in a while. And its even more glaring now that he is an all-format captain

 

[abhi_jacko]

Happy to see this. No matter how many people berate these guys, I'm 100% in agreement here.

Sourav Ganguly and Jay Shah unhappy with Virat, Rohit and Bumrah - Report

Since playing in the ICC T20 World Cup in 2021, Rohit has missed out on both home and away series against South Africa.

crictoday.com

Agree with this although Bumrah and Pant are understandable. Pant has been playing non stop and Bumrah being a bowler needs to be managed well

Also who are Shah and Dada to question this - aren't they the ones responsible for all the hectic and almost impossible scheduling which is causing player burnout?