Realistic goals for International Cricket 2010?

Instead, they said that it was our fault for not playing realistically or not playing the game how it should be played
Well for one, it is. If you approach the game thinking, "I'm going to smash every ball", then no amount of AI can stop you from doing that. Once you've learnt all the AI tricks and are able to hit the buttons in time, you will no doubt score really quickly.

If you play the game in an unrealistic way, how can it not make unrealistic results?

Yes, there's a lot you can do to try and minimise this, but people will keep finding the places where they can exploit a bug or score easy runs, and there's only so much a developer can account for.

It is the developer's fault when the game is too easily understood, and too scripted in its possibilities, and there's often reason to be annoyed about it. But there is a difference between the game being too easy, and issues in a game created by creating situations which are un-cricketing and expecting a perfect AI reaction.

Hopefully AC09 has made them go back and look at areas where the AI was too easy, but they are in my view right when they suggest that there's some element of blame on the person playing, it doesn't remove their need to improve things, but it certainly explains why there are some who just won't ever find a cricket game good enough for them.

If you find IC010 too easy, just play drunk.
 
You can't win 10-0 in every single match of FIFA 10 on Legendary (there are few people who can even win 1), so ideally, you shouldn't be able to smash every ball to the boundary in a cricket game. In real life, there are consequences for being overly aggressive. I understand that a game is not a perfect simulation of real life, but preventing the user from going ballistic and getting away with it is a fairly basic requirement in a cricket game.
 
I agree with you so much.
If you play a test match and
hit the ball all the time for 4 and 6,
then its not a test match.
But they need to fix a few things to.
About 1 or 2 no balls every 10 to 20 overs is
a start. Also is ic2010 edges are fixed and the
computer does not drop so many catches then im
happy, plus better field setting to in test and t20, 50.
Then i will be happy and most people will to.:yes
 
Well for one, it is. If you approach the game thinking, "I'm going to smash every ball", then no amount of AI can stop you from doing that. Once you've learnt all the AI tricks and are able to hit the buttons in time, you will no doubt score really quickly.

If you play the game in an unrealistic way, how can it not make unrealistic results?

Yes, there's a lot you can do to try and minimise this, but people will keep finding the places where they can exploit a bug or score easy runs, and there's only so much a developer can account for.

It is the developer's fault when the game is too easily understood, and too scripted in its possibilities, and there's often reason to be annoyed about it. But there is a difference between the game being too easy, and issues in a game created by creating situations which are un-cricketing and expecting a perfect AI reaction.

Hopefully AC09 has made them go back and look at areas where the AI was too easy, but they are in my view right when they suggest that there's some element of blame on the person playing, it doesn't remove their need to improve things, but it certainly explains why there are some who just won't ever find a cricket game good enough for them.

If you find IC010 too easy, just play drunk.

I beg to differ... we should not be constraining ourselves to play a certain way just too get a realistic game. The onus should be on AI (game developers) to ensure the game is as realistic as possible. This is 2010 and we have cricket games on consoles for more than 10 years now, and it is quite disappointing that the game developers still haven't managed to create anywhere close to a realistic cricket game.

As an example I play Madden NFL and you don't have to play within yourself to have a realistic game. If I continue to throw every down AI adjusts and I start getting intercepted. Similarly if I try to run every down, AI loads the box and you are forced to adjust. However in AC09 I could score at more than 12 an over comfortably in TEST matched on HARD mode!!! Come on there has to be something drastically wrong somewhere.

The game should have at least basic logic to have some sort of relationship between risk (getting out while going for shots) and rewards (scoring runs at a fast pace). Currently it seems I can score runs without worrying about getting out. This flaw in the game goes against the basic fundamental of cricket and thus makes the game unplayable other than in the multiplayer mode, which I feel is a shame.
 
My opinion on this is a bit of both. Quite often, you'll see people scoring at 12 an over but getting out for 200 or 300. That sort of score is less than you should really be aiming for in a Test match, so although you might score quickly, you're getting out cheap, so the required risk/reward is there. Sometimes this is not the case, however, as people can learn the game so they can constantly score 1000 runs in an innings, as we have seen from numerous record/screenshot threads.

The thing which causes this (which I have banged on about for ages) is that as far as I can tell, the timing for all shots is identical against a certain speed of bowler (unless they bowl a slower ball). The problem here is that no matter how small you make the timing window for the batsman, the middle of that window is still the middle, so if you learn to time it so you get 'perfect', you will always be OK.

To remedy this, the timing window should be made larger (probably only slightly larger) and should actually be different for different deliveries. The way the batting system works currently is very fair and gives good feedback, in that if you are late on the shot, you tend towards an outside edge, and if you are early you tend towards and inside edge - this is pretty much how it works in the real world when playing outside off stump. In real life, if you are facing an outswinger or an away-cutter and you don't account for the movement (or just don't notice it) you will likely get an outside edge or miss the ball entirely. To reflect this, the timing window should move slightly forward, so that if you play your normal timing, you get an outside edge or miss it. The reverse would be true for an inswinger/in-cutter. This would also work for facing spinners.

In order for this to work, you also need for the batsman to be able to see the ball type before he plays his shot, so he can adjust his timing as necessary. The point at which this is shown can be related to the batsman's eye-in and judgement scores. The amount of movement in the timing window should be determined by the ball condition, bowler rating, pitch condition, weather, ball execution quality, and most importantly, ball length: if bowling a swinging delivery, to get a lot of movement in the timing window, you should need to bowl fuller (but too full and the ball becomes a half-volley and the timing window should be made larger, as with the current hotspot system); if bowling a cutter, the fuller you bowl, the less timing window movement, but if you drop too short you again have a larger timing window, so the movement doesn't make that much difference.

As for making more realistic matches, what this system allows you to do is to let the bowler bowl a ball to beat the batsman. At present, he can't do that as the perfect timing window is always in the same place.

There are some extra considerations that would need to be made with this idea, though. For example, you could make batting extremely hard by changing the delivery type every single ball, so the timing window is constantly changing. This tends not to work in real cricket as the bowler loses rhythm, and the batsman finds it easier to adjust to the different delivery types. To stop this, you'd have to have some kind of penalty for constantly changing your delivery type, so that bowling a different delivery ball after ball becomes harder, unless your confidence is absolutely sky-high, in which case you should be able to keep varying your delivery.

Mechanics like this, in my opinion, provide a much better way of representing the fight between ball and bat in cricket. I hate the idea of the bowler confidence, ball execution, and line/length simply combining to make a multiplier for the size of the timing window.
 
Well I have played all the many games out there and it amazes me that a game like cricket 04 can give me that sense of having to really play for my runs. Yes it has lots of faults but the pacing of the game and the AI is excellent. How is it possible that a game 7 years old beats all other contenders in terms of game play, which is what we all crave for, hands down. I am not trying to hijack the thread by being a salesperson for this particular game but I just know what can be achieved in this area but isn't.
 
Bowling in C04 was way too awful for me. If only you could control the swing of the ball in that game :noway
 
The thing which causes this (which I have banged on about for ages) is that as far as I can tell, the timing for all shots is identical against a certain speed of bowler (unless they bowl a slower ball). The problem here is that no matter how small you make the timing window for the batsman, the middle of that window is still the middle, so if you learn to time it so you get 'perfect', you will always be OK.

To remedy this, the timing window should be made larger (probably only slightly larger) and should actually be different for different deliveries. The way the batting system works currently is very fair and gives good feedback, in that if you are late on the shot, you tend towards an outside edge, and if you are early you tend towards and inside edge - this is pretty much how it works in the real world when playing outside off stump. In real life, if you are facing an outswinger or an away-cutter and you don't account for the movement (or just don't notice it) you will likely get an outside edge or miss the ball entirely. To reflect this, the timing window should move slightly forward, so that if you play your normal timing, you get an outside edge or miss it. The reverse would be true for an inswinger/in-cutter. This would also work for facing spinners.

In order for this to work, you also need for the batsman to be able to see the ball type before he plays his shot, so he can adjust his timing as necessary. The point at which this is shown can be related to the batsman's eye-in and judgement scores. The amount of movement in the timing window should be determined by the ball condition, bowler rating, pitch condition, weather, ball execution quality, and most importantly, ball length: if bowling a swinging delivery, to get a lot of movement in the timing window, you should need to bowl fuller (but too full and the ball becomes a half-volley and the timing window should be made larger, as with the current hotspot system); if bowling a cutter, the fuller you bowl, the less timing window movement, but if you drop too short you again have a larger timing window, so the movement doesn't make that much difference.

The key to making any sports based video game work is to have a competitive AI. I think we are not naive enough to believe that a sports game can simulate the actual sport or gameplay since there are way too many variables to factor in. But I am sure game developers have enough know-how to give us a cricket game which has competitive AI. Currently our only hope is online or multi-player gameplay as you can easily beat AI even on HARD mode after just 2-3 days of gtting a new game.

I think cricket game developers should take a look at Madden series (one of my favorite sports based game) regarding pointers on how to make the game more competitive. Developers don't even need to overhaul or modify existing logic... the only thing they need to do is implement a slider based difficulty level which shouldn't be too hard and it will give us a very competitive AI to play against...

Some of the sliders I can think of are as follows and maybe game developers can modify this list as they are closer to the game codebase...

1. Catching - Slider at 0% means all catches are dropped and at 100% all catches are caught

2. Fielding - Slider at 0% means fielders misfield everything and at 100% AI is close to aussies in the field

3. Running - Slider at 0% means plenty of run-outs in the game similar to AC09 and at 100% AI doesn't get run out at all!

4. Batting - Slider at 0% means AI batters play risky shots and chances are they will get bowled out fairly quickly, and at 100% AI seldom plays a false shot and basically slider at 100% is AI batting in GOD mode

5. Bowling - Slider at 0% means plenty of freebies on offer and AI seldom bowling to its field whereas at 100% every ball is on line and length and according to its field

6. Extras - Slider at 0% means you can expect wides and no-balls every few deliveries similar to what we have in AC09 and at 100% the AI doesn't bowl any no-balls or wides at all.

Tweaking these sliders will provide sufficient replay value and should satisfy everyone - right from noobies to hard-core cricket fans.
 
The key to making any sports based video game work is to have a competitive AI. I think we are not naive enough to believe that a sports game can simulate the actual sport or gameplay since there are way too many variables to factor in. But I am sure game developers have enough know-how to give us a cricket game which has competitive AI. Currently our only hope is online or multi-player gameplay as you can easily beat AI even on HARD mode after just 2-3 days of gtting a new game.

I think cricket game developers should take a look at Madden series (one of my favorite sports based game) regarding pointers on how to make the game more competitive. Developers don't even need to overhaul or modify existing logic... the only thing they need to do is implement a slider based difficulty level which shouldn't be too hard and it will give us a very competitive AI to play against...

Some of the sliders I can think of are as follows and maybe game developers can modify this list as they are closer to the game codebase...

1. Catching - Slider at 0% means all catches are dropped and at 100% all catches are caught

2. Fielding - Slider at 0% means fielders misfield everything and at 100% AI is close to aussies in the field

3. Running - Slider at 0% means plenty of run-outs in the game similar to AC09 and at 100% AI doesn't get run out at all!

4. Batting - Slider at 0% means AI batters play risky shots and chances are they will get bowled out fairly quickly, and at 100% AI seldom plays a false shot and basically slider at 100% is AI batting in GOD mode

5. Bowling - Slider at 0% means plenty of freebies on offer and AI seldom bowling to its field whereas at 100% every ball is on line and length and according to its field

6. Extras - Slider at 0% means you can expect wides and no-balls every few deliveries similar to what we have in AC09 and at 100% the AI doesn't bowl any no-balls or wides at all.

Tweaking these sliders will provide sufficient replay value and should satisfy everyone - right from noobies to hard-core cricket fans.

But unless you change the bat v ball mechanic, you still have this problem of perfect timing being exactly the same every ball. Even if you make the window tiny, good players can still hit every ball for 4/6, no matter how many sliders you make.
 
Does anyone have any inside information on if you can save an online game in this edition?! I know a mate of mine wont buy it if u cant.
 
Well I have played all the many games out there and it amazes me that a game like cricket 04 can give me that sense of having to really play for my runs. Yes it has lots of faults but the pacing of the game and the AI is excellent. How is it possible that a game 7 years old beats all other contenders in terms of game play, which is what we all crave for, hands down. I am not trying to hijack the thread by being a salesperson for this particular game but I just know what can be achieved in this area but isn't.

Cricket 04 is still the best cricket game for me.
 
Does anyone have any inside information on if you can save an online game in this edition?!
You don't need to post that in every thread.

PC asked about online saving in our Q&A but,

For full disclosure, "Another online issue was mid-game dropouts, what has been done in regards to connection stability and is there now an option to save an online game, which is really a must for playing the longer forms of the game?" was asked and omitted. All other questions were answered as asked.
http://www.planetcricket.org/forums/1782566-post6.html

I think it's fair to take that as a no.
 
Fills me with real hope that answer does!
Putting in a save option like you have in 1 player mode could proberbly be done in a lunch break its so simple!!!
 
I was hoping they let us choose the number of overs in a session, that way if we played 10 overs a session you could complete a test in one sitting.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top