West Indies Tour of England - July 2020

[wasteyouryouth]

In theory, getting Brathwaite back to his best as an opener averaging close to 40 (and by the looks of those two fifties, he might well be on the right track) and blunting the new ball should help along with Chase actually being allowed to play as a batting all-rounder at four or even three who bowls a bit rather than the primary spinner. The man can clearly bat as he has shown in this series. Brooks doesn't look too shabby and should be fine in the short-term and having Holder in the top seven should help. I would personally just go with one of Blackwood or Hetmyer, both of them in the same lineup would mean a collapse every other game haha. The second opener is the real worry, time to give da Silva run maybe?

1. Brathwaite
2. Da Silva?
3. Brooks
4. Chase
5. Blackwood/Hetmyer
6. Dowrich
7. Holder
   
8. Cornwall

Haven't included Bravo here given how poor he was versus India but if he does return to his best he should walk back in for Brooks. A lack of batsmen who can contribute a big innings is an issue but Cornwall all the way down at eight and with one of Joseph or Paul to follow offers some decent depth at least in home conditions.

As for Hope, he reminds me of a Kusal Mendis in reverse. Continues to be picked in the one format owing to performances in the other and a playing style that should on paper work but at least he does have the domestic record to show that he is capable. Axing him to allow some work on his issues should do him a world of good.

On paper, or in terms of talent it looks a good line-up. But their recent records is the equivalent of six Joe Denlys (or worse). Can only assume there just isn't the talent coming through otherwise they'd get a chance. Brooks looks good but already 30+ as is Bonner who i think was the top batter in the first class tournament. Think he bowls a little too.

The fact Hope hasn't played a first class game in three years would suggest he needs that to find some form instead of just failing in Test cricket.

Agree about Blackwood and Hetmyer, although I think Blackwood is slightly better suited I think Hetmyer is more talented.

Dowrich at six and Holder at seven would make sense. It would allow a front line spinner or a fifth seamer if they really needed one (I think Chase does a decent job - certainly against England). But it also shortens their batting line up - although Dowrich and Holder have been their most reliable in recent times.[DOUBLEPOST=1595249333][/DOUBLEPOST]

I have been really impressed with Woakes this test as I have said he looks fitter and more dangerous than i have seen him in the past

It's the beard.

 

[AsadRM]

Broad!!!

Take a bow!

 

[Dutch]

Classic broad bowling: you cant leave this man out!

 

[Ed Smith]

Broady looks mean here. Game for winning the match on his own in these next 2 sessions

 

[Dutch]

Cant see anything than an England win at the mo. They will need to keep plugging away to get the next few wickets, don't go chasing em, let em come!

 

[Dutch]

Broady looks mean here. Game for winning the match on his own in these next 2 sessions

There doesn't seem anyone in the Windies line-up who is up to the task....although Blackwood might be calling on his Inner Stoksie....

 

[Aislabie]

The West Indian batting is really curious - a bunch of guys good enough to average 30 in Test cricket batting all the way down to eight (apart from Campbell, and seemingly Hope) but nobody who's really taking that step towards being a genuinely good Test batsman. The quality of domestic cricket - not only the surfaces but the players: Orlando Peters (FC avg: 15.61; inn/50: 15.25), Akeem Saunders (FC avg: 19.50, inn/50: 23.00) and Trevon Griffith (FC avg: 17.51, inn/50: 19.50) are all stealing a living as specialist batsmen on the domestic circuit, and have been for some years. So weak is the player pool that both Rajendra Chandrika (FC avg: 25.30, inn/50: 7.93) and Kyle Hope (FC avg: 29.76, 5.29) have been rewarded for not being completely terrible with Test caps.

Am I cherry-picking some of the worst examples? Undoubtedly yes, but it's a widespread problem. So one would suggest that the problem isn't going to be solved within the West Indian system, as it is currently.

Who are the players that should be invested in as batting prospects? For me, it's these guys:

OPENING BATSMEN - Incumbents: Brathwaite and Campbell
Kraigg Brathwaite - Age: 27, FC avg: 38.13, inn/50: 3.79, FC 100s: 22
Tagenarine Chanderpaul - Age: 24, FC avg: 29.18, inn/50: 6.83, FC 100s: 2
Shayne Moseley - Age: 26, FC avg: 31.48, inn/50: 4.08, FC 100s: 3

TOP-ORDER BATSMEN - Incumbents - Hope and Brooks
Sunil Ambris - Age: 27, FC avg: 30.98, inn/50: 5.10, FC 100s: 7
Kevlon Anderson - Age: 19, yet to debut
Joshua Da Silva - Age: 22, FC avg: 32.88, inn/50: 4.67, FC 100s: 1
Shai Hope - Age: 26, FC avg: 36.13, inn/50: 5.00, FC 100s: 8
Brandon King - Age: 25, FC avg: 34.15, inn/50: 3.86, FC 100s: 2

MIDDLE-ORDER BATSMEN - Incumbents: Chase and Blackwood
Shimron Hetmyer - Age: 23, FC avg: 31.71, inn/50: 5.38, FC 100s: 1
Kyle Mayers - Age: 27, FC avg: 30.84, inn/50: 3.50, FC 100s: 2
Nicholas Pooran - Age: 24, FC avg: 23.83, inn/50: 6.00, FC 100s: 0

The only three players on that list with more than three first-class hundreds are Sunil Ambris, Kraigg Brathwaite and Shai Hope which strongly suggests a broken first-class system. Normally you would expect someone to be doing well even if just to be the outlier that proves the rule, but there's nobody like that in the West Indies' domestic circuit. Nobody, in a season where teams played eight matches each, scored more than two hundreds. The competition's leading run-scorer was a middle-order dasher with one century in 30 Tests, who tends to get out caught at mid-off.

West Indian domestic cricket does not reward patient batting, nor does it teach players how to build an innings.

If players can't get that experience there, then they should seek it elsewhere: collaborate with other cricket boards to get promising batsmen into competitions like Grade Cricket, County (or Minor Counties) Cricket, Provincial Cricket or the Premier Trophy. Even if these aren't the highest standard of cricket, they can still help young players to learn the skills that they currently don't learn in the Caribbean.

 

[Bevab]

On paper, or in terms of talent it looks a good line-up. But their recent records is the equivalent of six Joe Denlys (or worse). Can only assume there just isn't the talent coming through otherwise they'd get a chance. Brooks looks good but already 30+ as is Bonner who i think was the top batter in the first class tournament. Think he bowls a little too.

The fact Hope hasn't played a first class game in three years would suggest he needs that to find some form instead of just failing in Test cricket.

Agree about Blackwood and Hetmyer, although I think Blackwood is slightly better suited I think Hetmyer is more talented.

Dowrich at six and Holder at seven would make sense. It would allow a front line spinner or a fifth seamer if they really needed one (I think Chase does a decent job - certainly against England). But it also shortens their batting line up - although Dowrich and Holder have been their most reliable in recent times.[DOUBLEPOST=1595249333][/DOUBLEPOST]

I did go and look back at Brathwaite's record over the last three years along with a look at how openers have fared in general. This most definitely is a lean period for openers with a few like Karunaratne, Warner, Markram looking unbeatable at home but unable to replicate it away. Some like Latham, Masood and Agarwal have fared very well at home and are decent away too. And then there have been the likes of Rory Burns, Elgar who do an adequate to decent job everywhere along with some anomalies like Jennings (bless him) and Tamim Iqbal who at the moment look better away than at home. And Brathwaite averages less than Campbell over the last three years! He has the likes of KL Rahul, Raval, Harris and Bancroft for company and given that none of them are first choice players now it shows how bad Brathwaite has been and how lucky he is that a lack of alternatives has kept him in the team.

I still think this team could easily do better, Chase and Dowrich for example have been adequate but can easily be better with more focus on their batting (their first-class records indicate that there is a lot more to come). A big problem is how pace friendly the pitches have become in recent times over at home. From looking at his overall record, Bonner just appears to be a Chase clone although he might have improved now (@qpeedore could elaborate perhaps). Hope's predicament of not playing a single fC game is the thing that reminded me of Mendis, for a long period he was just going through the motions in ODIs despite not having an actually decent domestic record and was never dropped to rectify it either.

I do think that a bit of coaching could improve their side. Will be interesting to see what Simmons does. Chase is okay-ish for a second spinner but when you have a spinner like Cornwall on the bench and a lack of batting prospects, it makes sense to ask the guy with a good record domestically and looks the part to be more of a batsman than a bowler.

 

[Bevab]

The West Indian batting is really curious - a bunch of guys good enough to average 30 in Test cricket batting all the way down to eight (apart from Campbell, and seemingly Hope) but nobody who's really taking that step towards being a genuinely good Test batsman. The quality of domestic cricket - not only the surfaces but the players: Orlando Peters (FC avg: 15.61; inn/50: 15.25), Akeem Saunders (FC avg: 19.50, inn/50: 23.00) and Trevon Griffith (FC avg: 17.51, inn/50: 19.50) are all stealing a living as specialist batsmen on the domestic circuit, and have been for some years. So weak is the player pool that both Rajendra Chandrika (FC avg: 25.30, inn/50: 7.93) have been rewarded for not being completely terrible with Test caps.

Am I cherry-picking some of the worst examples? Undoubtedly yes, but it's a widespread problem. So one would suggest that the problem isn't going to be solved within the West Indian system, as it is currently.

Who are the players that should be invested in as batting prospects? For me, it's these guys:

OPENING BATSMEN
Kraigg Brathwaite - Age: 27, FC avg: 38.13, inn/50: 3.79, FC 100s: 22
Tagenarine Chanderpaul - Age: 24, FC avg: 29.18, inn/50: 6.83, FC 100s: 2
Shayne Moseley - Age: 26, FC avg: 31.48, inn/50: 4.08, FC 100s: 3

TOP-ORDER BATSMEN
Sunil Ambris - Age: 27, FC avg: 30.98, inn/50: 5.10, FC 100s: 7
Kevlon Anderson - Age: 19, yet to debut
Joshua Da Silva - Age: 22, FC avg: 32.88, inn/50: 4.67, FC 100s: 1
Brandon King - Age: 25, FC avg: 34.15, inn/50: 3.86, FC 100s: 2

MIDDLE-ORDER BATSMEN
Shimron Hetmyer - Age: 23, FC avg: 31.71, inn/50: 5.38, FC 100s: 1
Kyle Mayers - Age: 27, FC avg: 30.84, inn/50: 3.50, FC 100s: 2
Nicholas Pooran - Age: 24, FC avg: 23.83, inn/50: 6.00, FC 100s: 0

The only two players on that list with more than three first-class hundreds are Sunil Ambris and Kraigg Brathwaite, which strongly suggests a broken first-class system. Normally you would expect someone to be doing well even if just to be the outlier that proves the rule, but there's nobody like that in the West Indies' domestic circuit. Nobody, in a season where teams played eight matches each, scored more than two hundreds. The competition's leading run-scorer was a middle-order dasher with one century in 30 Tests, who tends to get out caught at mid-off.

West Indian domestic cricket does not reward patient batting, nor does it teach players how to build an innings.

If players can't get that experience there, then they should seek it elsewhere: collaborate with other cricket boards to get promising batsmen into competitions like Grade Cricket, County (or Minor Counties) Cricket, Provincial Cricket or the Premier Trophy. Even if these aren't the highest standard of cricket, they can still help young players to learn the skills that they currently don't learn in the Caribbean.

Totally forgot about King, he absolutely should be in the side soon. Would argue that he is more suited for the longer format than the shorter ones.

I fully agree with the words in bold, the pitches there have become very pace friendly recently (no doubt to help their team become dominant at home) but when you know that you will inevitably get out just because of the 'magic' ball from a decent pacer, it makes no sense to try and dig in and build an innings. Trying to hack away and score some quick runs to register on the radar of selectors makes more sense. I wouldn't be surprised if most of their first-class batsmen are either defensive or very defensive batsmen like Brathwaite and Chase who just block all day and scrape some runs or absolute sloggers like Blackwood who just take what is offered and try to score runs. Ultimately you do want someone like a Williamson or Smith who can build an innings and play at a steady pace of 50-55 runs per 100 balls and I really cannot see anyone in the current test team or probables who do play like that.

 

[Bevab]

Totally forgot about King, he absolutely should be in the side soon. Would argue that he is more suited for the longer format than the shorter ones.

I fully agree with the words in bold, the pitches there have become very pace friendly recently (no doubt to help their team become dominant at home) but when you know that you will inevitably get out just because of the 'magic' ball from a decent pacer, it makes no sense to try and dig in and build an innings. Trying to hack away and score some quick runs to register on the radar of selectors makes more sense. I wouldn't be surprised if most of their first-class batsmen are either defensive or very defensive batsmen like Brathwaite and Chase who just block all day and scrape some runs or absolute sloggers like Blackwood who just take what is offered and try to score runs. Ultimately you do want someone like a Williamson or Smith who can build an innings and play at a steady pace of 50-55 runs per 100 balls and I really cannot see anyone in the current test team or probables who do play like that.

To add on, there are clear examples of countries who have absolutely tailored their pitches to suit a certain type of bowlers like Bangladesh and Sri Lanka and are suffering from a real lack of quality pacers due to it. South Africa in the reverse direction appear unable to play even half decent spin due to their home pitches that necessitate dropping even the likes of Maharaj. On the other hand, I believe that the more balanced pitches in New Zealand will prove to be of huge benefit in the long-term as no longer will any half decent seamer thrive just with the help of the conditions.

 

[Dutch]

Blackwood taking the do or die route....

 

[Bevab]

Blackwood taking the do or die route....

Would love to see Bess up against him, with an inviting mid off in place.

 

[Dutch]

Aragorn: Legolas, shoot Blackwood, shoot Blackwood!!

 

[Aislabie]

Totally forgot about King, he absolutely should be in the side soon. Would argue that he is more suited for the longer format than the shorter ones.

I fully agree with the words in bold, the pitches there have become very pace friendly recently (no doubt to help their team become dominant at home) but when you know that you will inevitably get out just because of the 'magic' ball from a decent pacer, it makes no sense to try and dig in and build an innings. Trying to hack away and score some quick runs to register on the radar of selectors makes more sense. I wouldn't be surprised if most of their first-class batsmen are either defensive or very defensive batsmen like Brathwaite and Chase who just block all day and scrape some runs or absolute sloggers like Blackwood who just take what is offered and try to score runs. Ultimately you do want someone like a Williamson or Smith who can build an innings and play at a steady pace of 50-55 runs per 100 balls and I really cannot see anyone in the current test team or probables who do play like that.

Yeah, there's not really a quick fix. Obviously you have to try to pick people according to their best role in the side.

Of the incumbents, the players I'd look to replace asap would be Campbell, Blackwood and Joseph. None of them is particularly fulfilling a role in the side; the players you could bring in their stead would be Brandon King, Joshua Da Silva or Shayne Moseley, and Rahkeem Cornwall. But it's got a Titanic deckchairs vibe

 

[Ed Smith]

That non-review could be bad