With over a week on the clock, the prevailing balance issues

Alberts

International Coach
Joined
Apr 4, 2014
Online Cricket Games Owned
As said by Big Ant in general about how they would address balance issues, we should wait for the dust to settle a bit, people to get good time in before discussing potential changes too seriously. With 11 days of the game being out, now is as good a time as ever to start seriously discussing any balance issues with the game and make sure they are all together in one place. Note that this isn't about specific bugs, that is the odd strange BARS call, jumpy animation or such, but rather the balance of various parts of the game.

The obvious starting place is of course the fielding, but this is apparently being fixed with the next part, and as such should probably be left out of the discussion until the patch comes. This also including the run out issues with the AI and as such shall be left out of this discussion for the time being. So where does that leave us. I'd suggest that there are a few classes of problem remaining in the game. The first set is to do with the physical side of the game:

1. Bowlers lose speed far too quickly and struggle to maintain their speed after 4-5 overs
2. Bowlers fail to recover over breaks and in particular over the night in Test matches
3. Some have reported that even on a dust bowl they can't get the amount of spin they feel should be there, although I have not experienced this myself

Beyond this is one of the harder sides of the game to change, the overall balance of the AI. We should all understand how delicate a balancing act this is, and it is worth remembering that if Big Ant decides that any of the following are worth trying to fix, it could take a long time to make, test and get to us:

1. AI batsmen tend to throw the bat at good balls too often, resulting in an over occurrence of LBW and bowled dismissals
2. Despite this they tend not to edge the ball so much, seemingly middling the ball or completely missing it. They do edge it sometimes, but even setting up to take edges it is unlikely to make up more than 1-2 dismissals out of ten (and most of the time 0-1), when it should rightfully average around 4-5. This issue seems to be linked to the above
3. The AI is also a bit silly when dealing with bad balls, tending to go too hard at it, which can result in strange dismissals from being bowled or hitting it straight to waiting fielders when a bowler like Johnson messes up and bowls around 88 kmph.
4. The combination of the above 3 issues seems to make AI batting seem quite frail in many cases, with them being able to be bowled out for under 100 quite consistently at least on pro, but also reported on higher difficulties
5. In terms of bowling the AI also tends to favour the leg side a bit much, giving the player easy runs playing off their legs. The AI generally fails to respond quick enough to this either

Stating points like that may seem like a lot of negatives, but at this point if that is the whole set of issues, this game is doing magnificently (again, leaving out the fielding issues, as they are reported to be fixed in the upcoming patch). It is also worth noting, especially on the edges front that it doesn't seem to be an issue with the physics engine, as human players can and do tend to be out from edges quite often (probably about the right amount when I'm playing). It seems the edge issue is to do with how the AI play, not with how the physics engine works.

Overall it is a very good game, and very refreshing in the market, but not the key is the polish that turns it from a very solid title into a great one.
 
You made some good points and let's be honest, we did expect a few gameplay balancing issues given this is DBC's first iteration. Yes, some tweaking to the AI and online gameplay is required but DBC 14 is a pretty solid effort. I think the biggest compliment I can pay Big Ant team is that the game is quite addictive and if I had to purchase this game knowing what I know today, I would do so in a heartbeat.
 
You made some good points and let's be honest, we did expect a few gameplay balancing issues given this is DBC's first iteration. Yes, some tweaking to the AI and online gameplay is required but DBC 14 is a pretty solid effort. I think the biggest compliment I can pay Big Ant team is that the game is quite addictive and if I had to purchase this game knowing what I know today, I would do so in a heartbeat.

I too would purchase the game knowing what I know now. In fact, I would do so with far less doubt than I had when coming into. A cricket game is also a risk of being awful, and this game is, even with all issues mentioned, simply brilliant. Hopefully they can get the balancing act right in the coming patches.
 
A point 6 for the original list would be improper implementation of run out. If a player grounds a foot, he is considered to be in his crease from then on as long as he's moving forward, even if no part of him or his bat is in the crease at the time of the wicket being put down. Proper implementation of this rule would probably alleviate the issues with players being run out getting up from diving into the crease.

What's more, players shouldn't be given run out if they are chased out of their crease, and under the laws of the game they are perfectly within their right to walk out of the crease in such circumstances and still be considered "safe". By preventing run outs being called unless a run is attempted, this rule could not only be satisfied, but the issue of fielders barging the batsmen of his crease to run him out could be removed. Care could also have to be made for the case of a player dancing down the wicket who then grounds his bat, only to be barged out as well though.
 
Fielding placement by the AI need to be looked at as well. For example, I have scored 40 runs in 3 overs in a One Day in the career mode and the 4th over starts with 4 slips and a gully. Too defensive field setting for test matches but overly attacking field setting in ODIs.
This is exactly the same mistake as other cricket games have been making all along. This does take away the realism factor that Big Ant have managed to create so much with their batting and bowling mechanics.
I will request Ross to take a look at this, if he can.
 
It's fun and it's worth buying but it's certainly not "simply brilliant". Fix everything in your list and it gets pretty close to that but even then there's a fair few things required to meet such lofty praise.
 
It would help a lot of people if we could play as a career batsmen and face something very slightly slower when the quicks are on. Ive been gaming for a long time and just dont have the reactions to play as a batsman and not be pre-meditating.
 
for me the AI batting needs to be so much better at keeping their wicket and defending, they often get out playing really daft shots and go airborne way too often, they do occasionally show some resistance for a short time and then go weird again. Maybe this is due to the linked players thing not working I dont know, has anyone tried playing on default and see what happens?

Being a bowler Ive barely batted so cant comment on the leg side bowling but the bowling speeds are a problem, or the lack of consistent speed.

the fieldings being addressed so im happy to leave that until the patch comes out :)
 
Sounds like a well thought out, constructive post... which on the Internet is too rare these days. Hopefully things get sorted and the PC version hurries up and comes out.
 
A point 6 for the original list would be improper implementation of run out. If a player grounds a foot, he is considered to be in his crease from then on as long as he's moving forward, even if no part of him or his bat is in the crease at the time of the wicket being put down. Proper implementation of this rule would probably alleviate the issues with players being run out getting up from diving into the crease.

What's more, players shouldn't be given run out if they are chased out of their crease, and under the laws of the game they are perfectly within their right to walk out of the crease in such circumstances and still be considered "safe". By preventing run outs being called unless a run is attempted, this rule could not only be satisfied, but the issue of fielders barging the batsmen of his crease to run him out could be removed. Care could also have to be made for the case of a player dancing down the wicket who then grounds his bat, only to be barged out as well though.


I think that some of the runout issues may be due to errors connecting the animation to the "world", e.g. the batsman looks like he is sliding his bat but if you look very carefully the bat is just hovering above the pitch or clipping through it or something like that.
 
Hopefully we can get some official confirmation that the following issues are being looked into for patch 2:

Overall:

1. Pace bowlers' pace, stamina and recovering between sessions and days issues
2. Run out law not being observed by the game (i.e. players having grounded a foot being given out after it comes off the ground while coming further into the crease, despite the Laws of Cricket stating that they are safe in such instances)

As well as AI issues:

1. AI batting mentalities, i.e. too many poor shot decisions leading to many LBW and bowled dismissals, whilst not many edges occur
2. AI tends to go too hard at bad balls, even in unfavourable circumstances leading to larger than expected numbers of odd dismissals, i.e. bowled by a straight slow looping ball or hitting it straight to a fielder at long ignoring match position (yes it happens, but may need to be slightly toned down)
3. The apparent AI batting frailty that some have reported seems to stem from the above two points, but there are potentially some issues with overall match awareness, particularly for first class and test matches, i.e. No. 9 coming in at 7-59, 18 overs into day one only to take an almighty swing at a line and length ball first up
4. AI bowlers tending to favour the leg side more than should be expected, offering quick runs in many situations
5. Odd AI field placings, i.e. no slips for the first over of a Test match

This of course is not mentioning issues with so called "super fielders", as the upcoming patch is reported to fix many of these issues.
 
AI is fine...play on the hardest level, run outs are not a problem either...I swear people have a different version of the game than I do...ain't experience none of the problems your on about...didn't even have that crop up on amateur ?? Weird.
 
AI is fine...play on the hardest level, run outs are not a problem either...I swear people have a different version of the game than I do...ain't experience none of the problems your on about...didn't even have that crop up on amateur ?? Weird.

Can you give us rough stats on how you've been dismissing AI when bowling so far? Preferably in terms of:

How out
Bowled/LBW:
Edged behind:
Caught (not behind):
Stumped:
Run out:
 
Can you give us rough stats on how you've been dismissing AI when bowling so far? Preferably in terms of:

How out
Bowled/LBW:
Edged behind:
Caught (not behind):
Stumped:
Run out:

Pace bowler in career, admittedly I bowl very full and at the stumps.

Bowled/LBW: 80
Edged behind: 5
Caught (not behind): 15
Stumped:0
Run out: 0
 

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