England in New Zealand

[cheese]

Southee won't be a revelation... he'll fade away. But Cheese you do know wikipedia is not a valid source of reference, right? It is user-created content, thereby not reliable.

Anyway I am not so sure England's score is all that bad. Obviously getting bowled out for less than 300 (Unless a miracle happens) batting first is poor but New Zealand's line up is weak. They seem to struggle when they are favourites or are expected to perform (sounds really familiar...) which they are here. Plus they weakened their batting line up with the loss of Oram, though not considerably. I'd expect them to get a lead of about 50 but nothing more.

I'm not cricket expert, but I do spend considerable amount of time researching and reading other people's comments about pitches and how any particular game is going. Southee won't fade away because of his natural action. It's also about demeanor. So far, I have not seen a Jesse Ryder in him and he seems eloquent, and humble about his efforts on the field.

To be a legend, you not only need to be disciplined, you need to know how to be the best. I've read Lillee's generous praise on him and then HAdlee (read my older posts).

I've seen him get player of the tournament as a bowler on FLAT, LOW, SLOW, NO LIFE PITCHES in Malaysia.

He'll have his bad days with the ball, but I do not expect him to get dropped easily. Vettori is one case example. Talent is so scarce in New Zealand it's hard to drop talent. Look at how long England persisted with Harmison because of his talent.

With the right attitude and if he doesn't get over himself, he can and will succeed. This is based on his attitude, his demeanor, the support staff in New Zealand, people around him (vettori as his mentor when vettori has been an 18 year old Black Cap himself), and Hadlee as his bowling mentor when Hadlee has been through the same pressures himself, so he'll impart a lot of wisdom on him.

The only difference between a legend and just another good bowler is also based on the conditions he's brought into when he started. Not just talent, talent that is managed well, and talent that doesn't get too big on himself (ie gets lazy).

Wasim had Imran.

Lara had Marshall.

Tendulkar had Gavaskar. ETC ETC ETC.

Right attitude + good mentor + good support = how legends are made.

 

[irottev]

lol at you English fans. I love your continuous "this is only NZ. We should be winning" comments, and the "X failed again, let's drop him though he averages about 42".

I dont think NZ will get anywhere near 400.

i wouldn't be suprised if england knocks 3-4 over very early

well we are 253-9.

NZ all out for 213

I'm not convinced this is the batting paradise everyone thought it was/thinks it is.

Changed your mind yet? Fleming thinks it's a batting paradise. How agrees. All their shots pretty much are coming straight off the middle of the bat and are being timed with perfection. Most of England's dismissals came from TERRIBLE batting (and so did our only one) or else some pretty impressive, accurate bowling which would get wickets on almost any pitch.

Southee won't be a revelation... he'll fade away. But Cheese you do know wikipedia is not a valid source of reference, right? It is user-created content, thereby not reliable.

:'( I don't want to talk Southee up yet, but you can't say he doesn't look the goods. Look at his action. He moves it both ways. He has fantastic accuracy for his experience. He has good swinging yorkers you'll no doubt see in future. Player of the under 19 world cup is a nice thing to have behind you.

New Zealand's line up is weak. I'd expect them to get a lead of about 50 but nothing more.

:'(

 

[barmyarmy]

lol at you English fans. I love your continuous "this is only NZ. We should be winning" comments(

NZ are ranked 7th in the world as a test side and, Fleming aside, have very little quality in terms of batting. If you take out the games against Bangladesh barely anyone in the NZ team is averaging 30 over the past 2/3 years.

 

[cheese]

How many tests have New Zealand played in the last 5-6 years compared to other top 5 countries?

Also take into account the green pitches we went through during the 90s.

 

[Themer]

Ya You can't ask 5 Wicket haul from them on debut..I think Player already feel lot of pressure to perform and Nobody gives there 100 percent on ground as far as Bowling is concerned..

I wish you were right that one would get a 5fer on debut

Finally Fleming gone although I support England i'd love to see him get his 40 average. Sidebottom again England's best bowler.

 

[cheese]

FLEMING... RIght on cue YET again. Another failed conversion to 100. I'm perplexed. -_-

 

[Will_NA]

I am genuinely not lying when I saw this happening. It happened at Hamilton and it's happened today. When Fleming goes, New Zealand have again self-imploded.

 

[barmyarmy]

This is more like it - 119-5.
McCullum and Vettori the two main threats now.

 

[Will_NA]

Put your money away, Colin. No-one wants to see that.

Am I the only who thinks Sidebottom should be given his own customary transportation device?

 

[lancashire666]

what the hell did england have for lunch!

even strauss held onto a catch!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[cheese]

They prob got told, if you dont win this test, you're out. Bye bye pay check...

On that note:....

Greg Hay pack your bags,
Grant Elliot pack your bags,

Matthew Sinclair, Matthew Bell - unpack your bags. In fact GET THE f**k OUT!

Braces announces his squad straight after the series loss to England:

1. How
2. Elliot (can't do much worse)
3. Taylor
4. Greg Hay
5. Oram
6. McCullum
7. Vettori
8. Southee
9. Mills
10. Martin
11. Patel

+ 2 more U19s - notably Corey Anderson.

Develop, develop, develop. STUFF JOURNEYMEN. SO SICK OF WATCHING BATTING COLLAPSES.

THIS IS A FLAT WICKET! (apparently) and they make it look like a minefield.

I'll laugh REALLY hard if Southee gets a 50.

 

[aussie_ben91]

Since Hadlee retired, we have not had the same 'one-man-team' mantra we were blessed in the 80s. 90s - 2000s were a bit of a blur when bowlers keep getting injured, no one stood out, and we just toil away with good discipline and worked hard with little talent we did have.

We've had great all-rounders, Chris Cairns, Hadlee himself, now JAcob Oram. But we do not have a great strike bowler since HAdlee retired.

What about Shane Bond? Your greatest ODI bowler of all time?

 

[cheese]

I'll add him to the "keep getting injured" category.

MAY I add the WHOLE series thus far, the only players to show any sort of class are Sidebottom and Fleming.

 

[barmyarmy]

Feel happier with McCullum gone but we know what Vettori can do and Elliot may yet suprise us - his technique has looked fairly sound.

 

[Will_NA]

I'll add him to the "keep getting injured" category.

MAY I add the WHOLE series thus far, the only players to show any sort of class are Sidebottom and Fleming.

What about Taylor?