I don't think you can complain about the declaration, maybe went on 20-30 runs too long but it's easy to say that now. England should have had enough time to get the West Indies out really on the last few days of a test match. Just unfortunate that Flintoff got injured. The WI lower order really stood up. Was good to see. They just weren't good enough to force the win.
England in West Indies
- Thread starter Skater
- Start date
RoboRocks
Chairman of Selectors
It was a flat pitch and it held up for all five days. Our bowlers did what they could and bowled as a unit but the pitch was too flat and even Powell and Edwards, in the end, looked pretty comfortable.
The 20-30 run difference made a difference since I'm sure with that about of time we should have been about to take the last wicket. We were too conservative in that regard.
The 20-30 run difference made a difference since I'm sure with that about of time we should have been about to take the last wicket. We were too conservative in that regard.
West Indies showed grit and determination. Daren Powell and Fidel Edwards in particular.
Strauss in hindsight "should "have declared earlier. Total tactical error by Strauss.
the 4th test is in Barbados on Thursday
Different game different venue.
Strauss in hindsight "should "have declared earlier. Total tactical error by Strauss.
the 4th test is in Barbados on Thursday
Different game different venue.
Skater
ICC Chairman
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- Jan 12, 2004
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- England
Right, I've slept on it now.
The reasons why England didn't win were 1. defensive captaincy, 2. poor umpiring and 3. those digital light meters.
1. As has been said, Strauss was scared of what happened in Mumbai. He failed to realise that this was a different game, against a weaker team than India. I like him as a captain and was championing him for the job when KP got it, but there was no way we needed a 500 run lead when we had outplayed the W.Indies on every single day. If we had declared earlier we would have won, simple as that.
2. Cook took a catch to dislodge the Sarwan/Chanderpaul partnership in the final few overs before lunch, but it wasn't given out. We had Benn out three times in one Swann over, only one being given. The umpires ignored several plumb LBW calls as well.
3. I'm not saying any more about those. They have GOT to go. They are useless.
We won't win the series now. Not with Flintoff out and the W.Indies on a roll.
The reasons why England didn't win were 1. defensive captaincy, 2. poor umpiring and 3. those digital light meters.
1. As has been said, Strauss was scared of what happened in Mumbai. He failed to realise that this was a different game, against a weaker team than India. I like him as a captain and was championing him for the job when KP got it, but there was no way we needed a 500 run lead when we had outplayed the W.Indies on every single day. If we had declared earlier we would have won, simple as that.
2. Cook took a catch to dislodge the Sarwan/Chanderpaul partnership in the final few overs before lunch, but it wasn't given out. We had Benn out three times in one Swann over, only one being given. The umpires ignored several plumb LBW calls as well.
3. I'm not saying any more about those. They have GOT to go. They are useless.
We won't win the series now. Not with Flintoff out and the W.Indies on a roll.
20-30 runs and England were too defensive in their approach, that could have given England another five to ten overs which should have been enough time to get that last wicket.
Yea I agree but we must not forget that there is a coach ,a manager. Surely Strauss did not take the decision on his own.
Unfortunately the players cant hear us, and all the sponge bricks we throw at the tv when the players/ captain and umpires make a bad call(remember they the umpires dont have replays like we do). They have to make a call at the blink of an eye.
Sadly with bad calls from umpires have cost many a player. Some careers have been shattered.
Not sure where you got the idea there is a coach or manager from. There is a batting coach but currently no-one is filling the role that Moores recently vacated. As for careers being shattered I think even Lee would consider that melodramatic.
I am fully aware Moore got the boot... Andy Flower is the assistant coach.
Well then in a NUTSHELL Strauss made a decision on his own and will have to face the consequences.
:happy
Skater
ICC Chairman
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- England
You've hurt my feelings. I demand that you are banned now. Someone needs to cheer me up after that. :crying
Thinking about Barbados, I've changed my team:
1. Strauss (c)
2. Cook
3. Shah
4. Pietersen
5. Collingwood
6. Bell
7. Prior (wk)
8. Stuart Broad
9. Graeme Swann
10. James Anderson
11. Amjad Khan
And I mean it.
I actually thought Harmison did ok, certainly wouldn't put Amjad Khan ahead of Ryan Sidebottom! Don't see the point in playing Bell, he was dropped for poor form, are we now saying his form is good enough? Also, I think we need a 5th option (not Colly, KP, Shah). I'd call, with balls, for Rashid.
Fantastic day yesterday, I think England did really well, bowled very well, all of them. I think the fact that out of 4 innings, only 1 was all out says it all about the pitch.
The declaration:
Yes, it went on too long did our 2nd innings. That said it's pure supposition as to what would have happened had we declared 20 runs earlier, WI could have collapsed for 200 or got to 400-3, you just don't know. That said, it was the wrong decision by Strauss.
Fantastic day yesterday, I think England did really well, bowled very well, all of them. I think the fact that out of 4 innings, only 1 was all out says it all about the pitch.
The declaration:
Yes, it went on too long did our 2nd innings. That said it's pure supposition as to what would have happened had we declared 20 runs earlier, WI could have collapsed for 200 or got to 400-3, you just don't know. That said, it was the wrong decision by Strauss.
King Pietersen
ICC Board Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2006
- Location
- Manchester
1. Strauss
2. Cook
3. Shah
4. Pietersen
5. Collingwood
6. Bell
7. Prior
8. Broad
9. Swann
10. Harmison
11. Anderson
No need to make any changes, we had a good game. Harmison bowled well when he wasn't feeling ill. He just seemed to lack abit of rhythm and I don't know if I was the only one that noticed, but it seemed to me that he was over-stretching his paces in his run up, possibly worrying about the no balls from the first innings and searching for pace. I know it's something I've struggled with in the past, when worrying about no balls and striving for pace. I think it's a rhythm thing with Harmison, he'll hit his straps eventually, and I'm sure come the 2009 Ashes he'll be at his best. Going back to Durham really seems to get the best out of him, so that IPL break could do him some real good.
2. Cook
3. Shah
4. Pietersen
5. Collingwood
6. Bell
7. Prior
8. Broad
9. Swann
10. Harmison
11. Anderson
No need to make any changes, we had a good game. Harmison bowled well when he wasn't feeling ill. He just seemed to lack abit of rhythm and I don't know if I was the only one that noticed, but it seemed to me that he was over-stretching his paces in his run up, possibly worrying about the no balls from the first innings and searching for pace. I know it's something I've struggled with in the past, when worrying about no balls and striving for pace. I think it's a rhythm thing with Harmison, he'll hit his straps eventually, and I'm sure come the 2009 Ashes he'll be at his best. Going back to Durham really seems to get the best out of him, so that IPL break could do him some real good.
King Pietersen
ICC Board Member
- Joined
- Nov 15, 2006
- Location
- Manchester
2 guys to do all the work? Broad, Swann, Anderson and Harmison are all capable of bowling enough overs to bowl West Indies out I feel. We did fine in the 1st innings when Freddie was injured and Harmison was feeling worse for wear. A fit Harmison plus the other 3 is more than enough front line bowling. Then if need be we've got medium pace from Collingwood and abit of spin from KP and Shah. I think there's enough there personally. I think bringing Rashid, Sidebottom or Khan in would just weaken an already dodgy batting line-up. Bopara could be an option in place of Bell though, he bowls very handy medium-fast, and has a very, very good slower ball out of the back of the hand.
Highlander999
ICC President
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- Apr 15, 2006
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- London
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