England National football team thread

[Manly]

Every debate is negated by:

DOWNING

WHAT THE FUNK?!

 

[War]

I'd rather have Barry in that central midfield than Parker, who is a complete liability at international level.

International football's all about controlling the tempo of the game, with a huge emphasis on positioning and shape, something that the more "English" players like Terry, Parker, Milner are shite are.

Running around like a headless chicken, throwing yourself into tackles etc. will only get you so far. It's why the Lampard-Gerrard combo has failed consistently at international level.

I think that's a bit harsh on Parker to be fair my friend. I'd say since he became a first XI regular during the EURO qualifying match versus Wales - he has brought a lot of stability to the mid-field in the 4-3-3 formation Capello introduced, by being very disciplined in a defensive mid-field role.

However if ENG play 4-4-2 in the Euro's both Parker or Barry would struggle in such a formation because unlike at their clubs, they won't have a Yaya Toure or Modric playing next to them. Thus both would look horribly slow at international level and pace ENG mid-field will move the ball will be horridly lethargic as we saw in the recent friendly versus Holland.

So essentially only one of Parker or Barry (preferably Parker once fit should start) against start. But without a Carrick, Scholes or Wilshire in the middle - the mid-fielder right now lacks invention as everyone knows.

I'm starting to think that maybe Hodgson may have to adapt that defensive 4-1-4-1 tactic, Capello used when we defeated Spain in that friendly last year - until Rooney returns for the third game.

England in Friendlies 2011

Hart

Johnson/Jones Cahill Terry Cole

Parker

Walcott/Young Jones/Milner Gerrard Milner/Young

Carroll

 

[Themer]

Personally I'd of gone with a team that looked a bit like this.

Playing very deep and trying to play near exclusively on the counter. Both Parker and Gerrard nearly never venturing forward with the ball being given to Scholes as quickly as possible to feed the wingers, who are playing as inside forwards.

Gerrard simply doesn't have the legs to make the driving runs that he use to but he is still very good defensively and can play very well as an anchor. Parker also playing an anchor role. Carrick isn't an international class player, he sits and makes simple interceptions that for the majority would be cut out just as well by a defender stepping up and doesn't posses the creative game to hurt teams.

England have to admit that they aren't a good enough team to dominate/control matches but they do have the tools to be a very good counter attacking team.

That's what I'd go with but then I am an extremely defensive person when it comes to things like this. I'm described as "very cautious" on Football Manager haha

 

[Themer]

I can see disaster if we stick to 4-4-2. We'll be wide open to any half decent team.

 

[Auwais]

Gerrard simply doesn't have the legs to make the driving runs that he use to but he is still very good defensively and can play very well as an anchor.

Codswallop. Gerrard's been shown up plenty of times in central midfield.

And you think Carrick isn't international class but Parker is?

Swap Scholes and Gerrard around and that's already a much better team. Welbeck's wasted on the wing and Oxygen Chamber's a work in progress, although I'd rather see both of them out wide than your Downings and Milners.

 

[Themer]

Gerrard's been shown up plenty of times in central midfield.

Because he's trying to "drive" the team forwards he often gets caught, I believe he's more than capable of holding back. He's better than Barry at any rate.

Welbeck's wasted on the wing and Oxygen Chamber's a work in progress

For the tactic to work you need tall quick strong wingers who can hold the ball up well. Chamberlains shown enough to me that he could fill that sort of role as has Welbeck who's linked up and held up really well this year.

And you think Carrick isn't international class but Parker is?

Yeah. Parker is a much better ball winning anchor that Carrick is.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Defensively he's miles ahead of any other English midfielder. Just because he isn't flashy and doesn't run around like a headless chicken he isn't appreciated. Players like Scott Parker leave gaping holes in midfield, run around without any sense but make some tough tackles and win player of the year.

That's always the lot of the DM - they're not appreciated, but they do a crucial job. Where's our new Paul Ince? Our new Scholes? As I said before, the wings are looking great, but the central midfield...

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Codswallop. Gerrard's been shown up plenty of times in central midfield.

And you think Carrick isn't international class but Parker is?

Swap Scholes and Gerrard around and that's already a much better team. Welbeck's wasted on the wing and Oxygen Chamber's a work in progress, although I'd rather see both of them out wide than your Downings and Milners.

Oh I hope Roy doesn't play Welbeck on the wing! He's not a winger and never will be - he's a frontman. Ideal situation would be him and Rooney because of the form they show for Utd, but of course Rooney did something stupid (again) playing for England, so he's out of the first games (assuming England manage to get past them).

Young players like Chamberlain are what will drive England forwards and G. Neville is saying that the younger players should be given the chance. Well, they can't possibly do worse than the older guys, can they? I mean, look how many youngsters were in that German team - didn't a load of them come from the Germany U21 team that whacked England? Play the youngsters, with the odd experienced pro to hold it together.

 

[Themer]

Oh I hope Roy doesn't play Welbeck on the wing! He's not a winger and never will be - he's a frontman.

He's played on the wing quite a bit in the youth teams and what not. Infact I'd argue that he's probably shown himself to be more adept on the wing than as a striker so far. Certainly hasn't troubled the scorers alot so far. And definitely holds the attributes to do well on the wing at any rate.

 

[puddleduck]

Go with youth, stop flogging dead horses. They weren't good enough in their prime, why the hell will they be good enough when they're on the decline? Stick anyone who could potentially go to the next world cup in the squad/team and build for that tournament...

But that didn't happen, so meh.

 

[Manly]

But DOWNING?!

 

[Auwais]

For the tactic to work you need tall quick strong wingers who can hold the ball up well. Chamberlains shown enough to me that he could fill that sort of role as has Welbeck who's linked up and held up really well this year.

That's asking a lot from a kid who has only started 6 times in the league this season but I like that, they're both very intelligent players who would link up well with Rooney.

Young players like Chamberlain are what will drive England forwards and G. Neville is saying that the younger players should be given the chance. Well, they can't possibly do worse than the older guys, can they? I mean, look how many youngsters were in that German team - didn't a load of them come from the Germany U21 team that whacked England? Play the youngsters, with the odd experienced pro to hold it together.

It'd certainly help in the long term but no England manager seems to come in with a long term plan. For example, Toshack failed to get Wales to a major tournament but his long term blooding of the youngsters was starting to bear fruit under Speed.

He's played on the wing quite a bit in the youth teams and what not. Infact I'd argue that he's probably shown himself to be more adept on the wing than as a striker so far. Certainly hasn't troubled the scorers alot so far. And definitely holds the attributes to do well on the wing at any rate.

He needs to work on his finishing but his link-up play is excellent. But he's far from the finished article so there's plenty of time to work on that.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Apparently, Roy didn't make an approach for Scholes because that would've meant leaving out a Barry, Gerrard or Lampard, all of whom played a big part in getting us there.

I'd rather have Scholes, even a Scholes in decline, than Barry any day.

 

[puddleduck]

Except Barry has been excellent for City this season. He was apparently carrying an injury into the World Cup where he was shocking. He's done exactly what Scholes has done for Utd, except he played in the title winning side and has more mobile legs and can tackle...

I'm by no means Barry's biggest fan, but he's had a good season, no worse than Scholes.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

He hasn't got Scholes' vision - he can't pass like Scholes.

 

[puddleduck]

Scholes can't tackle like Barry, so it's probably a good thing one of them plays a holding role...

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(To be fair, no one can tackle like Scholes haha)