India in Australia

[Adarsh]

Sehwag and Zaheer aren't in the 13 man squad for this test.

 

[sohum]

You think Dravid will do any better at first drop? Stop going of his reputation, pussys do that, and you aint a pussy.The guy can't bat at the moment buddy

I actually do. The difference between his average at opening and average at one drop is almost 20 runs. I'm not going by reputation, but by common sense. Opening is a specialist position and you cannot just stuff someone in there and expect them to perform as you expect especially against the best team in the world.

Picture this scenario.. Jaffer and Karthik are opening.. They are batting pretty slowly and they are 0/20 after 11 overs. Jaffer edges one behind.. In walks Dravid! IN ALL HIS CURRENT FORM GLORY

I assure you that Dravid has come in at that sort of situation a lot of time in the past and has performed. The thing is that opening in a test match just requires a special mentality that Dravid is not preparing correctly for (or lacks the capacity to prepare for). You may think it's just a difference of one wicket, but if you ask any international opening batsman worth their salt, they will tell you that opening is a specialist position. Which is why Tendulkar and Ganguly have declined the offer to opening the batting in test matches in the past, even though they are two of the best openers in ODI cricket.

Jeez, I'd rather ANY number 3 in the world and I really mean that ANY number 3 in the world walking to the crease instead of the extremely under par Dravid.

I wouldn't. Dravid batted at number 3 in the tour game and although he wasn't in prime touch, he was the only batsman that managed to play out Wise and got runs as well. That shows to me that he just wasn't prepared to open.

Unless he has somehow, and hopefully he has, gotten back into his normal self and proves me wrong, and hopefully does, his career will be ended by the Australians.

And how do you expect to find this out?

 

[Harrypotter_fan]

Now I have no hope of India winning the test match, I'm not ruling out a draw.

EDIT: I put all my vCash (4452) on India winning the 2nd test!!! . Don't know what made me do that

 

[Leicester Fox]

Dravid isn't the 2nd best number 3 in the world, Sangakarra is and arguably the best. When was the last time Dravid hit a hundred that wasn't against Bangladesh?

 

[manee]

Sehwag and Zaheer aren't in the 13 man squad for this test.

Zaheer is.

 

[sohum]

Oh! I see! What a valid point you just made.. Keep him in the team! Keep him scoring 10 runs of 50 balls, and by the end of the tour.. Well he just WOULDN'T HAVE A CONFIDENCE! What a terrific idea, destroy Dravid permanently!

In a more mature answer to your question: He waits until the end of the tour and goes back to first class cricket. Hayden, Langer, Ponting, Clark, Ganguly..They've all done this and came back better.

Yeah... The first thing Dravid did when he was dropped from the ODI team was score a double-ton in a Ranji game. And that was less than a month back. Dravid has been in blistering touch in the two Ranji games he has played this season--where he's come in at his expected position of number 3--and hence he should be allowed to perform there:

121 against Himachal Pradesh
40 and 214 against Mumbai

 

[jordox]

I actually do. The difference between his average at opening and average at one drop is almost 20 runs. I'm not going by reputation, but by common sense. Opening is a specialist position and you cannot just stuff someone in there and expect them to perform as you expect especially against the best team in the world.

Okay, have you played cricket before? If you have you would understand the concept of form. Dravid is in bad form, opening the batting isn't what is making him bat badly, it's his form.

A good example of this is Michael Clarke. His average takes a 20 run drop when he opens the batting too, however when Clarke opens the batting HE STILL LOOKS LIKE AN INTERNATIONAL CRICKETER.

Stop making excuses. Dravid's in bad form, it is that SIMPLE stop over complicating it.

I assure you that Dravid has come in at that sort of situation a lot of time in the past and has performed. The thing is that opening in a test match just requires a special mentality that Dravid is not preparing correctly for (or lacks the capacity to prepare for). You may think it's just a difference of one wicket, but if you ask any international opening batsman worth their salt, they will tell you that opening is a specialist position. Which is why Tendulkar and Ganguly have declined the offer to opening the batting in test matches in the past, even though they are two of the best openers in ODI cricket.

You've missed the whole point of the comment. Of course I know that Dravid has overcome worse, his not called the WALL for nothing.

I wouldn't. Dravid batted at number 3 in the tour game and although he wasn't in prime touch, he was the only batsman that managed to play out Wise and got runs as well. That shows to me that he just wasn't prepared to open.

Don't bring up the tour match. A bowler who struggles to make the domestic team carved your team up, that tell you something?

And how do you expect to find this out?

Hmm, maybe by not churning in discomfort during his innings..

In the end, you're trying to argue against me and I can't see why. Rahul Dravid is in bad form, and I don't believe that people in the kind of form he is in deserve to play international cricket because he is ruining the innings and ruining the momentum.

He needs to regain his form. Give him a match at first drop by all means, however if he looks just as bad as he did opening, take him out.

I'm not saying judge him on how many runs he gets, I'm saying judge him by how he bats. If he goes out there tomorrow at first drop and score 10 runs at at a strike rate of 10, he really doesn't deserve to be in the team. It's that simple. Stop arguing.

 

[jordox]

Yeah... The first thing Dravid did when he was dropped from the ODI team was score a double-ton in a Ranji game. And that was less than a month back. Dravid has been in blistering touch in the two Ranji games he has played this season--where he's come in at his expected position of number 3--and hence he should be allowed to perform there:

121 against Himachal Pradesh
40 and 214 against Mumbai

You are raising really bad points. I don't care what his done in the past HE IS IN BAD FORM. GIVE HIM A GAME OR TWO AT FIRST DROP AND IF HE DOESN'T LOOK LIKE HIMSELF GIVE HIM THE FLICK FOR A TEMPORARY AMOUNT OF TIME.

Do you understand what I am suggesting? Is it that unfair?

It's my opinion on what I think should be done, if you would rather keep a struggling player in a team when he is rapidly loosing his confidence, by all means, do it. Australia will thank you greatly.

 

[sohum]

Dravid isn't the 2nd best number 3 in the world, Sangakarra is and arguably the best. When was the last time Dravid hit a hundred that wasn't against Bangladesh?

Dravid has had a rough patch for the last few months. He scored a century last season against West Indies in West Indies and that was his last century prior to the one against Bangladesh.

You will also notice that his consistency dropped when he became captain and that is actually when his average started going down. Sanga, on the other hand, has hit a purple patch over the last season or so. He may be the best number 3 on form, but I think Ponting and Dravid are better than him career-wise.

Okay, have you played cricket before? If you have you would understand the concept of form. Dravid is in bad form, opening the batting isn't what is making him bat badly, it's his form.

A good example of this is Michael Clarke. His average takes a 20 run drop when he opens the batting too, however when Clarke opens the batting HE STILL LOOKS LIKE AN INTERNATIONAL CRICKETER.

Stop making excuses. Dravid's in bad form, it is that SIMPLE stop over complicating it.

Opening the batting is precisely what is causing him to not look like an international cricketer because that is not his job in the team. I'm not over-complicating it, I'm just logically explaining it to you. And Clarke has never opened the batting in test matches, so you will have to stop using examples from your imagination.

You've missed the whole point of the comment. Of course I know that Dravid has overcome worse, his not called the WALL for nothing.

You're missing my argument. You stated that there is no difference between opening and one-drop but I suggested from a logical perspective that there definitely is and that it is feasibly the reason Dravid is struggling especially in the Melbourne game.

Don't bring up the tour match. A bowler who struggles to make the domestic team carved your team up, that tell you something?

Dravid actually did open the batting in the tour game, so I'd have to concede that point. However, I'm not sure what else your point is with regards to Dravid and Wise and India.

Hmm, maybe by not churning in discomfort during his innings..

In the end, you're trying to argue against me and I can't see why. Rahul Dravid is in bad form, and I don't believe that people in the kind of form he is in deserve to play international cricket because he is ruining the innings and ruining the momentum.

He needs to regain his form. Give him a match at first drop by all means, however if he looks just as bad as he did opening, take him out.

I'm not saying judge him on how many runs he gets, I'm saying judge him by how he bats. If he goes out there tomorrow at first drop and score 10 runs at at a strike rate of 10, he really doesn't deserve to be in the team. It's that simple. Stop arguing.

You're the one whose arguing because you are saying the same thing I am--that Dravid should bat at one-drop in the next test match--yet you have some complex that requires you to present your views over-aggressively and rudely on this forum. I mean with one post you say Dravid should be nowhere near the team and in the next post you angrily claim that Dravid should be given a game at number 3 and then be dropped if he fails. Make up your mind!

You are raising really bad points. I don't care what his done in the past HE IS IN BAD FORM. GIVE HIM A GAME OR TWO AT FIRST DROP AND IF HE DOESN'T LOOK LIKE HIMSELF GIVE HIM THE FLICK FOR A TEMPORARY AMOUNT OF TIME.

Do you understand what I am suggesting? Is it that unfair?

It's my opinion on what I think should be done, if you would rather keep a struggling player in a team when he is rapidly loosing his confidence, by all means, do it. Australia will thank you greatly.

You know, perhaps you capitalized your suggestion above so that you would read it. You were the one that started this argument by bringing up a batting line-up with no Dravid and Yuvraj coming in at 6. If Dravid struggles at 3, I agree that he should go back and play the Ranji season for a while. But given that he murdered the Ranji bowlers coming in at 3 just 3 weeks back, I'm not sure on what criteria he would be selected back into the team.

Sehwag and Zaheer aren't in the 13 man squad for this test.

Ah, the selectors really make me want to destroy something. The Cricinfo expected line-up lists Dravid and Jaffer as opening and if that happens again, I think I will have some manually-inflicted hair loss.

 

[surendar]

Dravid isn't the 2nd best number 3 in the world, Sangakarra is and arguably the best. When was the last time Dravid hit a hundred that wasn't against Bangladesh?

But whoever may be best at that position, one can't deny that Dravid is a class( in technique) batsman at no : 3 in both forms of the game. He averages 55+ at no 3 if I remember right. Its just bad time for Dravid is what I feel. He will get triggered soon.

Zaheer doubtful for Sydney Test: Pathan may open

This means, there is a huge burden for Kumble to grab all the wickets of Australia? : Ages back I said, Jumbo is our main key and i never trust our so called pace bowlers. Zaheer was looking impressive but RP was looking crap(unimpressive).

Let's face it, in 2006 the England team had the best chance that anyone had ever had in ages to beat Australia in Australia and we were whomped 5-0. That's exactly what's going to happen to India as well in my book. Well, 4-0 anyway.

Definitely its not going to be a whitewash. I belive, India is having a very great chance of bouncing back in second test.

Dravid has to be the most boring batsmen in the universe, I thought Alastair Cook was slow but he's ridiculous.

Haven't you watched Alec Stewart's innings and Atherton's innings? I still remember Stewart's boring innings of around 12+ in 120+ balls. I didn't remember which match though.

One plus point in Dravid's slowness, " A very high patience " which is must needed in test innings. but he was completely inconfident while playing shots though.

Yeah, he's declaring. I guess it's a good decision, but I was expecting Australia to set the lead over 550, just in case of a miracle like Kolkata.

I read through many pages back.. And I must say, you are great optimist. Keep it up!

Rahul Dravid is the scape goat for Team India.
He bats at whatever postition team wants him to.I bet he'll even consider No.11 if the team says so.

Dravid is not definitely a scape goat! I was also not happy with Dravid opening.

But you know what, Dravid is expected to 'be-prepared' for facing the new ball since he is a crucial no :3 batsmen in general. If you ask me, I would say, No 3 batsmen are the virtual openers. What happens if one of the openers go early in very first 5 overs.. It will definitely bring Dravid to face the new ball. I am not defending Dravid's opener spot but I just meant that he(Dravid), being such a experienced person, should find no problems against the new ball which didn't happen in first test.

Also, I remember Kumble saying about Yuvi,

"When Yuvraj is playing so well and we don't pick him, you say why not? Then when we put Rahul up the order and then make way for Yuvraj, you say 'no you shouldn't have done that'. There are always ifs and buts, but for me personally I need to look at the team dynamics and who is batting well."

This is exactly what many people have reacted after the failure of Yuvi and Dravid. Samething happened to Tendulkar sometimes back.. but now the same people say that he is in sublime touch with the bat(especially one of the members here who hates Sachin to core also said few pages back,"what has young blood have done? nothing" )

95% of People do change a lots as per the trend. It happens.

Ah, the selectors really make me want to destroy something. The Cricinfo expected line-up lists Dravid and Jaffer as opening and if that happens again, I think I will have some manually-inflicted hair loss.

Even Tendulkar has stressed the point of Dravid opening some days back indirectly like, " Dravid has done exceptionally well in all the positions.. Lets wait for the series to get over and see how he do in this opening position ".

 

[Cricket_60]

Good to see Australia keeping Mitch Johnson in the lineup, he's an exciting prospect. Australia will be extra happy to see Dravid and Jaffer opening the batting again if their previous performance is anything to go by. Can't really see how Yuvraj Singh currently warrants a spot in India's team.

 

[sohum]

Good to see Australia keeping Mitch Johnson in the lineup, he's an exciting prospect. Australia will be extra happy to see Dravid and Jaffer opening the batting again if their previous performance is anything to go by. Can't really see how Yuvraj Singh currently warrants a spot in India's team.

Couldn't you tell that Yuvraj was in blistering form? :

 

[manee]

India should go for the draw in this match. I know it is a negative attitude, but barring a fantastic performance from the spinners (which is unlikely since it is a seaming wicket), I can't see an Indian victory.

After this Test, a seamer or two is expected to arrive from India to play in the third Test and India should no longer feel guilty (one Test is admittadly a bit harsh) about a rash dropping of e.g. Yuvraj, or a shifting of the batting order around to accomadate Sehwag or Karthik. India can go on the offensive for the third Test, but with the current squad, they should just look to survive this test.

Just watch India win this match now and make me look like a skeptic fool

 

[Stephen Bailey]

India should go for the draw in this match. I know it is a negative attitude, but barring a fantastic performance from the spinners (which is unlikely since it is a seaming wicket), I can't see an Indian victory.

IF India go into this match thinking like that, they may as well go home because they will get smashed off the face of the earth. You simply can't go into a match against Australia thinking like that.

 

[zub2005]

where is indias 13 man squad. i dont like shewag that much but they got to play with a recognise opener.