Indian tour of South Africa, December-January 2010/11

[sohum]

Playing with hypotheticals is always dangerous. The problem with saying UDRS would have overturned this or that is how do you know the player wouldn't have gotten out the very next ball? You can't just selectively take time and re-arrange it. You can't just replace the UDRS call and then assume that same player would go on to score a century. He could well be out the next ball.

Yes, India missed an opportunity to capitalize yesterday. I think this was actually a perfect result to end the series because it showed that neither team could capitalize. South Africa couldn't capitalize on a dominant showing in the first Test by getting skittled out cheaply in the second. India couldn't capitalize on a good bowling start in either of the innings of the third Test and South Africa couldn't prevent Sachin and Gambhir from scoring runs where everyone else failed.

Both these sides are good. South Africa is younger--with Kallis the only real old veteran in their team. They will be the better team when our middle order retires. Still think England is better than both of them, though.

 

[pcfan123]

This series does set up the England vs India series to be a great showpiece now. Sreesanth proved that on wickets that offer help, he is no mug and if Zaheer is still playing then I'd back a close series.

I could also however see a total form collapse from India if injuries and retirements start coming soon. Take Laxman, Dravid, Zaheer and Tendulkar out of the picture and India look a very mediocre Test side. And those Test retirements will all come in 2011.

 

[cricket12345678]

Still South africa not good in spin track. They definetly failed to deliver.
India still good opponent in all flat, bounce, turn pitches. No other team same like than. Still england, south africa not good in spin track. After retirment of sachin, laxman, dravid. England may get top position. I dont thing much problem for india in england series. In last two or three series on england, india played well in England. India problem only face south africa in south africa. This series draw means. India played very well.

 

[McLOVIN]

I fully expect we would have lost wickets if we'd tried to score runs.

In hindsight, Sehwag did the right thing. Scoring a quick 15-20 and getting out in the 3rd over would have done nothing in the context of the game and they'd still have the new ball.

It looked like he was trying to play himself in before looking for his shots and got out soon after he started looking for his shots.

Since when India is all about Sehwag? Sehwag should've gone after it. If India had lost his wicket, it wouldn't have been all over for India. You guys have better players to follow him. To plan your game based on one batsman, when you have bunch good ones is not very bright.

My plan would've been to play a bit more aggressively, to let Sehwag do what he does every day. If he clicks, then they have a better chance. If he doesn't, then he doesn't. But now you will never know what could've been. And if they had lost couple of early wickets I'd still have a lot of faith on the Trio + Dhoni and recently with 2 hundreds to buckle down and save the test. But what you do with those leftover 7 wickets?

Like I said, Dhoni and Co. are happy with 1-1. I can respect that. It's their team. But what I really think is, they missed out on a good chance for 2-1 win. ATM, India has the best players for that kind of game, but they are not using their ability. Even you Indian fans know it.

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India rules out using review system | India Cricket News | ESPN Cricinfo

"We don't accept this technology. We are not going to use it in any bilateral series," the BCCI's secretary and president-elect, N Srinivasan, told Reuters. "They were supposed to take us to see its use in the Ashes series but I did not go. We have made our presentation to the ICC, saying we are just not convinced about the technology."

I want BCB or Zim-cricket-w/e to do something like that- just ignore the "invite". If they don't get busted nuts by the next, I shall... (idk let me think about it..)

Seriously, they should've gone. They would've learned something. Ashes was a beautiful execution of proper use of UDRS. I bow to Strauss specially. Currently BCCI is being very anal about it. And I feel these oldies are only being like one of those grandpas who just hates modern tech, "Children! technology is the devil!" Why not get rid of the 3rd Ump, run-out and stuff too.


ICC- grow some.

 

[SaiSrini]

If UDRS was implemented this might have been an entirely different series. South Africa dominated the 1st and were robbed in the 2nd due to shoddy umpiring.

Easily a better team than India

I dont think so. I wont call a team better than the other because they got the stick of bad umpiring. After Centurion, SA let India dominate completely in Durban, and were neck to neck with India in Newlands. If you see the series as a whole, a 1-1 result is fair enough to the teams.

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South Africa, India and England tied up right now as the best Test side in the world, imo. I think England is actually a shade ahead of the other 2 after their systematic destruction of Australia.

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Trying to get Mark to say something good about India is like trying to get War to admit he's wrong about anything. It's an exercise in futility so you can give up while you still have your sanity.

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On to the ODIs. I wish they'd just scrapped them and played another Test match!

I guess you're right sohum. I think England might actually be the best side in the world now after they have beaten Australia home and away. I guess they also did very well in SA when they toured last time, right? India vs England in England in 2011 should be the next firecracker series. Hope we have Irfan back in action in full flow for that series. We need a good swing bowler for England and Ishant Sharma is a waste of space in the team.

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India VS England this year and we will kill them for sure. Need a good bowler to support Zak though. Sree was good this series. Ishant needs to be thrown out. Singh back in form.(Batting + Bowling)

England and Australia(Both Away) and we need to get our selves up and raise to that level to dominate them.

Ho ho, wait... Killing England is not so easy. Their form right now is just exceptional.

 

[War]

ICC- grow some.

Unfortunately the ICC cant since its a lame duck organisation with no power. The BCCI is the defacto leaders of world cricket, so the ICC cant make them do anything.

Its very disgraceful since all the stubborn & stupid BCCI heads are doing is making a mockeryof test cricket in which different series from now will be played under different rules. IDIOTS!!!

 

[SaiSrini]

This series does set up the England vs India series to be a great showpiece now. Sreesanth proved that on wickets that offer help, he is no mug and if Zaheer is still playing then I'd back a close series.

I could also however see a total form collapse from India if injuries and retirements start coming soon. Take Laxman, Dravid, Zaheer and Tendulkar out of the picture and India look a very mediocre Test side. And those Test retirements will all come in 2011.

I dont think the veterans will all retire within the same year. If they do that, I WILL LOSE RESPECT FOR THEM!!!! They have to space out their retirements so that they transition the team into the future. Laxman and Tendulkar can easily play 2 more full years (Laxman can well play 3 years due to his age). Let Dravid retire after the England/Australia tours this year. Sachin should retire in the end of 2012, and Laxman in 2013. By then, bring in guys like Rahane, Mukund, Kohli, etc and establish Pujara and Vijay.

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Unfortunately the ICC cant since its a lame duck organisation with no power. The BCCI is the defacto leaders of world cricket, so the ICC cant make them do anything.

Its very disgraceful since all the stubborn & stupid BCCI heads are doing is making a mockeryof test cricket in which different series from now will be played under different rules. IDIOTS!!!

I agree with you. For once, I am hoping/expecting England to not bow down to the BCCI and implement the UDRS for the India-England test series to be held in England this year. SA bowed down to the BCCI and didnt implement it (its the prerogative of the host nation, remember?)

 

[War]

I agree with you. For once, I am hoping/expecting England to not bow down to the BCCI and implement the UDRS for the India-England test series to be held in England this year. SA bowed down to the BCCI and didnt implement it (its the prerogative of the host nation, remember?)

Yea i hope England can do that. But this is where the strenght of the BCCIs unfair power in the game will be really shown. Since if the ECB does that, it very possible the BCCI could threaten to boycott IND team for the series vs ENG & who blinks 1st will tell us alot.

 

[Highlander999]

I think 1-1 was a fair result there, though finally being able to watch South Africa (stupid student life style of no Sky Sports!) I don't really see why they are so highly rated except for Kallis and Steyn.

I do not care what stupid people think or tell.

India by atleast drawing the series (Almost won) have showed that they are and they can be number 1.

I do agree England on the other hand recently have beaten Australia currently and Africa year back in their home. They are definitely in the race but remember with India having to prove number 1 have to win series away, England are too should win a series in India. Flat track or not, It's an away series for you and you should win it.

People say India should do this India should do that, please guys mind your business. To India to prove number 1 they should win all away series and for other countries nothing that sort?

Africa,Australia,England or any other 4 countries must also win in India to prove their worth.

I totally agree with you on that. I doubt anyone can really force a result in India due to the nature of the wickets, barring any freak collapses or something like that.

South Africa, India and England tied up right now as the best Test side in the world, imo. I think England is actually a shade ahead of the other 2 after their systematic destruction of Australia.

I'm bias but I would agree. I think we have the most all-rounded side. We have the most depth on the bench, plus all our players have been performing well and their is a great team spirit. I reckon we will beat India when they come over later this year, any ideas when England next tours India?

India VS England this year and we will kill them for sure. Need a good bowler to support Zak though. Sree was good this series. Ishant needs to be thrown out. Singh back in form.(Batting + Bowling)

Tendulakar as always.

Dhoni in press conference said, for him 2 big tours are coming back to back.

England and Australia(Both Away) and we need to get our selves up and raise to that level to dominate them.

One bowler isn't enough though. On English pitches, Harbhajan isn't going to be all that effective unless some real turners get prepared (in which case Swann will go nuts) Sreesanth is too up and down and Sharma is pish. Going by what all the Indian members say here no one seems to know who should be in the side with the new ball, highlighting the lack of depth India has in their seam department.

Genuinely won't look forward to Tendulkar, Gambhir and Laxman though, I'm not too worried about the rest of the Indian line up. Dravid is past it, and the rest really lack any technique for the swinging ball which all the England batsmen have grown up playing. That's why I think England will win.

 

[aryan8262in]

@ Dare
In Zaheer's lbw case (lbw not given) Technology was inconclusive even in replays to rule in favour or against whether there was edge or not.

DeVilliers and Boucher got bad calls, but PLEASE DO NOT FORGET, highest run-scorer for SA in 2nd innings, Prince should have been out for 0, but not given. Morkel too was given 2 lives, by a no-ball call which wasn't.


SO sorry to dissapoint some sore fans, that even in test match where India seemed to have all the rub of the green (with Kallis unfortunate dismissal), the UDRS would have potentially overturned 3 decisions each for both teams.
So you too may need to get your facts right!!

i agree even prince was out lbw to bhajji when he was on 0..and also dont forget kallis was out lbw in 1st inning of this 3rd test hour before close of first days play when he was below 50 ..so that 162 is because of poor decision....even allan doald said as true cricket lover i think india is slightly ahead of africa and they are true num.1....umesh yadav instead of ishaant would have been great choice ..come on msd now stop including jadeja(ODI),ishaant(TEST) in xi and india can be unbeaten like aussies

 

[pcfan123]

Still South africa not good in spin track. They definetly failed to deliver.
India still good opponent in all flat, bounce, turn pitches. No other team same like than. Still england, south africa not good in spin track. After retirment of sachin, laxman, dravid. England may get top position. I dont thing much problem for india in england series. In last two or three series on england, india played well in England. India problem only face south africa in south africa. This series draw means. India played very well.

Jesus Christ

 

[War]

I guess you're right sohum. I think England might actually be the best side in the world now after they have beaten Australia home and away. I guess they also did very well in SA when they toured last time, right? India vs England in England in 2011 should be the next firecracker series. Hope we have Irfan back in action in full flow for that series. We need a good swing bowler for England and Ishant Sharma is a waste of space in the team.

They did but 1-1 wasn't a fair reflection of that series like how 1-1 with IND vs SA here was. SA should have won that series 2-1.

SA didn't have the depth to cover for losing Steyn & Kallis the bowler - thats basically why ENG managed to draw that series.

If we look back @ that series:

- In Centurion. ENG deserved that draw. SA selectors made the mistake of persisting with Ntini when he should have been dropped before that series, so they didn't help themselves with that selection. But with Steyn out & Kallis not being able to bowl, their back-ups weren't good enough to do that job on that final day.

- In Durban. ENG outplayed SA. But although Steyn came back, he was not bowling at his best. SA didn't help themselves by again making a poor selection is retaining Ntini instead of picking DeWet.

- In Capetown. ENG where lucky to draw that game. SA where on top for most of that game. Since they got their best side on the park for the 1st time in that series, esepcially in the bowling attack. Losing De Wet to injury on the final day was the difference in that game. Just like how AUS losing Bollinger @ the end of the Mohali test was difference in that test.

- In Jo'Burg. With no injuries hitting the attack & everything going smoothly for SA. SA totally smoked ENG.

So 2-1 to SA, would certainly have been a better reflection of that series.

 

[Adarsh]

Just out of interest, England haven't won a series against India, home or away, since 1996 !

 

[pcfan123]

They had not won the Ashes down under in 24 years either, this is an entirely different England side, in both skill and temperament.

Can't wait to see Anderson and Tremlett against the Indian batsmen.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

India's batting seems alright now, but it's getting to be a concern. Dravid is fading, VVS is constantly fighting his back problems now, Viru isn't dominating the moving ball, and Sachin can't go on for ever. Pujara is still finding his feet, Raina has been found out, MSD is useful for the odd cameo and can grind out an innings, but does lack a solid technique. Only Gambhir really is someone you can see scoring runs regularly now and for the next 4-5 years.

India need to blood some new comers soon.


And our pace attack is rubbish. We can afford to carry Sree, with Zak and Bhajji around he can get through the odd bad spell for the gems he can produce inbetween. But Ishant has to go. He must, for the good of the side now and for the good of his career.
Zak and Bhajji's replacements should be getting groomed too. We're okay with spin, with Ojha, Ashwin and Chawla on the bench. I'm worried about Zak's replacement...Mithun? Unadkat? Yadav? A comeback for one of Irfan/Balaji/RP?

We do need Munaf in the squad tho, as either our third or fourth seamer.


In the long term...I sense India's side is going to start struggling soon after the World Cup.