Wrestling thread

[GrayNicolls]

Haha! Unlucky. CM Punk was at Ring of Honor with Samoa Joe and Bryan Danielson. It was a rush to pick Punk, Joe and Danielson up. WWE got Punk, TNA got Joe and Danielson stayed at ROH.

In fact, hardly anyone in that list is WWE produced. And, I didn't know WWE stars were born in OVW and DSW? Wow. Vince McMahon has one large family.

 

[MUFC1987]

They may have worked on the indy circuit, but TNA are the ones which made them big names. You dont think WWE get indy guys? A lot of their stars did use to work in the indies. John Cena and The Undertaker both worked indies before joining WWE

No, there is a difference. Sure most guys have worked in other places and WWE is hardly going to pick up talent that has never been tried.

Let's look at the example of CM Punk. Like TNA guys, he made his name in the Indys and became well known as CM Punk around America. Whereas guys like 'Taker and people like Shawn Michaels, would not have been known as these characters, whereas WWE has produced these characters and the people behind them.

I look at it this way, WWE may not have produced the guys behind characters like Mr Kennedy and Umaga, but they made those stars by giving them those gimmicks. Whereas barring the odd name change for legal reasons, TNA is just a hub that indy workers move onto.

 

[GrayNicolls]

No, TNA change people's gimmicks too. You can't just say that TNA take on any old indy wrestler and keep their gimmicks? Of course they change them. Take Christopher Daniels, his new gimmick is weird. I doubt he's ever had that before and he has it at TNA.

 

[The Spin]

No, there is a difference. Sure most guys have worked in other places and WWE is hardly going to pick up talent that has never been tried.

Let's look at the example of CM Punk. Like TNA guys, he made his name in the Indys and became well known as CM Punk around America. Whereas guys like 'Taker and people like Shawn Michaels, would not have been known as these characters, whereas WWE has produced these characters and the people behind them.

I look at it this way, WWE may not have produced the guys behind characters like Mr Kennedy and Umaga, but they made those stars by giving them those gimmicks. Whereas barring the odd name change for legal reasons, TNA is just a hub that indy workers move onto.

So TNA dont bother giving guys gimmicks? That a lie...

You may think TNA doesnt because it keeps some of their most popular signings with their gimmicks already, but they built gimmicks around the rest of their roster.

Guys like CM Punk (who WWE havent changed the name of either) have their names kept the same because a lot of the indy fans watch TNA and would recognise them and know their name had been changed

Well you may not know but WWE use Ohio Valley Wrestling and Deep South Wrestling, and most of the WWE stars are born there, the WWE signs them onto development contracts and when they are"good" enough they move to raw, smackdown or ECW. Here is a list of wrestlers from development companies:


Monday Night Raw
Shelton Benjamin
Lance Cade
Carlito (Carly Colone)
John Cena (The Prototype)
Kenny Dykstra (Ken Doane)
Armando Alejandro Estrada (Hazem Ali)
Eugene (Nick Dinsmore)
Charlie Haas
Mickie James
Johnny Jeter
JTG (Jayson Paul)
Maria Kanellis
Chris Masters (Chris Mordetsky)
Robbie McAllister (Derek Graham-Couch)
Rory McAllister (Russell Murray)
Melina (Melina Perez)
Johnny Nitro (John Hennigan)
Randy Orton
Shad (Shad Gaspard)
Victoria (Lisa Marie Varon)


Friday Night Smackdown
Batista (Leviation)
The Boogeyman (Marty Wright)
Cherry (Kara Drew)
Deuce (James Reiher, Jr.)
Domino (Cliff Compton)
Jillian Hall
Mark Henry
K.C. James (Kurt Sellers)
Chris Kay - referee
Ken Kennedy (Ken Anderson)
Paul London
Michelle McCool (Michelle McCool-Alexander)
Mike "The Miz" Mizanin
Queen Sharmell (Sharmell Sullivan-Huffman)
Idol Stevens (Aaron Stevens)

ECW
Ariel (Shelly Martinez)
Elijah Burke
Mike Knox (Mike Hettinga)
Rene Dupree (Ren? Goguen)
Kelly Kelly (Barbie Blank)
Bobby Lashley (Franklin Roberto Lashley)
CM Punk (Phil Brooks)
Kevin Thorn (Kevin Fertig)
Sylvan (Sylvain Grenier)
Snitsky (Eugene Snisky)
Trinity (Stephanie Finochio)

Technically all of these wrestlers are self made and i don't see TNA having any great development territory??

All of them are self made? Here is where all of those were really trained:

Shelton Benjamin - Amateur Wrestling
Lance Cade - Shawn Michaels Wrestling Academy and indies
Carlito - WWC (World Wrestling Council)
John Cena - Ultimate Pro Wrestling
Kenny Dykstra - New England Wrestling
Charlie Haas - Heartland Wrestling Association
Mickie James - KYDA Pro Wrestling, BBOW, PGWA, DWOW, WEW and TNA
Maria Kanellis - Come on, she doesnt wrestle! She didnt need to be tought anything
Chris Masters - UPW
Robbie McAllister - Von Erich and Hart Brothers School of Wrestling
Rory McAllister - Von Erich and Hart Brothers School of Wrestling
Melina - EWF
Randy Orton - MMWA-SICW
Shad - Amateur Wrestling
Victoria - WCW

Batista - WCW and WXW
Cherry - IWF and ECPW
Deuce - UPW
Domino - Larry Sharpe Wrestling
Jillian Hall - GLORY
Mark Henry - Hart Brothers Academy
KC James - NAWF and IWA
Ken Kennedy - All star wrestling
Paul London - ROH and TNA
The Miz - UPW
Sharmell - WCW
Idol Stevens - Chaotic Wrestling

Ariel - UPW, RPW and EWF
Elijah Burke - Amateur Boxing
Mike Knox - Steve Islas Training
Rene Dupree - GPW
Lashley - NAIA
CM Punk - TNA, ROH
Kevin Thorn - MCW
Sylvain - NCW
Snitsky - wXw
Trinity - TNA

Only the following 8 were trained to wrestle by OVW:
Kelly Kelly - OVW
Michelle McCool - Diva Search and OVW
Boogeyman - OVW
Johnny Nitro - Tough Enough and OVW
Estrada - OVW
Eugene - OVW
Johnny Jeter - OVW
JTG - OVW

 

[sd92]

Ok, after some research on wikipedia i have noticed CM Punk was originally from TNA. Fair enough, and well done to TNA, but surely if TNA was so good he would have stayed there! OVW and DSW are seperate companies which are sponsored by WWE, for the use of facilities so superstars can train there etc. My list of stars which were developed by WWE development territory can be seen at

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio_Valley_Wrestling

By the way, i have never said there is anything wrong with TNA, and i find some of the six sided ring matches quite entertaining, but i just feel they don't live up to the standards of WWE and the fact that WWE has 3 brands, over many tv shows every week, several training territories and many more superstars, plus a lot more behind the scenes staff and a far bigger revenue, then surely at this current time WWE is more successful. I agree that maybe in the future TNA will challenge WWE and i have stated that but i believe McMahon will get around it, improve WWE and at some point possibly purchase TNA, making WWE even stronger than currently. Personally i hope they do because, i love the WWE storylines, the superstars etc, and i think it will make TNA better, but thats my opinion and you too are entitled to yours.

 

[Ireland_Rule]

Punk made his name in ROH, he was only in TNA for short while.

The person who said TNA haven't produced stars, they have taken indy wrestlers and made them big names, sure they didn't produce them but they made them big names.

It can only be good for us wrestling fans that TNA gets bigger, they will challenge WWE and Vince will have to make some changes and freshen WWE up.

IMO, TNA's wrestling is way better than WWE's and always has been, it may not have Worldwide status yet but they're touring now and they'll just keep growing.

 

[Master Khan]

I wish Sting go to WWE that would be great

 

[The Spin]

Im going to answer you in two halfs

Ok, after some research on wikipedia i have noticed CM Punk was originally from TNA. Fair enough, and well done to TNA, but surely if TNA was so good he would have stayed there! OVW and DSW are seperate companies which are sponsored by WWE, for the use of facilities so superstars can train there etc. My list of stars which were developed by WWE development territory can be seen at

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio_Valley_Wrestling

Why did Punk move to WWE? Because he got offered more money. Thats it. I know what OVW and DSW are, as I said in my last post on the subject. Your list of people may have all been at OVW at some point, but they wern't trained there, which is what you seemed to be saying, that "WWE made them into stars", when they didnt.

By the way, i have never said there is anything wrong with TNA, and i find some of the six sided ring matches quite entertaining, but i just feel they don't live up to the standards of WWE and the fact that WWE has 3 brands, over many tv shows every week, several training territories and many more superstars, plus a lot more behind the scenes staff and a far bigger revenue, then surely at this current time WWE is more successful. I agree that maybe in the future TNA will challenge WWE and i have stated that but i believe McMahon will get around it, improve WWE and at some point possibly purchase TNA, making WWE even stronger than currently. Personally i hope they do because, i love the WWE storylines, the superstars etc, and i think it will make TNA better, but thats my opinion and you too are entitled to yours.

Currently I would have to agree, WWE is more successful. Yes they have more money and more wrestlers and more staff and more TV shows. But none of those things make a wrestling show good. What makes it good is simply the talent of the wrestlers and the storylines. On wrestler talent TNA is far and away better than WWE. On WWE you have Cena and Batista, whereas TNA have Styles and Angle, who are far superior. On the storyline side I would say that TNA is superior still. WWE have used the same storylines again and again since the Monday Night Wars finished at the turn of the millenium. TNA have exciting, original and unpredictable stories. WWE is so predictable I predicted their Wrestlemania results and only got 2 wrong. All WWE fans say TNA will be the next WCW, Vince will buy them out but I dont think he will. I think TNA is far better organsied than WCW was and so it wont go under, it wont let itself be bought out. How will TNA being bought out help TNA? If it gets bought out it wont exist! Yeah thats helpful.

So as far as a product goes TNA is far ahead, now they only need to make themselves more known, which they are doing well. It is only a matter of time before TNA and WWE are at war with each other.

 

[sd92]

How will TNA being bought out help TNA? If it gets bought out it wont exist! Yeah thats helpful.

Yes, but ECW still exists? WCW might not, and i don't know why that is, but ECW still exists even though it disappeared for a while.

So as far as a product goes TNA is far ahead, now they only need to make themselves more known, which they are doing well. It is only a matter of time before TNA and WWE are at war with each other.

Yes i agree that someday WWE will probably be challenged by TNA, and this can only improve WWE even more than it already is and that can only be a good thing. I have nothing against your opinion and i would like to stress that, but my opinion is that WWE is superior, has better superstars and i enjoy to watch the wrestling more than what TNA produces. I hope you can understand this is only my opinion and that there is no right or wrong answer in this debate.

 

[Ireland_Rule]

ECW doesn't exist any more, it's WWE, they just use the ECW name, ECW died in 2001.

 

[The Spin]

Yes, but ECW still exists? WCW might not, and i don't know why that is, but ECW still exists even though it disappeared for a while

It doesnt exist, its just used as a joke by WWE

Yes i agree that someday WWE will probably be challenged by TNA, and this can only improve WWE even more than it already is and that can only be a good thing. I have nothing against your opinion and i would like to stress that, but my opinion is that WWE is superior, has better superstars and i enjoy to watch the wrestling more than what TNA produces. I hope you can understand this is only my opinion and that there is no right or wrong answer in this debate.

There is a right answer, TNA is better

Seriously, watch Styles/Daniels/Joe, you will love it. I cant give a link but im sure its on youtube somewhere

 

[sd92]

ECW doesn't exist any more, it's WWE, they just use the ECW name, ECW died in 2001.

I no that, but what i mean is if at some point the WWE happened to buy TNA then they could still keep it as TNA like WWE do with ECW. That is my reply to the post of Chez, which is above mine.

 

[The Spin]

They wouldnt though, they would keep 1 or 2 of the TNA guys and get rid of the rest, who would have to go back to the indies.

 

[Ireland_Rule]

I appreciate that some people enjoy WWE more than TNA but anyone who says WWe's wrestling is better is either blind, drunk or stupid.

Oh and it still isn't really ECW, there's only a few ECW Originals in and most of those will be phased out soon enough.

 

[sd92]

It doesnt exist, its just used as a joke by WWE

I don't get the joke whats so funny ???