All-Time Test XIs

[ZoraxDoom]

So...

Hobbs
Sutcliffe
Bradman
Tendulkar
Sobers
Imran (*)
Gilly (+)
Wasim
Warne
Marshall
Lillee

OR

Hobbs
Sutcliffe
Bradman
Tendulkar
Headley
Sobers
Knott (+)
Wasim
Warne (*)
Marshall
Lillee


Both look really good.

 

[shravi]

Viv just has to be in one of the teams. Don't be discouraged by his average. It would have been much higher if he didn't get bored.

 

[TumTum]

Viv just has to be in one of the teams. Don't be discouraged by his average. It would have been much higher if he didn't get bored.

Apart from Afridi nobody else in international throws their wicket away just because they get bored. It is not a valid argument.

Heard something similar to this when Sehwag fans were trying to justify his average against NZ, saying he wasn't taking it seriously because he didn't consider them a worthy opposition :laugh

 

[pcfan123]

1) Len Hutton
2) Jack Hobbs
3) Don Bradman
4) Sachin Tendulkar
5) Greg Chappel
6) G Sobers
7) A Gilchrist +
8) Imran Khan (c)
9) Shane Warne
10) Curtley Ambrose
11) Glenn McGrath

 

[Howsie]

Well there is another side to that coin though. His quick scoring also converts potential draws into losses. Take this match against Sri Lanka for example, if India collapses this morning then they have left Sri Lanka a lot of time to win the match. If Sehwag had taken another 100 balls to make his current score, then it would be harder for Sri Lanka to win.

It would also make it harder for India to win

Virender Sehwag is one of the reasons why India are on of the best test teams in the world, his ability to score quickly really does make up for India's rather poor test bowling attack. You take Sehwag out of that team and it becomes a lot weaker imo.

 

[shravi]

Apart from Afridi nobody else in international throws their wicket away just because they get bored. It is not a valid argument.

Heard something similar to this when Sehwag fans were trying to justify his average against NZ, saying he wasn't taking it seriously because he didn't consider them a worthy opposition :laugh

This is Viv Richards we are talking about here, not just some run of the mill cricketer. This is not just my opinion, it is also the opinion of many of the bowlers he not just dominated, but terrified.

 

[sifter132]

It would also make it harder for India to win

Virender Sehwag is one of the reasons why India are on of the best test teams in the world, his ability to score quickly really does make up for India's rather poor test bowling attack. You take Sehwag out of that team and it becomes a lot weaker imo.

Ah for sure, but you can see my point though right? If a team makes 500 against India then having Sehwag does NOT help. All he does is make the Indian innings shorter and unless India make 700 in reply they have little chance of winning so his scoring rate is more of a hinderance than a help. So a Sehwag is very handy if your team can get 20 wickets but just needs a bit more time to do so. But if your team can't get 20 wickets then you are better off with a guy who can bat longer.

I guess my greater point is that scoring rate in Test cricket can be a bit overrated. Because unless you played on the 70/80s Windies or 90/00s Aussies then you are going to have to face a defeat fairly often and you need to be able to adapt to those circumstances and fight for a result. Sehwag can't. His 2nd innings record is awful. I guess though that an all time XI wouldn't be facing defeat often, so perhaps his selection is a master stroke

 

[Flame_Blader1]

Ah for sure, but you can see my point though right? If a team makes 500 against India then having Sehwag does NOT help. All he does is make the Indian innings shorter and unless India make 700 in reply they have little chance of winning so his scoring rate is more of a hinderance than a help. So a Sehwag is very handy if your team can get 20 wickets but just needs a bit more time to do so. But if your team can't get 20 wickets then you are better off with a guy who can bat longer.

I guess my greater point is that scoring rate in Test cricket can be a bit overrated. Because unless you played on the 70/80s Windies or 90/00s Aussies then you are going to have to face a defeat fairly often and you need to be able to adapt to those circumstances and fight for a result. Sehwag can't. His 2nd innings record is awful. I guess though that an all time XI wouldn't be facing defeat often, so perhaps his selection is a master stroke

Say what? How does having sehwag not help? Quite a few of Sehwag's big centuries have been on the back of 500+ totals. Sehwag is a matchwinner not saver. You can't expect him to set you up for wins and also save matches. Because the way he plays he gives more chances to the opposition. There is no guarantee that he can survive for a significant amount of time if he blocked more deliveries in the second innings than regular. Sehwag is a bit of a gamble. He won't change his way that's for certain. He basically says "right this is what I can do, I won't change my way, do what u will". Now it's up to people to pick him.

 

[King Pietersen]

@ KP, if you mean Viv Richards, he wasn't an opener.

No, I didn't mean Viv. I meant Barry Richards, the South African opener. Best opener of all-time after Jack Hobbs for me.

 

[Num]

His 2nd innings record is awful.

I'm not sure of that. Sehwag averages 75.34 at a SR of 85.26 in the second innings of matches, in comparison to a career average of 54.56 at a SR of 81.59. In fact, based on Test matches since Sehwag's Test debut, he has been the best batsman (in terms of batting average) in the second innings of Test matches (of those who have batted in at least 20 second innings of Test matches).

(Stats are as of this post)

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com

Batting records | Test matches | Cricinfo Statsguru | Cricinfo.com

 

[sifter132]

^I meant his 3rd and 4th innings stats ie. his own team's 2nd innings. It just seems that as a match goes on he either gets bored, or his technique fails or he can't adjust his mindset properly because I don't think I've ever seen such a disparity between a players performance between his 1st and 2nd innings stats (or 1st and 2nd innings vs 3rd and 4th innings if you are thinking that way)

Say what? How does having sehwag not help? Quite a few of Sehwag's big centuries have been on the back of 500+ totals. Sehwag is a matchwinner not saver. You can't expect him to set you up for wins and also save matches.

Well if I'm voting him as one of the greatest openers of all time, I'd kinda like him to be able to do both... I guess my main point is that strike rate in Test cricket is a bit overrated. Often a great strike rate helps your team, but it can also punish your team too if you can't occupy the crease, especially if you play on a weak team. That's all I'm trying to say, not that Sehwag's quick scoring is useless or that he's a crappy player. Crease occupation is becoming an increasingly obsolete skill, just watch Pakistan bat , and I'm not sure it should be. People are riding the strike rate train.

 

[StinkyBoHoon]

sehwags 3rd and 4th innings averages aren't too bad if you take it from his recall in 2007 which is when he became elite. he lead the assaults on australia and england in the tests they won and saved the match in adelaide.

This is always an interesting aspect of all time XIs. Some people pick them as honorary line-ups to celebrate great achievements, these are teams that waugh, tendulkar, gavaskar would get into. but if you pick them as a measure of when a player was at the peak of his career (provided it was for a significant amount of time) you'd get a different selection.

If I was able to pick gavaskar at any age and transport him here I would not pick him ahead of sehwag, but I can't in all honesty say sehwag is a better batsman than gavaskar because gavaskar achieved so much. (I have used indian players to try and deflect appearances of bias, I am not suggesting those two are the best openers ever or anything mad)

 

[Cricketman]

Bradman less, to make it easier haha

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Sunil Gavaskar
3. Viv Richards
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Gary Sobers
6. Imran Khan (did he bat at 6?)
7. Allan Knott (wk) <- The best pure keeper just looks better in an all time xi imo
8. Shane Warne
9. Wasim Akram
10. Muttiah Muralitharan
11. Malcolm Marshall

I like that!

 

[Dare]

Bradman less, to make it easier haha

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Sunil Gavaskar
3. Viv Richards
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Gary Sobers
6. Imran Khan (did he bat at 6?)
7. Allan Knott (wk) <- The best pure keeper just looks better in an all time xi imo
8. Shane Warne
9. Wasim Akram
10. Muttiah Muralitharan
11. Malcolm Marshall

I like that!

Averaged 60+ in 23 innings at #6.

 

[sami ullah khan]

Bradman less, to make it easier haha

1. Jack Hobbs
2. Sunil Gavaskar
3. Viv Richards
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Gary Sobers
6. Imran Khan (did he bat at 6?)
7. Allan Knott (wk) <- The best pure keeper just looks better in an all time xi imo
8. Shane Warne
9. Wasim Akram
10. Muttiah Muralitharan
11. Malcolm Marshall

I like that!

You certainly have great balance in your team. Very potent bowling attack and a class all rounder to back it all up.