All-Time Test XIs

[mattfb]

Botham and Flintoff? Very interesting. No doubt a strong line-up though because Botham and Flintoff are both incredibly gifted bowlers and batsmen so it does just add a lot of depth I guess. I probably would have put Gooch in there somewhere and take out Flintoff maybe because atm you have 6 bowlers, and whilst Flintoff is a good batsmen he obviously isn't as solid and reliable as Gooch.

Still, a great side.

My all time Australian XI;

Ponsford
Hayden
Bradman
Ponting (vc)
Waugh (c)
Miller
Gilchrist (wk)
Warne
Lillee (op 2)
Spofforth (op 1)
McGrath

There was so many players I wanted to put in that I had to leave out. Whilst Trumper was a dominant batsmen, and argueably changed the way players batted, I think the partnership between Ponsford and Bradman played a big part in that. Hayden has been one of the most dominant batsmen of recent history which is why he gets the other opening spot.

Allan Border, Greg Chappell, Doug Walters, Bob Woodfull, Arthur Morris, Richie Beanaud, Jeff Thompson, Clarrie Grimmet, Charles Turner, Monty Noble, Alan Davidson, Albert Cotter and Craig McDermott were all part of a very big list I considered adding on. They all have fantastic record and could all have easily had made the side.

It was harsh leaving out Border, but I decided to go in with an allrounder considering he is one of the best all rounders ever to play the game. With almost 3000 runs at over 30 and 170 wickets at 22 I feel Keith Miller deserves the spot.

Spofforth got his spot over Thompson purely by the fact that he took 94 wickets in 18 tests at an average of 18. Nicknamed the demon he had a strike rate of 44 with 4 10 wicket matches. He claimed 14-90 (still the second best figured by an australian) in the series which resulted in the English Media to declare the death of English cricket. Cricket writer Neville Cardus wrote when of watching Spofforth bowl quick "Off-breaks and top spinners" which is very interesting.

Anyway, thats my side.

Feelin Blue? added 3 Minutes and 13 Seconds later...

Argh, just saw what Zorax said about 1 pure pacer in your line-up KP. To be honest, I didn't know most of those names in your bowling line up :o So I geuss Freddie and Botham need to be there in that case.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

I'll have a go at an Indian All Time Test XI:

1. Virender Sehwag
2. Sunil Gavaskar
3. Rahul Dravid
4. Sachin Tendulkar
5. Mohammad Azharuddin
6. Vijay Merchant
7. Kapil Dev
8. Farukh Engineer
9. Anil Kumble
10. Mohammad Nissar
11. Amar Singh

Not too happy with that tbh.

Hmm...you need Viswanath in there. Viru, Azhar, out. Maybe some of the spin quartet in place of Nissar/Singh. Even though they both were excellent. Dravid doubtful too. And Vinoo Mankad has to be there too.


????
Gavaskar
???
Tendulkar
Viswanath (Replaceable?)
Mankad
Dev
Engineer (+)
Amar Singh
Kumble
Bedi


Dravid and Viru might actually get in. And I would have liked to get Mansoor Ali Khan Pataudi (The Nawab of Patuadi) in simply for his leadership and formation of Indian cricket. And he was a pretty good batsman too. Maybe at 3? Also, Vijay Merchant is good, and I'm sure there are some awesome batsmen I'm forgetting. Bowling wise, only two (very good) fast bowlers there, Bedi+Kumble+Mankad the spin trio. Engineer as keeper for a lack of better options really. Syed Kirmani maybe? Or Kiran More? Dhoni is actually fourth in the all-time list, might as well stick him in...


Did a quick check up, some batsmen we are forgetting are Vengsarkar, Amarnath, Polly Umrigar, Vijay Hazare,...

Also, Eknath Solkar and Salim Durani are worth honoury mention...

 

[aussie_ben91]

I thought Dravid was the best number 3 that India have ever produced? Shame the deterioration towards the end of his career has lost him some crediably in some people's minds.

 

[shravi]

Dravid doubtful? Watchu smokin' Zorax?

Richie Benaud's XI shown on day 1 of the 3rd test was a very good team as well.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

I really do not like his recent form. At his peak, he has to be there, but overall, I'm not sure. Especially with the rich legacy of batsmen behind him...

 

[Dare]

A very strong XI, it cannot be disputed, the single change I'd suggest is to get Michael Holding in to the side instead of Lance Gibbs. I don't see the need for a spin bowler with a strike rate of 87.7 when you have one of the great fast bowlers sitting on the bench and Sobers waiting in the wings. I do respect your decision though as Gibbs was without a doubt a superb spin bowler. I don't think Walsh would have been the best replacement had you not chosen Gibbs as, although his longevity may be impressive, if we are looking at pure ability when in their prime, Walsh ranks behind a fair few West Indian pace bowlers.

Yea I wasn't sure about including Gibbs because a really good pace bowler has to miss out because of that.
I might have a little bias towards Walsh because people always seem to overlook him but I have no problem with Holding. Cant lose no matter which one I choose.

 

[mattfb]

Botham and Flintoff? Very interesting. No doubt a strong line-up though because Botham and Flintoff are both incredibly gifted bowlers and batsmen so it does just add a lot of depth I guess. I probably would have put Gooch in there somewhere and take out Flintoff maybe because atm you have 6 bowlers, and whilst Flintoff is a good batsmen he obviously isn't as solid and reliable as Gooch.

Still, a great side.

My all time Australian XI;

Ponsford
Hayden
Bradman
Ponting (vc)
Waugh (c)
Miller
Gilchrist (wk)
Warne
Lillee (op 2)
Spofforth (op 1)
McGrath

There was so many players I wanted to put in that I had to leave out. Whilst Trumper was a dominant batsmen, and argueably changed the way players batted, I think the partnership between Ponsford and Bradman played a big part in that. Hayden has been one of the most dominant batsmen of recent history which is why he gets the other opening spot.

Allan Border, Greg Chappell, Doug Walters, Bob Woodfull, Arthur Morris, Richie Beanaud, Jeff Thompson, Clarrie Grimmet, Charles Turner, Monty Noble, Alan Davidson, Albert Cotter and Craig McDermott were all part of a very big list I considered adding on. They all have fantastic record and could all have easily had made the side.

It was harsh leaving out Border, but I decided to go in with an allrounder considering he is one of the best all rounders ever to play the game. With almost 3000 runs at over 30 and 170 wickets at 22 I feel Keith Miller deserves the spot.

Spofforth got his spot over Thompson purely by the fact that he took 94 wickets in 18 tests at an average of 18. Nicknamed the demon he had a strike rate of 44 with 4 10 wicket matches. He claimed 14-90 (still the second best figured by an australian) in the series which resulted in the English Media to declare the death of English cricket. Cricket writer Neville Cardus wrote when of watching Spofforth bowl quick "Off-breaks and top spinners" which is very interesting.

Anyway, thats my side.

Feelin Blue? added 3 Minutes and 13 Seconds later...

Argh, just saw what Zorax said about 1 pure pacer in your line-up KP. To be honest, I didn't know most of those names in your bowling line up :o So I geuss Freddie and Botham need to be there in that case.

What's everyone think?

 

[aussie_ben91]

I'm surprised that Australia haven't produced many great pace bowlers. I'd swap Spofforth for either Thomson, Davidson or Gillespie and probably swap Miller for Border.

Or I'd drop Spofforth out of the side, put Miller at 8 and then play Border at 6.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

I'd always have Miller in an all time Aussie side. Was apparently hugely talented and played best under pressure. He hated matches which were heading for a draw or where his opponents were severely outclassed, so he would have made for good viewing...

 

[mukund_nadkarni]

I really dunno how you guys manage to put players you never saw bat or bowl in such lists?!! You take the word of others? How can you be sure? Stats can tell only so much about any player. Just look at present day cricketers.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

Good point, but if several players who've played along these guys, or several people who've seen them play, all claim they were great, then it's safe enough to agree. I guess.

 

[Dare]

I really dunno how you guys manage to put players you never saw bat or bowl in such lists?!! You take the word of others? How can you be sure? Stats can tell only so much about any player. Just look at present day cricketers.

so 20 years after Sachin retires some kid puts him in his world all time XI are we going to ask him why he is putting sachin in there because he never saw him bat or bowl?

If numerous legends of cricket say that Viv is one of the best they ever saw than yea he should be included. Also there are videos around, you know the thing youtube.

 

[mukund_nadkarni]

so 20 years after Sachin retires some kid puts him in his world all time XI are we going to ask him why he is putting sachin in there because he never saw him bat or bowl?

If numerous legends of cricket say that Viv is one of the best they ever saw than yea he should be included. Also there are videos around, you know the thing youtube.

Well, as I mentioned, seeing is believing. That includes videos and YouTube(as positive proof). If there had been no video technology today, such that a kid tomorrow would have no reference to Sachin other than second hand opinions, then I'd say he would be absolutely right to refrain from putting Sachin in any list at all.

The point I'm trying make really is what Barry Richards once said when asked about playing a county bowler with the edge of the bat upon being provoked. As Richards said that such legends tend to get out of hand. That he played only a couple of balls off the edge, not the entire over.

 

[mattfb]

I do take other peoples words and stats. 94 wickets in 18 matches at an average of 18 and a strike rate of 44, the man who played a massive part in destroying England in the series which resulted in ""The Ashes" being made is someone I believe deserves to feature in my team.

 

[mukund_nadkarni]

I do take other peoples words and stats.

No problem with that. But then when it comes to a toss between two very close players, that will lend you into lots of problems.

Since I don't know, thoroughly enough, the various selections in your team above, I can't comment on them. But consider this hypothetical situation. Assume video is yet to be invented. 20 years down the line, I tell a young kid about Rahul Dravid and Jaques Kallis, two of the finest of this generation. When the kid compiles his best eleven, how does he decide between them (including players only after the 1990s).

That apart, players who are worlds apart, like say Sehwag and Langer, will cause similar problems. Both bring extreme value to the team but in entirely different ways. How do you decide between them? Would you have Langer, in a team where you also have the Don?!

Now consider the team you have selected, or any other team posted here. Except for Sir Donald Bradman's(In my team that will be Sachin) spot, all others will have the above problems!