Ashes 2015 - Australia tour of England July/September 2015

[stefan]

People have off days.

Your opinion is one that I respect, but do not agree with. While you're correct that they were dominant when conditions suited them, I don't feel either was toothless when conditions didn't suit them. You are spot on about it in the first half of their careers. Not the second half. I've seen Jimmy bowl live in India and the previous trip where England beat India on rank turners I thought more than Swann and Panesar, he was the main weapon. I've only seen Steyn and McGrath apart from Anderson do that sort of stuff after the great Pakistani quicks.

As for Kumble, he also became a brilliant bowler in the second half of his career abroad. While the wickets were hard to come by in alien conditions, his economy was brilliant and he created a lot of pressure from one end.

There is no comparison between Steyn/McGrath and Anderson in India. Steyn and Pigeon averages 20 and 21, anderson averages 30.

 

[Deleted member 149013]

Can't remember many performances at home worse than this in the last 15 years. We did win the last match though. It's 1-1 at the end of the day. No need to panic.

What makes it worse was we let Australia down they turned up to play cricket.

 

[richowebbo]

There is no comparison between Steyn/McGrath and Anderson in India. Steyn and Pigeon averages 20 and 21, anderson averages 30.

Averages can be deceiving. The pitches Anderson played on in the second series were made for spinners, as I recall, and he still bowled rather well.

Anderson however was very poor in both innings in this match. The bowlers were as much to blame for this defeat as the batsmen. Except Broad, they were all poor. Moeens wickets only came via mistimed slogs.

 

[PokerAce]

Was going through twitter, and Piers Morgan is going full on bring KP back mode. The sad thing is the responses to his tweets disappoint me, and some happen to be just downright mean to KP, and completely unfair.

I actually feel KP would have a lot of sympathy about his comeback if his cause was not being led by one of the biggest universally accepted c*nts.

 

[bigred]

I've been convinced by the popular theory in this thread that changes need to be made. Don't think I'd want to make 3 changes and get rid of all 3 struggling batsmen.

1. Lyth
2. Cook
3. Hales
4. Root
5. Bairstow
6. Stokes
7. Buttler
8. Ali
9. Broad
10. Wood
11. Anderson

Think Lyth needs the whole series. We can't keep changing our opener.

 

[Deleted member 149013]

England captain Alastair Cook:

"We have to take this on the chin"

One of Peter Moores sayings, personally don’t think any man should ever say that phase or encourage others to say it.

 

[blockerdave]

I've been convinced by the popular theory in this thread that changes need to be made. Don't think I'd want to make 3 changes and get rid of all 3 struggling batsmen.

1. Lyth
2. Cook
3. Hales
4. Root
5. Bairstow
6. Stokes
7. Buttler
8. Ali
9. Broad
10. Wood
11. Anderson

Think Lyth needs the whole series. We can't keep changing our opener.

not really changing the team as such, but i think it's better for Lyth not to face the first ball. would move him to 2.

i personally think it's harsh to jettison Ballance right now... though he isn't doing a lot to back up my faith. i'd be inclined to give him one more.

 

[richowebbo]

not really changing the team as such, but i think it's better for Lyth not to face the first ball. would move him to 2.

i personally think it's harsh to jettison Ballance right now... though he isn't doing a lot to back up my faith. i'd be inclined to give him one more.

You're right, but Ballance should be at 5, and Bairstow in. He's made another ton for Yorkshire, so has to come in, in my opinion.

Cook, Lyth, Root, Bairstow, Ballance, Stokes, Butler, Moeen

Then the bowling....If its a similar pitch, do you keep Anderson in the team?

 

[richowebbo]

I think PokerAce somewhere said that Anderson only takes wickets on custom made pitches (custom made for JImmy). I do not think this is true at all. English conditions usually suit Anderson to a tea. I don't think anything is custom made. The below, for me, sums up why Australia won, and massive praise for the way they did this.

"In conditions more akin to Lahore than London, Mitchell Johnson, Mitchell Starc and Josh Hazlewood compensated for the lack of pace in the pitch by bowling full and straight, resulting in seven England batsmen being bowled."

 

[blockerdave]

I don't see how Root can bat at three. I wouldn't have him higher than 4.

Jimmy's issue is fitness - he struggles with back to back tests going back to 2013 Ashes he diminishes in effect over course of series and these pitches are killing him.

 

[Excommunicado]

Yeah I was thinking that as well, but it would be good to have someone who can bowl 90+ and bowl at the stumps. Whether Finn has the skill to do this is another question! You could almost dispense of Jimmy on these sort of pitches as he doesn't really bowl quick enough to be any danger if the ball isn't swinging. Be a bit harsh on Jimmy though.

Lots of people have jumped on the back of Lyth as well. I just think he needs time to flourish. Not many players come straight in and perform. My only change would be Bell in terms of players, but I don't think Ballance should bat at 3. Who the answer is, I don't know.[DOUBLEPOST=1437225079][/DOUBLEPOST]

Butler and Moeen are both good batsmen. After that, Wood and Broad can hang about if they're up for being hit my short balls. However, Australia should win this.

We saw what Moeen, Buttler, Wood and Broad could do.. They did an 92 style comeback, (from the Ashes 2013).

Haha.

 

[PokerAce]

I think PokerAce somewhere said that Anderson only takes wickets on custom made pitches (custom made for JImmy). I do not think this is true at all. English conditions usually suit Anderson to a tea. I don't think anything is custom made. The below, for me, sums up why Australia won, and massive praise for the way they did this.

Hmm ... by custom made of course I mean typical english wickets, with plenty of grass and lateral movement off the pitch.

For instance in Edgebaston, I expect the wicket to be green and have support for Anderson, hence I used the phrase "custom made". The larger part however still remains.

Anderson is the best bowler in the world on pitches that help him, and looks ordinary more often than not on pitches that don't aid his kind of bowling, much like it was with Kumble back in the day.

 

[Markkkkk]

That doesnt mean its custom made. Every pitch in England is like that, are the pitches in the subcontinent custom made for spinners? Are Australias pitches custom made for Johnson? No, thats how they are, just because someone suits his home conditions doesnt mean its custom made.

 

[grkrama]

Jimmy's issue is fitness - he struggles with back to back tests going back to 2013 Ashes he diminishes in effect over course of series and these pitches are killing him.

ya if anything these pitches neutralized broad and anderson the two best chance eng have of taking 20 wkts, if they had swann in the attack these pitches may have made sense of giving adv to eng but of now they just make their pace attack flat.

 

[blockerdave]

Hmm ... by custom made of course I mean typical english wickets, with plenty of grass and lateral movement off the pitch.

For instance in Edgebaston, I expect the wicket to be green and have support for Anderson, hence I used the phrase "custom made". The larger part however still remains.

Anderson is the best bowler in the world on pitches that help him, and looks ordinary more often than not on pitches that don't aid his kind of bowling, much like it was with Kumble back in the day.

disagree with this. had some merit in the past, but less so now at the beginning of the series. Look at WI series earlier this year. But he wouldn't have been able to produce that later in the series. that's the concern... back in 2013 he had a big effort to help us win at Trent Bridge then did nothing for another year! does he have the fitness to play back to back test matches and 5 match series? it's looking like not - it's a long standing problem. the deadness of the pitch just exacerbates it.

jimmy has proven he can take wickets in all conditions, the question mark now is whether he can last a series or cope with back to backs.