Ashes Cricket 2013 General Discussion

[angad]

....oh and IMO, AC09 is a great title and anyone who says less hasn't played it.

Agreed!! Ac09 was a fun cricket game to play (mainly due to the online component), however it was clearly not the best cricket game by a HUGE margin.....specially on consoles (as I think PC guys got a patch which rectified most of the issues). But it was a fun game to play....way better than EA games!

 

[Biggs]

It certainly wasn't perfect, but no game ever is. It's the best we've had on PC to date... Credit where it's due n'all.

 

[Gone4aDuck]

It pains me to say this, but it now makes me wish codemasters never backed out of their games. It's been said many times, but an updated version of ic2010 every year would probably have been a really good game by now.
It also pains me to say I agree with Biggs, as the last two games were far from broken terrible products. Each had a few bugs which if ironed out would have developed a great game.

 

[whiteninness]

It pains me to say this, but it now makes me wish codemasters never backed out of their games. It's been said many times, but an updated version of ic2010 every year would probably have been a really good game by now.
It also pains me to say I agree with Biggs, as the last two games were far from broken terrible products. Each had a few bugs which if ironed out would have developed a great game.

I disagree. These games are viewed with rose tinted glasses just because they are "the best games we have ever had", despite that not saying an awful lot.

For me, cricket comes in three parts: batting, bowling and fielding.

Batting in these games was fun, I'll give you that. It had some bugs like playing hook shots to yorkers and the mechanic was a bit too simple but it could be a real challenge to build an innings and an enjoyable one at that.

Fielding was a one-dimensional mini game that not even the developers liked. Never did it make you feel like you could influence the game with a brilliant piece of work. The fact that catches all had the same difficulty, whether they were easy ones in the outfield or fast slips catches, may be considered a bug of sorts. Even with that fixed though, the mechanic still would have been shallow and boring.

Bowling was rubbish. This was not due to bugs (although they existed) but due to the fundamental mechanic of a good ball being a good ball all the time. There was 100% no strategy to bowling, except for the exploits previously mentioned like 3 bouncers then a yorker often getting a wicket. Do you think you can bowl a great leg cutter that pitches on middle to take off? Well, if the bowling reticule is not green, then on hard mode it will be hit for six. Where is the fun in that? Bowling for mine was a darts game with surrounding cricket animations, and a simple darts game at that.

With those things in mind I'd say:

Batting: 7/10 but 8/10 if bugs were removed
Fielding: 4/10 but 5/10 if bugs were removed
Bowling: 2/10 but 3/10 if bugs were removed

Definitely not a great game, IMO, unless you are content with only playing online (the bowling mechanic is still flawed there but slightly hidden if people want to play realistic cricket) or simulating the bowling innings.

 

[Biggs]

Fielding was a joke in AC09, but no-one has really ever nailed fielding... yet (stares across the hallway at BigAnt). Bowling was better than 2/10 but you're correct in the strategy thing being irrelevant because, again, no-one has really ever nailed a decent bowling simulation either... your "darts" analogy is fairly accurate but could easily be used to describe EA07 as well. Just a fundamental flaw with the traditional style of bowling gameplay and how it's been presented in the game, something in desperate need of innovation. I don't know if Codemasters would have changed much, as there were A LOT of hangovers from older products in AC09 and IC10 and it did need some fresh concepts, but the fundamentals of a great game were there, had they been supported continuously and if IC10 was released on PC I think we'd be saying different things about the product 3 - 4 years down as we are today.

 

[blockerdave]

Fair enough. I picked the bit of the quote I felt was the biggest part of the question at hand. I didn't do it to be selective, outside the perennial point that I can't talk about things that aren't public knowledge: I can't tell you where things were at what point...

I will tell you though that gameplay is NEVER finished. Gameplay is king. All games I've ever worked on have always had little tweaks right up to launch, and the cricket games are perhaps the most delicately balanced (which is why the patch in 09 was so fast: they were small changes which made a big difference)...

oh yeah, i fully understand there are limits to what you can say. and i can also appreciate the game maybe isn't as bad as "we" (or i better say "some of us") imagine, but my original point was you were saying how could we know anything without playing it, but i would contend that i don't think we have to have played it to know that the history of the last few months indicate we were hardly going to have a classic on our hands.

as i say IF we actually managed to get our hands on it, it could easily turn out to be much better than we fear. but if it was shaping up to be an excellent game 6/8 months ago i think things would have played out very differently than they have, so the original question/point from (i think) punkskater was valid and that was all i was really trying to say.

 

[whiteninness]

Fielding was a joke in AC09, but no-one has really ever nailed fielding... yet (stares across the hallway at BigAnt). Bowling was better than 2/10 but you're correct in the strategy thing being irrelevant because, again, no-one has really ever nailed a decent bowling simulation either... your "darts" analogy is fairly accurate but could easily be used to describe EA07 as well. Just a fundamental flaw with the traditional style of bowling gameplay and how it's been presented in the game, something in desperate need of innovation. I don't know if Codemasters would have changed much, as there were A LOT of hangovers from older products in AC09 and IC10 and it did need some fresh concepts, but the fundamentals of a great game were there, had they been supported continuously and if IC10 was released on PC I think we'd be saying different things about the product 3 - 4 years down as we are today.

EA had essentially the same mechanism but at least they hid it under the covers a bit by not colour-coding the reticule according to what the game had pre-determined to be a good ball or not. The EA games had the advantage of having modable AI though.

 

[Biggs]

Yeah, I genuinely think had IC10 been released on PC and then officially patched out the problems, a community-driven patch after a few years would have resulted and we'd be having a completely different conversation right now regarding Codemasters/Trickstar.

 

[sami ullah khan]

While AC 09 and IC 2010 were good games and kept me occupied for two to three months, the Bowling Marker Mechanic was breathing its last. If another version did come out after IC 2010 with a bit of polish, it still would have not been better than 6/10 with the presence of bowling marker there.
Ashes 2013 again had the same formula but the developers in their mind were in for a quick cash grab. After three years of drought, cricket gaming fans were famished for a cricket game. The developers also did not realize that they had serious competition coming from Ross. That explains the lack of feature and polish in AC 2013. In absence of competition we would have happily purchased the game, glorified a few bits and slammed the game for bugs and lack of depth.
Whatever happens from hereon in is going to be for good. It would be better if Trickstar scrap this project for consoles at least and look to give DBC a run for their money next year or whenever. They will have learnt a lot from their mistakes (hopefully) and we might as well have a rivalry of Cricket game developers.

 

[barmyarmy]

The question I would ask is what cricket game was better than IC10? It had bugs and wasn't perfect by any means but it was the best there was.

 

[Biggs]

What was better? It's apparently coming early September*






*could be a euphemism.

 

[saif258]

a good page of discussion there.

The question I would ask is what cricket game was better than IC10? It had bugs and wasn't perfect by any means but it was the best there was.

as repeated as it sounds the bar for cricket games is just way too low(10 years behind other games).personally i didn't like ac10. batting in ea at least had a fluid motion.
on a side note was looking at the motion capture video ac13 put on youtube.they could have got a state or club player atleast.technically the shots are just off.but even in general the dude in the mocap suit was a whimp.even if they program it well the players are gonna look odd. i think im in a grumpy glass half full mood..

 

[Punk_Sk8r]

Jamie is a good guy but his continued defense of a rubbish project is not going to get him any fan following here. Sometimes you got to call a spade, a spade.

And there is the problem. Chief isn't necessarily defending the product - he is defending against statements like this. The media provided so far (screenshots and videos) has obviously had its major flaws. However the fact is that people are judging the game itself without having played the damn thing - calling it a rubbish product without knowing everything about it is ignorant. Some of the features (lack of fielding, license restrictions) etc, of course may lead you to a certain assessment of the quality, but a straight up assertion that the complete product is rubbish is silly.

You can say the same about the other game - I love the information and content that has been provided so far, but there are clowns calling it the best cricket game ever, when in reality they haven't played that game either. I still have massive reservations about it given the games of the past.

I think one thing we can argue without any debate, is that the communication and community support (of late) has been rubbish (relative to the competitor and relative to what they have provided in the past).

I think I should have re-phrased. Sure I don't know what the game is like but imo chief is some how portraying the fact as if he didn't know anything about how bad things were going which they clearly are as we can see now...there's nothing to see. But I think he gives off the impression as if the game was on track somewhat when he was there then miraculously out of the blue everything went tits up.

Don't take my word for gospel and say "no game goes on track" or something like that lol

 

[79cricket]

While AC 09 and IC 2010 were good games and kept me occupied for two to three months, the Bowling Marker Mechanic was breathing its last. If another version did come out after IC 2010 with a bit of polish, it still would have not been better than 6/10 with the presence of bowling marker there.
Ashes 2013 again had the same formula but the developers in their mind were in for a quick cash grab. After three years of drought, cricket gaming fans were famished for a cricket game. The developers also did not realize that they had serious competition coming from Ross. That explains the lack of feature and polish in AC 2013. In absence of competition we would have happily purchased the game, glorified a few bits and slammed the game for bugs and lack of depth.
Whatever happens from hereon in is going to be for good. It would be better if Trickstar scrap this project for consoles at least and look to give DBC a run for their money next year or whenever. They will have learnt a lot from their mistakes (hopefully) and we might as well have a rivalry of Cricket game developers.

Bigant are changing the way cricket games will be played but we are yet to see if this is a good idea like it is on paper or a flawed mess. I always liked the pitch marker so I don't see that as the problem with ashes 2013. My mean fault is no one knows what the game looked like now, they go missing time and time again with no answer and then storm back with promise this and that.

Who knows what will happen to trickstar and ashes 2013 but I bet Mike F will show up sooner or later.

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The question I would ask is what cricket game was better than IC10? It had bugs and wasn't perfect by any means but it was the best there was.

I have defended this game time and time again, best since shane 99 for me. Sure had a lot wrong with it but was a lot of fun and a bright future I thought trickstar would have, now in 2013 all I feel is

 

[las_faiz]

IC 2010 had a completely broken online component. How the hell can it be the best game of the decade when one of the crucial component is completely broken

Will anyone buy a Fifa or even a Rugby game if they know the online component is kaput. Baffles me how such an obvious bug passed QA

On top of that, they didn't even bothered after the game released

Same disappearing act as we are seeing now. Only difference is AC2013 can't even pass the certification process