Dec 16-20: 3rd Test - Australia v England at Perth

[barmyarmy]

I think we're in danger of being a bit over-confident. Our batting is perfectly capable of collapsing and Australia in Australia are always going to fight back.

 

[Lee1981]

I think we're in danger of being a bit over-confident. Our batting is perfectly capable of collapsing and Australia in Australia are always going to fight back.

C,mon man, lets enjoy the fact we are a much better team and are proving it right now,the aussies would be giving us loads of stick if it was the other way around,
Lets give it to them big time we have been waiting along time to be able to hammer them.

 

[War]

C,mon man, lets enjoy the fact we are a much better team and are proving it right now,the aussies would be giving us loads of stick if it was the other way around,
Lets give it to them big time we have been waiting along time to be able to hammer them.

Not really. Barmyarmy's approach as a England fan is correct.

Sensible AUS fans if the situation was the other way around would not give us stick i'd say. But of course usually in past Ashes series, those views of such AUS fans aren't seen in the media.

 

[Lee1981]

You cant really blame any england for getting carried away right now, we just have so much momentum it is a great time to be an englishman.

 

[War]

If Australia does lose the Ashes and he has a poor series, I would have thought Ponting would retire out of...well shame is not quite the right word, but lack of pride perhaps. Depends on his mindset afterwards, if he's hungry to right the wrongs, or whether he's just sick of it. If he's still hungry, I agree - keep Ponting. He's a great guy to have in the team. Dunno whether he'd consider giving Clarke the captaincy though.

Yea i expect Ponting to be hungry & want to correct some of the wrongs as long as i body & ability aloows him to.

Sounds nice, but with that definition not many risks would ever be taken. I mean if North is replaced would you be 100% confident that Dave Hussey would outplay him? I might be 70% sure, but you'd be a lunatic to have it at 100% - otherwise you'd be betting everything you owned on it.

And I wouldn't call bringing Hussey or White as 'conservative' - they weren't even in the 17 man Gabba squad. Surely their selection would show even more of a risk taking attitude by the selectors if they'd suddenly leapt over Khawaja, Ferguson and Smith.

I do see your greater point though and I'd agree. Try random, more risky things next series, but not with a big series on the line.

Well the reasons which i'd say is fairly sensible why D Hussey or White (mailny Dussey) would have leaprfrogged Khawaja & Ferguson. Is because those youngsters have not be scoring runs heavily in domestic cricket @ a crucial time when they should have.

So going for the experience of D Hussey as a like-for-like replacement for North as a short term fix for the last 3 tests. As the experienced middle order bat instead of young Smith.

But yes bigger risk should happen after the Ashes. Its like the 2005 Ashes, when after AUS where struggling to take wickets going into the final two Ashes. Their was calls at the time especially going into the Oval test for Watson to come in @ # 6 for Katich.

That would have been a more soild selection risk at the time since Watson case as a test all-rounder then was more solid than Smith now.

Oh and War - just saw an article on Cricinfo you'll love Holding role and spinner in the same sentence!!
India in South Africa 2010-11: Harris comfortable with holding role against India | Cricket News | South Africa v India | ESPN Cricinfo

. Yea but Harris place is definately in jeopardary for SA, since if Imran Tahir was available he wouldn't have been picked. Since Harris in the last year is becoming Hauritz like in his struggles to be a wicket-taking threat on final day pitches as his recent struggles vs Windies & PAK & the back end of the series for ENG showed.

Also I CANNOT BELIEVE this talk of bringing Mitchell Johnson back and im absolutely staggered that hes not going to be playing in the shield game over the weekend. Surely to god he needs as much bowling practice as possible so he can at least get them landing on the pitch! I just dont see how he is going to be any different from brisbane...if anything he should have bowled better in Brisbane than in Perth given that the Gabba pitch is now the fastest in the country!

Indeed. Its madnes that Johnson isn't getting some game time going into the 3rd test if they indeed will recall him. Its wayyyyy to much of a risk for fans to believe & the coaches to trust that he would have improved with no game time & just based on them dealing with him in nets.

Also does anyone know what the story is with Shaun Tait...I think hes the type of bowler we need...someone who is going to bowl quick and take wickets...bowl him from one end in 3-4 over bursts where he bowls flat out...Nathan Hauritz to come on when hes given a breather...then from the other end...you switch between Stuart Clark and Ben Hilfenhaus...I pick Stuart Clark over Peter Siddle because I'm not exactly sure what Peter Siddle's role is! If hes been picked to keep it tight at one end...well hes not doing that...and hes obviously not being picked to take wickets because apart for his 6-fer hes barely got anything! I feel the job hes being picked for is better suited to Stuart Clark; keep it tight and take 2-3 wickets per innings! Hilfenhaus is your swing bowler but id be doing everything possible to get Nathan Bracken back to 100%...hes the one bowler in this country who you KNOW can swing the ball more than anyone!.

Tait has pretty much retired from test cricket, by saying that he doesn't think his body can with stand 5 day cricket anymore.

Big stuey Clark is too much of a risk also. His pace & zip that made him such a world class operator between South Africa 2005 - Windies 2008, has been gone since Ashes 09, which is why he was dropped.

Ryan Harris currently has the ability to do the role Clark did & bowls it close to 150 ks at times.

Trent Copeland is the only quick outside of the 5 than have been used in the opening two test, that should be considered.

Bracken never really swung the red ball in tests if you recall. In his first series vs IND 03/04 he struggled to replicate the swing he got with the white ball in the TVS Cup ODI series in IND 2003 when he owned the IND batsmen. Neither in his recall vs Windies 2005. Thats why he basically became a ODI specialist, since he never swung the ball.

Bracken success in ODIs between 2005-2008 also was hardly even built on swing. Its was built on him remodelling himself as off-cutter/seamer. So Bracken would be a bit of a silly choice my friend.

Its been a weird series for Sidvicious since the 1st day & Brisbane. I dont think he has bowled that badly in either two innings @ all to be fair. He certainly bowled wayyy better than Johnson @ Brisbane & Bollinger @ Adelaide.

If you are picking a 4-man pace attack. Siddle & Johnson would be battling for a spot since they both are attacking quicks - both can't play. Since Bollinger once fit will lead the attack & Hify/Harris would be the workhorse quicks.

 

[War]

Sounds like we can expect the following changes when the selectors officially announce the squad.

Out - North, Bollinger, Doherty, Katich
In - Smith, Johnson, Hauritz, Hughes

Happy enough with that, could do with less Johnson but it seems all the selectors did was rest him and tried to work on him. I pray it works else the selectors need to stop pissing around with him and ditch him until he properly sorts himself out. Him and Hauritz will help out with the lower order and ease the mind of those that don't quite rate Smith's batting in particular the selectors themselves.

- I can accept Bollinger missing out if their is some worry that he suddenly struggling for 100% match fitness. Since AUS needs its spear head running in @ full pace like the Dougie for the past 12 months for 20+ overs if required. Rather than for 1 spell & then losing pace significantly.

But then again maybe that hard test match is what may kick him back into full fitness. Since obviously the intensity of the shield game between the 1st & 2nd test wasn't anywhere close to the what his body needed going into the Adelaide game.

- Smith unforuntaley is too much of a risk as i & many have said. Should be D Hussey coming in. But unforutantely the lunatic selectors are just continuing to losr the plot.

- The situation with Johnson is beyond ridiculous really. You need to give Johnson game time to possibly work on whatever adjustments the backroom people have suggested to him.

Its like what Gooch was working on with Alastiar Cook technical issues before the Ashes. He needed game time in warm-ups to work on the adjustment Gooch suggested to him. Same thing with Johnson. Such a glaring error could cost AUS the Ashes.

- The less said about Hauritz recall the better. All i'll say is if they indeed recall him. Expect to be just as ineffective as Doherty.

I cannot believe after coming to their senses after dropping him, they are convinced he has improved based on him taking a 5 for vs a rubbish Westerm Australia batting lineup. Have they forgetten what the solid/strong Victorian batsmen did to him early this season??. UNBELIEVABLE!!!

The situation with Hauritz is summed up by the article questioning the strenght of AUS domesitc cricket currently in some areas:

ABC Sport - Domestic cricket system 'not what it was'


Also good to see Dussey getting some backers:

David Hussey begs Australian selectors to pick him for third Test | Herald Sun

 

[pcfan123]

Interesting to see what the bookies think about the series. According to bet365

If Perth manages to be a draw, the bookies might even call it for England (by offering ridiculous odds .20 or something).

Either way it will take a miracle for Australia to regain the Ashes and the whole "5-0" crowd have been shut up, hell they don't even show up to the stadiums anymore

Dare say England is actually the number 1 Test team in the world.

 

[barmyarmy]

C,mon man, lets enjoy the fact we are a much better team and are proving it right now,the aussies would be giving us loads of stick if it was the other way around,
Lets give it to them big time we have been waiting along time to be able to hammer them.

I'm all for enjoying it but I prefer to hold my fire on how crap the Aussies are for after the series is secured

 

[Themer]

Dare say England is actually the number 1 Test team in the world.

Wouldn't go that far. If we comprehensively beat India in England next summer then we're right up amongst the top three though.

 

[aussie1st]

I know Bollinger was poor, but his record is good, surely you'd back him for more than 1 test? Or has Johnson suddenly got rid of his issues? Don't see that logic, I'm afraid.

I'm hoping it is a fitness issue which was fair enough as Bollinger was well off the pace.

So looks like the fans of foxsports will be happy as this is the team they wanted.

1. Shane Watson
2. Phillip Hughes
3. Ricky Ponting
4. Michael Clarke
5. Mike Hussey
6. Brad Haddin
7. Steve Smith
8. Mitchell Johnson
9. Ryan Harris
10. Peter Siddle
11. Ben Hilfenhaus/ Nathan Hauritz

 

[woodzy]

Tait has pretty much retired from test cricket, by saying that he doesn't think his body can with stand 5 day cricket anymore.

Big stuey Clark is too much of a risk also. His pace & zip that made him such a world class operator between South Africa 2005 - Windies 2008, has been gone since Ashes 09, which is why he was dropped.

Ryan Harris currently has the ability to do the role Clark did & bowls it close to 150 ks at times.

Trent Copeland is the only quick outside of the 5 than have been used in the opening two test, that should be considered.

Bracken never really swung the red ball in tests if you recall. In his first series vs IND 03/04 he struggled to replicate the swing he got with the white ball in the TVS Cup ODI series in IND 2003 when he owned the IND batsmen. Neither in his recall vs Windies 2005. Thats why he basically became a ODI specialist, since he never swung the ball.

Bracken success in ODIs between 2005-2008 also was hardly even built on swing. Its was built on him remodelling himself as off-cutter/seamer. So Bracken would be a bit of a silly choice my friend.

Its been a weird series for Sidvicious since the 1st day & Brisbane. I dont think he has bowled that badly in either two innings @ all to be fair. He certainly bowled wayyy better than Johnson @ Brisbane & Bollinger @ Adelaide.

If you are picking a 4-man pace attack. Siddle & Johnson would be battling for a spot since they both are attacking quicks - both can't play. Since Bollinger once fit will lead the attack & Hify/Harris would be the workhorse quicks.

Has Tait confirmed his retirement from test cricket? We need bowlers like him in the test team; players who can take wickets and he can be a very lethal is hes managed effectively; bowling in 4 over spurts, plus we've got Watson as an extra seamer to cover some of the overs youd lose if youd played a regular quick.

I disagree with your points on Bracken. Hes a much different bowler to the one that made his debut in 2003-2004 in the sense that hes has matured and is far more consistent. His success is entirely based upon swing; hes definitely not picked for his pace! His ability to bowl cutters and add subtle variations are something which he added to his game so as Ponting can use him during the middle overs of one dayers to make scoring hard with Gilchrist standing up to the stumps. In short, you need to pick bowlers who can do something with the ball! In saying that, I have been impressed with Trent Copeland!

 

[sifter132]

IF ponting Goes it is obvious for good choice that White should be ODI capt. but who would be the best test captain??

Either Clarke or somebody unknown...

I doubt White gets the ODI gig. All long as Clarke is in the team he'll be captain until he proves that he's a bad captain. I haven't seen White captain enough to anoint him as some super awesome captain, but he'd have to be pretty damn good to go ahead of Clarke - and that's IMO, let alone the selectors.

It's drivel enough as it is in the media, without bringing it up in actual discussion.

I was expecting the Warne comeback stuff to happen in 2009. Rajasthan winning the IPL the year before, no obvious spinner stepping up (McGain had just been spanked in SA). But it seems no one was offering $1 million back then

Has Tait confirmed his retirement from test cricket?

I think he has. Everytime I've heard Tait being asked about Tests, he just laughs. Kind of like the Shane Warne reaction when he's asked about a comeback. I think if the selectors or Ponting asked Tait straight out (instead of journalists and fans), then he might start taking it seriously. I can't see someone turning down a baggy green. Same for Warney actually.

 

[aussie1st]

I think he has. Everytime I've heard Tait being asked about Tests, he just laughs. Kind of like the Shane Warne reaction when he's asked about a comeback. I think if the selectors or Ponting asked Tait straight out (instead of journalists and fans), then he might start taking it seriously. I can't see someone turning down a baggy green. Same for Warney actually.

Really can't see Warney accepting it even if Ponting got down on his knees and begged. Seems to be a bit of conflict between the two and Warne is always taking pot shots at Ponting.

 

[TumTum]

Dare say England is actually the number 1 Test team in the world.

Certainly. Trott and Swann being the key imo.

 

[pcfan123]

and with Cook and KP on song with an Anderson in conditions. It's a really well balanced team. Want to see them play India and SA