England National football team thread

[MasterBlaster76]

Imagine how high the fees for English players would be if a foreigner cap was put in.

That would decrease the quality of the PL massively. There's a reason other countries don't enforce this, and that's because the players have to get in on merit alone. If English players aren't good enough at a young age they aren't going to get game time, and that's how it should be.

R.I.P. England National team in that case.

 

[thedon5]

Something has to be done at lower levels to improve the talent coming up, it isn't just genes that cause Spain and Germany to produce gem after gem while England produces rubbish.

Putting in a cap on foreigners would decrease the quality of the league such that top tier players won't want to move there any more. Then it'll become a case of a lot of poor players in a slowly weakening league.

For example England will not benefit if there is a foreigner cap but the level of the league is on par with the Liga Portuguesa for example.

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Something has to be done at lower levels to improve the talent coming up, it isn't just genes that cause Spain and Germany to produce gem after gem while England produces rubbish.

As I said before though, what's changed so catastrophically in the coaching now compared to the coaching when the Fergie Fledglings were coming through? Scholes, Beckham and G.Neville especially would've walked into any team in the world; Beckham ended up at Real Madrid, remember.

As far as I can see, the only thing that's changed is the amount of foreigners in the game - and the quality of said foreigners. Remember, clubs are more likely to sign an average foreigner than a good English player simply by virtue of the ridiculous prices English players go for - I don't know why that is.

 

[ste_mc_efc]

As I said before though, what's changed so catastrophically in the coaching now compared to the coaching when the Fergie Fledglings were coming through? Scholes, Beckham and G.Neville especially would've walked into any team in the world; Beckham ended up at Real Madrid, remember.

As far as I can see, the only thing that's changed is the amount of foreigners in the game - and the quality of said foreigners. Remember, clubs are more likely to sign an average foreigner than a good English player simply by virtue of the ridiculous prices English players go for - I don't know why that is.

Look a bit deeper.

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Something has to be done at lower levels to improve the talent coming up, it isn't just genes that cause Spain and Germany to produce gem after gem while England produces rubbish.

Putting in a cap on foreigners would decrease the quality of the league such that top tier players won't want to move there any more. Then it'll become a case of a lot of poor players in a slowly weakening league.

For example England will not benefit if there is a foreigner cap but the level of the league is on par with the Liga Portuguesa for example.

This is correct.

The only way a cap could work out would be applied at a squad level, not in starting XI's/matchday squads.

We have the largest league in the world (in a pecuniary sense). Invest more of that into the grass roots and we'll produce more players. Lower the quality of the league and it will raise less money. With less money around it will be harder to tackle the real issues

 

[thedon5]

The cap is already applied at squad level and that is what makes the price of English players so high, Man City didn't sign Rodwell and Sinclair because they thought they'd take them up another notch on the pitch. Clubs are also encouraged to train young British players.

It quite simply is because of the training at younger ages. That's why Spain, France and Germany for example continue to produce technically gifted players year after year, whereas someone like Wilshere or Scholes is produced once in a generation.

Take a look at Fabregas, a lot of his development was in England but if it weren't for his early years honing his passing and vision at Barca, he wouldn't be the player he is today.

 

[Lee1981]

Shut up, Lee.

nice argument

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Ha don't take him on AB. While we all accept the shortcoming of English talent in most cases, we all of been on PC long enough to know Sir Lee is likely to rubbish every thing English, before he credits anything or any player - even if the player may be good enough.

Sorry but your talking crap, I'm English born an bred, more so than most of you on here, so don't doubt my patriotism, I'm just not someone who gets blinded by past glories, and after years of watching us fail in tournaments I have built up a realistic approach to enduring our embarrassing performances

We are rubbish, that is quite obvious, and our younger sides 20-21s are not exactly changing the mould here are they?

How many of the young teams are really good enough to play regularly for a top prem club or have the potential to?

I can think of Zaha only who I look at and think he could be a bit tasty, the rest are just the next line of over paid average players that will go out of tournaments early and struggle to even qualify.

And I'm actually ok with it, we are years away from being able to compete I've just learned to accept it.

Englishman

 

[thedon5]

Zaha is immensly overrated, he was so inconsistent for Crystal Palace. Since he moved to Man Utd he is now thought of like a god, like Cleverley. It's ridiculous to think he cost ?15 m. At best I'd put him in the same category as Sterling and Oxlade-Chamberlain.

 

[Lee1981]

Zaha is immensly overrated, he was so inconsistent for Crystal Palace. Since he moved to Man Utd he is now thought of like a god, like Cleverley. It's ridiculous to think he cost ?15 m. At best I'd put him in the same category as Sterling and Oxlade-Chamberlain.

I don't actually disagree that he is a tad overrated but I think he has "something"

Bit sad then if he is our next big thing that he is seen already as overrated, doesn't bode well for the rest

 

[War]

[/COLOR]

Sorry but your talking crap, I'm English born an bred, more so than most of you on here, so don't doubt my patriotism, I'm just not someone who gets blinded by past glories, and after years of watching us fail in tournaments I have built up a realistic approach to enduring our embarrassing performances

We are rubbish, that is quite obvious, and our younger sides 20-21s are not exactly changing the mould here are they?

How many of the young teams are really good enough to play regularly for a top prem club or have the potential to?

I can think of Zaha only who I look at and think he could be a bit tasty, the rest are just the next line of over paid average players that will go out of tournaments early and struggle to even qualify.

And I'm actually ok with it, we are years away from being able to compete I've just learned to accept it.

Englishman

But what gives you the impression that any of us who post in this thread about English team related matters are "blinded" by anything and doesn't acknowledge the clear short-coming's about the national team???

I've never noticed any English poster in over 100 pages in this thread do such a thing sir Lee. Most of us highlight the problems & are generally thinking of ways of how the team & the general structure of English football can improve.

But i can safely say in almost 100 pages you seem to think that their dumb patriotism going on here with your cheap shots at english players etc, as if everyone in this thread is saying England will win the 2014 world cup or something.

 

[thedon5]

I don't actually disagree that he is a tad overrated but I think he has "something"

Bit sad then if he is our next big thing that he is seen already as overrated, doesn't bode well for the rest

Even if he does have that something, he isn't going to win you a Euro or a World Cup. You look at the teenagers other teams have, like young Julian Draxler and you see the massive gulf in class still exists in the youth players coming through.

I think both Sterling and Oxlade-Chamberlain are massively overrated and unproven, but they've both proven plenty more than Zaha.

 

[War]

Zaha is immensly overrated, he was so inconsistent for Crystal Palace. Since he moved to Man Utd he is now thought of like a god, like Cleverley. It's ridiculous to think he cost ?15 m. At best I'd put him in the same category as Sterling and Oxlade-Chamberlain.

This isn't Zaha's fault to be fair to him, the same way it was Carrick, Carroll, G Johnson, Henderson's fault that big premier league clubs paid exorbitant amounts for them in very rich premier league transfer era in which supposed top english talent cost crazy amount of dollars. Because of this you can understand why Newcastle raided france for top deals last season.

This then puts those English players under unnecessary pressure from the start. To this day i'm still amazed pool paid Newcastle more for Carroll than Barca payed Valencia for David Villa.

 

[War]

Andy Carroll can be as good as Didier Drogba | The Sun |Video|Sport|Football

 

[MasterBlaster76]

Andy Carroll can be as good as Didier Drogba | The Sun |Video|Sport|Football

Really?

 

[thedon5]

No-one deserves to be compared to Drogba except for Lukaku and Benteke. Carroll? Pfft.

 

[War]

Ye ha, i reckon J Cole having played with Drogba, see's the similar physical/bullying threat that Drogba displayed against defenders in Carroll.

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The knives are out:

Richard Scudamore has hit back at critics who say the Premier League is damaging England's chances at success | Mail Online

Richard Scudamore: Premier League is not to blame for England's failures | Football | The Guardian