English Football Thread 2012/2013

[thedon5]

I actually feel that Pep himself believes this.

It's a different thing if he thinks that himself. He doesn't think of himself as a Special One or something, but I do think he does rate himself at least a bit, I mean six titles in one season is huge and he knows it.

And he didn't even make the transfers, did he? I thought that sort of thing isn't really taken care of that much by the managers in Spain, just coaching and tactics.

We can't deny he is a great tactician though, because of all the changes he's made mentioned in the previous posts. Shows how deadly a two-back formation can be.

Still feel he should go to a top club, with all the speculation surrounding Allegri, going to Milan and winning the Scudetto and CL wouldn't be a bad idea.

 

[ste_mc_efc]

Guardiola can never manage again and still be on the pantheon of football managers.

After managing for 4 seasons.

It's not like i said he's crap either.

Some people just get carried away far too easily.

 

[Dr. Pepper]

He's achieved more in 4 seasons than most managers will achieve in their entire careers.

 

[puddleduck]

How many managers get Barcelona as their first job? Especially a Barcelona with 3 of the best players in the world and a youth system and setup that has been in play for decades...

He's done a good job, no one has denied that, but he has just started his career, and continued failure elsewhere would mean he actually hasn't 'achieved' that much.

As TheDon says, Barcelona are very much run from the position of a director of football that makes sure everything stays correctly in place. Bottom line is, with a team/squad that are apparently one of the finest ever, he won just a Spanish cup this year. That's almost as bad as winning everything in the other year.

 

[shravi]

Apparently, Kenny Dalglish asked that the ?8,000,000+ compensation owed to him after his sacking be put towards new Liverpool signings. Legend. They don't call him King Kenny for nothing.

 

[puddleduck]

If he hadn't he'd have shattered his legacy more than anything that he's done as manager! Not like he struggles to make ends meet

 

[barmyarmy]

Interesting situation with Liverpool, Villa and Chelsea all looking for managers. Capello clearly wants the Chelsea job and I think he'd be successful but Abramovic wants exciting football and that's one thing Capello's teams have never been accused of being.
AVB to Liverpool would be interesting too.

 

[Bevab]

Capello's son has distanced his father from the job, but AVB's going to be interviewed!

 

[Haarithan]

Andre Villas-Boas set for Liverpool interview - ESPN Soccernet

Fingers crossed. Would dearly love him here at Anfield.

 

[Dr. Pepper]

How many managers get Barcelona as their first job? Especially a Barcelona with 3 of the best players in the world and a youth system and setup that has been in play for decades...

He's done a good job, no one has denied that, but he has just started his career, and continued failure elsewhere would mean he actually hasn't 'achieved' that much.

As TheDon says, Barcelona are very much run from the position of a director of football that makes sure everything stays correctly in place. Bottom line is, with a team/squad that are apparently one of the finest ever, he won just a Spanish cup this year. That's almost as bad as winning everything in the other year.

Iniesta and Xavi weren't 2 of the 3 best players in the world when he took over. The youth system was in place but no manager would have used it and developed it to the extent Guardiola did.

The director of football argument is nonsense. Guardiola wanted Alves, he wanted Villa, Guardiola's the one who brought through the youth players, he's the one who decided the lineups, he's the one who man-managed dressing room egos like Eto'o, Ronaldinho and Henry and got them to quietly leave without fuss and he's the one who coached the meticulous, era-defining tactics.

 

[puddleduck]

Xavi and Iniesta were already two of the best players in the world, they just hadn't quite reached their prime yet or been joined by the best player of his generation.

He still had to do the business, but let's be honest, he also won just the Spanish cup with one of the best club sides in history. Doesn't really mean he's up there with the top managers does it? He may well go onto have a stellar career elsewhere, but he was a coach in a club that very much runs from the ground up in a certain way. The process was started before Guardiola came in, and if you want to know why they are like they are, it's because of the chairman and directors who took Barca down this road.

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The tactics have been coached at youth team level up for a generation or two. Do you not read anything about La Masia and their principles?

 

[ste_mc_efc]

Iniesta and Xavi weren't 2 of the 3 best players in the world when he took over.

he didn't say they were.

 

[Dr. Pepper]

Xavi and Iniesta were already two of the best players in the world, they just hadn't quite reached their prime yet or been joined by the best player of his generation.

He still had to do the business, but let's be honest, he also won just the Spanish cup with one of the best club sides in history. Doesn't really mean he's up there with the top managers does it? He may well go onto have a stellar career elsewhere, but he was a coach in a club that very much runs from the ground up in a certain way. The process was started before Guardiola came in, and if you want to know why they are like they are, it's because of the chairman and directors who took Barca down this road.

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The tactics have been coached at youth team level up for a generation or two. Do you not read anything about La Masia and their principles?

I don't see why you're singling out the one season where Barcelona failed to utterly dominate. They still reached the Champions League semi final. After 3 seasons of playing a stupid amount of games at the highest level, fatigue was obviously going to catch up with them and they struggled to keep it going in the league. 13 trophies out of 18 is an unbelievable achievement.

The base tactics may start at La Masia but Rijkaard didn't follow them. Previous Barcelona sides played a completely different style of football to Guardiola's. Only he took Barcelona to that ultimate level.

 

[puddleduck]

That's because he also came up through that system. I'm not saying he's not done very well, but if he has no success anywhere else, it essentially taints his entire Barcelona era. Especially if they just carry on regardless.

You are making the common mistake of judging someone before their career has really begun. Like people who a year ago had Owen Coyle as most promising manager in the Prem... well a year later he's the most promising manager in the Championship.

I actually have a lot of time for your opinions on football, as tactically you do actually know what you're talking about, but we will have to agree to disagree on this one

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He's obviously a better manager than Rijkaard, what's he really done in his managerial career? He got one club relegated and fired, another he was sacked from and the other was Barcelona. Now if someone who is basically incompetent everywhere else can still have got them to where they were, and those same players have not reached their peak as the best players in football, it's not really like Pep has gone particularly far.

Excuses as well don't cut it. All the top sides play a ton of games, it's the nature of the beast.

 

[Bevab]

The Club World Cup seems to have affected Barca.