India in England Jun-Sept 2014

[SaiSrini]

That World Cup over Ashes debite made me cringe. The Ashes is the biggest rivalry in cricket if not the biggest in sport. Firstly it is in the only format that matters, ODI and T20s are great and all but they are nowhere close to Tests. The sad truth is people (Especially in Asia) arent interested in tests anymore as they are to long, thats probably why Poker didnt understand why anyone would be interested in batsmen blocking for 5 days instead of hitting "Masive SIXES out da grond" which is really annoying to me because if it carries on like this Test matches might not be around by the time I could be able to play them .

We are not talking about rivalries. We are talking about "what is the biggest pinnacle of cricket right now". And IMHO, Ashes cannot be the biggest pinnacle purely for the fact that only two teams can compete for it. The World Cup gives an opportunity for most teams in the world to compete for it (and provides opportunities for other teams to qualify for the competition).

 

[Skater]

We are not talking about rivalries. We are talking about "what is the biggest pinnacle of cricket right now". And IMHO, Ashes cannot be the biggest pinnacle purely for the fact that only two teams can compete for it. The World Cup gives an opportunity for most teams in the world to compete for it (and provides opportunities for other teams to qualify for the competition).

I haven't been saying the Ashes are the biggest thing in cricket as a whole. Sure, if you're from India, New Zealand, West Indies or whatever, the World Cup will be the pinnacle. What I've been trying to say is that no matter how many World Cups are won, no matter how many times one side beats the other, the Ashes will always - always - be the biggest thing in cricket to an Englishman or an Australian.

To say the Ashes are just 'another Test series' is ridiculously ignorant.

 

[grkrama]

What I've been trying to say is that no matter how many World Cups are won,

looks at the trophy cabinet....

 

[grkrama]

To say the Ashes are just 'another Test series' is ridiculously ignorant.

It is to others, apart from 2005 and 2009 ashes most of the time its a heavily one sided bilateral test series for the past few decades to other nations and there is nothing ignorant about it.

I can appreciate its history and tradition but thats that other than that its just ENG and AUS playing yet another test series against each other to outsiders and by no means will the 8 and half nation accept it as pinnacle of cricket.

 

[Skater]

It is to others, apart from 2005 and 2009 ashes most of the time its a heavily one sided bilateral test series for the past few decades to other nations and there is nothing ignorant about it.

I can appreciate its history and tradition but thats that other than that its just ENG and AUS playing yet another test series against each other to outsiders and by no means will the 8 and half nation accept it as pinnacle of cricket.

Again, I'm not trying to make the other nations consider the Ashes as the pinnacle of cricket. I'm trying to tell you that it is and will always be the pinnacle for an Englishman and an Australian.

If we won the World Cup in the winter, I would most likely have forgotten about it by the time the first ball is bowled in Cardiff.

 

[grkrama]

Again, I'm not trying to make the other nations consider the Ashes as the pinnacle of cricket. I'm trying to tell you that it is and will always be the pinnacle for an Englishman and an Australian.
If we won the World Cup in the winter, I would most likely have forgotten about it by the time the first ball is bowled in Cardiff.

re-quoting myself

I think its useless to talk about it unless England win a world cup.People can only relate to things they have achieved or felt, other wise they would be making a hypothesis of what they may feel by relating it to the nearest thing they have felt.

If you guys till felt that way after winning the WC, i would still tell its a shame for a cricket rich nation to be living in a shell.

I'm trying to tell you that it is and will always be the pinnacle for an Englishman and an Australian.

Im not sure how ausies feel about this though.

Also a related article that sheds better light on this, it was written before wc11
Andrew Hughes: Why the World Cup is bigger than the Ashes | Page 2 | ESPN Cricinfo

it's a true test, this Test cricket, they say. But a test of what? Of endurance, certainly, and patience. But one-day cricket tests nerve, ingenuity, and occasionally, mental arithmetic. The soul of cricket is a bat, a ball and a field. Beyond this there are many variations and five-day isn't the only fruit in the cricket orchard. It isn't even the oldest variety. In 18th century London and 19th century Lancashire, the game that packed 'em in was done in a long afternoon. One-day cricket came first.

And why, in any case, must we accept that Australia versus England perches at the top of the Test ecosystem? The history? These two first tangled in 1877, which is about 133 years worth of history. But then England played South Africa in 1889. So by that reckoning the Anglo-South African rivalry is only 9% less historic. Besides, it isn't as though the Ashes regularly rocks our socks. Familiarity often breeds tedium, either one-sided tedium (1989-2002) or scrappy, evenly matched tedium (2009).

 

[Markkkkk]

re-quoting myself


If you guys till felt that way after winning the WC, i would still tell its a shame for a cricket rich nation to be living in a shell.

You haven't experienced white washing the equivalent to your ashes side after playing over 100 years against each other. I can understand what you're saying but every young English boy wants to win the Ashes but not every Indian boy dreams of beating Pakistan and I'm sure Englishmen will take the Ashes over the World Cup any day.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

Again, I'm not trying to make the other nations consider the Ashes as the pinnacle of cricket. I'm trying to tell you that it is and will always be the pinnacle for an Englishman and an Australian.

If we won the World Cup in the winter, I would most likely have forgotten about it by the time the first ball is bowled in Cardiff.

As I said earlier, I do understand how to an English man, the Ashes is most important. Engish cricketers have been growing up wanting to win the Ashes for a 100 years and before there even was a world cup. I get that part.

What I am disputing is the 'dont care' for the world cup argument. Even if the Ashes is the most important thing for an English cricketer to win, the even so surely the World Cup would come second.

Like to us the World Cup is the most important tournament, but the CT then is the second most important tourament (actually its not that simple, but that is a debate for another day). We don't exactly then say we don't care for winning the CT. Sure we would rather win the WC than CT, but its not like the CT is unimportant or something we don;t care about, or forget that we won it. Its something that we cherish a great deal.

Similarly I get that the Ashes is what an English fan would win most, but after that surely its the World Cup. Which doesn't exactly put the world cup in the 'dont care' category, even for English fans. That is what I am disputing. Even if you cherish winning the Ashes, you would not in a few months forget that you won the world cup (if you did). It will be something you will remember for decades.

I am not disputing Ashes being the most important to Eng fans, but I definitely don't buy the argument that the world is something that Eng fans don't care about, and if Eng were to win the world cup it would be forgotten in a few months time.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

You haven't experienced white washing the equivalent to your ashes side after playing over 100 years against each other. I can understand what you're saying but every young English boy wants to win the Ashes but not every Indian boy dreams of beating Pakistan and I'm sure Englishmen will take the Ashes over the World Cup any day.

Hello ... what?

Its safe to say that every Indian boy when he pictures himself winning the world cup, 7 out of 10 times he is beating Pakistan in the final Combining the two things every young Indian Cricketer wants to do.

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

Anyway today is the most meaningless of meaningless cricket matches as India take on England in a T20 match. Exactly how does T20 fit in the scheme of things of this tour can someone explain.

What is even the damn point of playing a T20 on a bilateral tour. I mean I know its in fashion these days, and I do expect some good crowds, as Eng fans love tests and T20s and for some reason not ODIs, but the thought of an Int'l T20 match is just revolting.

T20 is not serious enough cricket to be played at an Int'l level. Its just a good enough for a club level knock about tournament like the IPL or Big Bash ... where you can give the crowd some cheap entertainment, hit a few sixes, have a good time, watch some cheerleaders, and go back.

Int'l T20 on a bilateral tour ... !! How does this fit into the scheme of this tour. Suppose India were to win then would they say Eng won the test but we won the ODIs and T20s so its 2-1 India?!! Is this supposed to be a decider in the eyes of ICC? Its not to the fans for sure. Eng won the tests and on a bilateral tour thats all that matters. ODIs is a very small consolation. But short of that who won the T20s and T10s and T5s, how does it matter?

I mean what is even the damn point of this match. Int'l T20s have to go. They don't have a place.

 

[IceAgeComing]

After we lost the test series, this is what Vaughan tweeted

View attachment 130188

And that picture was a reply to him.

I think the middle signature is of Raina.

...so what we can gather here is that the Indian cricket players don't understand jokes?

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

Ian Chappell: India, Australia and South Africa favourites to win World Cup 2015 - Cricbuzz

Ian Chappel digs into Eng in this article.

Stressing that England's World Cup preparations are in disarray, Chappell said they seem unsure of their strongest line-up and stubbornly adhering to an outdated approach to ODI batting. "Against India, the style they produced seemed to revolve around avoiding eating a late dinner."

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

How is a guy whose surname is Roy not playing Ranji Trophy for Bengal :P

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

Is that England shirt Red or Orange?

Also why do England change their outfit from Blue to Red? Any specific reason.

Does anyone remember India every playing in colored clothes besides blue? If Ind had to go for alternate colors, what would you prefer it to be?

 

[TooDrunkToBeBowled]

The more I see of Mohit, the more I like him. He seems to be a very intelligent bowler.