Pakistan in India

[SaiSrini]

i think Kumble is easily the second best leggie now and perhaps of all time...not in terms of wickets but in terms of winning matches for his team... i think we Indians(me included) always tend to underplay the greatness of the man... Jumbo should be reverred really as well as Dravid and Sachin... i loved the fire in his eyes yesterday... it really seems that this man is capable of playing for India for 3-4 years more... test cricket at least...

the only man who could have saved the match yesterday for Pakistan was their captain and he couldn't fire...for the rest it was only a matter of time...

Totally agree with you. Sometimes when he doesnt pick wickets, we tend to get critical about him. But he always proves us wrong. Hats off to this warrior for Indian cricket!! I am sure he can continue for 3 - 4 more years. India would be highly benefitted by his bowling!

 

[ravigoteti]

indeed, he is a warrior. just so relentless, un-erring accuracy and dedication. the greatest bowler india has ever produced, and definitely one of the greats to play the game. The reason is, he doesn't turn the ball like warne or murali, which is one main reason why his performance is above average overseas. But Australian tour is a lesson for his critics. Its hard to see a player with that sort of commitment these days. he bowls long spells with ease.

 

[sachin]

well done kumble!

 

[rahulk666]

indeed, he is a warrior. just so relentless, un-erring accuracy and dedication. the greatest bowler india has ever produced, and definitely one of the greats to play the game. The reason is, he doesn't turn the ball like warne or murali, which is one main reason why his performance is above average overseas. But Australian tour is a lesson for his critics. Its hard to see a player with that sort of commitment these days. he bowls long spells with ease.

When batsmen start playing defensively to Kumble then they are infact playing into the hands of Kumble. Pak batsmen just did that and saw their wicket fall. However after losing 3 wkts for 10 in first hour Pak had no choice but defend, defend and draw the match.

 

[ravigoteti]

true but he doesn't care very much though, whether the batsmen are attacking or not. He doesn't panick, whether he gets wickets or not, he is calm and collective and extremely hardworking.

 

[sohum]

Pakistan have, on this tour, shown, as in the past, that their country does not lack any talent. They have exceeded any expectations set before the series began, when everyone expected a 3-0 whitewash. This Pakistan team has shown that when all of them play together, they are talented enough to win sessions. Now the point is to build on this talent and make it consistent--again a problem of the past. If they can string together a few sessions, they will cause trouble in test cricket.

It is up to the management now to keep faith in their current stock and ensure that they have a long enough run to prove themselves. The talent is there and the consistency will only develop when they have time to adjust to the conditions of international cricket. As for the guys who have been around for a while, their consistency will develop as they will be playing for a more 'complete' team. If only Pakistan could change the attitude of Shoaib Akhtar, they would have a team that could beat the world.

As for the third test--Bangalore is one of the easier venues to play at because of the great year-round weather there. The Aussies even claimed that it wasn't that much of a break from their normal weather (especially since the pitches were green). I think India will be looking to go all out for a victory whereas Pakistan will hope that Rana Naved-ul-Hasan is ready to come back into the team, in place of Khalil. The pitch is probably expected to be a green one, so I do not see them taking Arshad Khan into the team in place of a pacer.

If Naved-ul-Hasan can get his line and length accurate and get some swing, it could be a close affair. However, the Indians have shown (in this series, at least) that a great deal does not depend on their opening partnership. In the last season this was the change--the pressure moved from Sachin Tendulkar to the openers. And that is why we had so much trouble finding a good opening pair. In this test match, India have shown that even if their openers fail (23/2), the team is able to recover significantly.

I predict a 3-3, 4-2 or 5-1 result in the ODI series, in Pakistan's favour. I certainly hope the last is not the case, but I think Pakistan manages to take their chances in the ODIs successfully. If they open with Afridi and have Razzaq coming down the order, they are set. In ODIs the focus shifts from the bowlers to the batsmen so Pakistan's current crop of batsmen should be able to chase down pretty high totals.

 

[Ajit]

Yes Kumble is the man for India. I never considered him to be an exceptional spinner, but I guess he has proved me wrong yet again. If only he could be effective overseas, one could compare him with Warne and Murali.

i think Kumble is easily the second best leggie now and perhaps of all time...

1. 17 wickets in Australia, is that not being effective overseas?
2. 76 wickets(highest) last year and 4th rank in test cricket(compare this to Warne's 8th).
3. Higher wickets/test than Warne.
4. When he gets the ball, the opposition has hardly lost too many wickets. For Aussies, McGrath,Dizzy,etc. take almost all major wickets, and leave it to Warne to dismiss tailenders.
5. Jumbo has been successful against Aussies, but what about Warne's success against India?

Despite of all this, I consider Warne as a better bowler than Kumble when I consider their entire careers, but considering their current performances, Kumble is currently better than Warne.

btw,
India's total = 407 in both innings
Sachin's score = 52 in both innings
Sourav's score = 12 in both innings
Dravid had hundreds in both innings

Pakistan failed to neutralize India's I innings total by 14 runs and they needed 14*14 runs to win before they got all out.

Taufiq Umar has been dismissed four times so far, every time by Balaji.

 

[bharat]

Good performance by India.
But we can expect Pakistan to bounce back in the next game at Banglore.

And about Bucknor,this pic would explain it

 

[squiz]

Comparing Kumble to Warne? pfft

Warne only getting tail enders out? pfft

Warne's average record against the best spin playing country in the world, and Kumble's (wouldnt say stunning) record against Australia, one of the poorer teams of playing spin.....

Point 4, contradicts Point 3
You say McGrath,Dizzy,etc take all the wickets leaving Warne only the tail enders
But also compare the wickets/tests between the two players, hmm....

 

[m_vaughan]

Comparing Kumble to Warne? pfft

Warne only getting tail enders out? pfft

Warne's average record against the best spin playing country in the world, and Kumble's (wouldnt say stunning) record against Australia, one of the poorer teams of playing spin.....

Point 4, contradicts Point 3
You say McGrath,Dizzy,etc take all the wickets leaving Warne only the tail enders
But also compare the wickets/tests between the two players, hmm....

Yup for once I agree with my aussie mate!

17 wickets in Australia, is that not being effective overseas?

By overseas, I do not mean Australia alone. You need to look at his performances in all countries outside the subcontinent.(more in terms of match winning performances rather than mere stats and numbers)

76 wickets(highest) last year and 4th rank in test cricket(compare this to Warne's 8th).

That no doubt is a great achievement, but he has played so many tests on home soil and on spinner friendly wickets (Tests v New Zealand, Australia, South Africa and now Pakistan were all played in India). While Warne has had to pick up wickets on fast pitches in Australia.

 

[sachinisgod]

after a long debate on another thread - i must say that i strongly support Ajit's opinion here...at present Kumble's bowling better than Warne and u may say this that and everything but fact remains a fact...

well fortunately for Warne he gets an opportunity to play against the English batsmen every two years...and the whole world knows how they play spin well this might look like a joke to many but the fact is that he's taken 132 wickets against them...that's just slightly lesser than 25% of his total...

am not underplaying the wizard's achievement but the fact is that Jumbo has snared more batsmen lately than Warnie has...i haven't checked Warne's records but there's no other modern bowler who has consistently picked up the best batsman in the opposition - he's taken Inzy 7 times in 7 matches... that's a record in its own right... also ppl start cribbing abt Jumbo's record outside India...well ppl who saw those 24 wickets coming in 3 tests in Australia won't ever forget them and it just looks as if much more are coming his way...

Hail Jumbo!!!

 

[sohum]

This debate seems very familiar, I think it has been had before. Anyhow, Kumble and Warne are great bowlers. Apart from the Asian teams no one really plays spin well. And secondly, Kumble doesn't really spin the ball and he performs better on variable bounc pitches because then he gets the variation that causes the edges and the low balls. My two cents.

 

[ZoraxDoom]

Actually I believe If Warne played for Indian and Kumble for Austrailia they each would have twice as many wickets as they have now. Mainly because the pitches they play on are completely opposite from their bowling styles. Maybe this is what makes them succesful, but I think not.....

 

[Pak_cricketer]

if you look at the Pak averages and ind averages you will see that India has a 5 times better team than Pakistan. example Dravid has a averge of 57. Pakistans higest average is only 47 from Yohana. but the way they come on to play its surprising.

you should have seen peoples faces when Afirdi was on strike and smashing bounderies.

 

[ravigoteti]

lol
indeed true, afridi is a devastating batsman. But definitely not in the league of gilchrist and sehwag. These three players have same attitude, to smash the ball but i just can't stop admiring the aussie, he's probably the most dangerous bastman in the world now. First it was Si Viv richards, then came Sachin and now gilchrist and sehwag may join their company soon.

Just another thing, its unfair to compare warne and kumble. Warne, no doubt is among the top 5 bowlers in the world. Kumble is definitely in the top 10, not just b/c of wickets but for other things too. His last few years have been statistically great. They are different bowlers though, with different style and so we can't compare them. You can compare murali and warne b/c they spin the ball, are almost the same. One is a off-spinner, the other one a leggie.