Pakistan's Tour of New Zealand - 2020/21

[CerealKiller]

 

[wasteyouryouth]

Jamieson seemingly in beast mode.

 

[Master Khan]

Yeah Misbah needs to go, haven't been impress with him since taking over and this series prove it.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Pakistan again catching the bull by the tail. Blaming the coach for the on field stuff. I will never get this fascination for high profile coaches and blaming them for things they can't actually control.

 

[Master Khan]

Pakistan again catching the bull by the tail. Blaming the coach for the on field stuff. I will never get this fascination for high profile coaches and blaming them for things they can't actually control.

Well it is their fault, they are suppose to teach how to play, As much as i respect other people's opinions but if they continue like this then Misbah will destroy this team, Waqar Younis will destroy our bowlers and pretty soon Shan Masood will be our captain in the future.
Pakistani fans were laughing at India because they scored 36 but their team is the one that is a joke.
They can beat the small teams but when it cames to the big teams they are just rubbish.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Well it is their fault, they are suppose to teach how to play, As much as i respect other people's opinions but if they continue like this then Misbah will destroy this team, Waqar Younis will destroy our bowlers and pretty soon Shan Masood will be our captain in the future.
Pakistani fans were laughing at India because they scored 36 but their team is the one that is a joke.
They can beat the small teams but when it cames to the big teams they are just rubbish.

You think a coach is supposed to teach players at this level? I don't think so. They are supposed to man manage, develop culture, organise practice sessions as per the liking of each individual and ensure a healthy yet competitive environment within the squad. You need to understand each player differently, perhaps even personally.

I think if you are looking for a coach to teach your players at this level then the team is not a national team. Coaching and teaching happens at a much lower level. There is reason I wanted Moody to become our national coach and not Shastri or even Kumble.

 

[Bevab]

New Zealand are expertly set up for pretty much any conditions really. Give it a year or so and they'll probably be looking at a player pool something like this:

Tom Latham
Devon Conway
Kane Williamson
Ross Taylor
Henry Nicholls
BJ Watling
Mitchell Santner
Trent Boult
Tim Southee
Neil Wagner
Kyle Jamieson

Tom Blundell
Colin de Grandhomme
Daryl Mitchell
Jimmy Neesham
Dean Foxcroft

For starters, that's arguably the best four-man pace battery this century. I'd be tempted to play them all even if you were in some very spin-friendly conditions. As for Blundell, I like him but I just can't help thinking Conway is twice the player and would be up for opening

Santner as the primary spinner is extremely weak in all honesty. Bloke still does not have a five wicket haul in first-class cricket and NZ have this obsession with turning him into a Vettori when he is not. Having Southee who is a beast in Asian conditions and the skillset of Wagner and Boult to support him does help but until they get a good spinner, I will still find their bowling attack slightly one-dimensional.

The best primary spinner I can see them having is a 36 year old former Aussie offie at the moment. Unless they give up on their policy of conservative selections and put faith in Rachin Ravindra, an outstanding prospect who could turn out to be the best spin all-rounder in the next decade if things work out.

 

[CerealKiller]

Finally an article on this. Laid out everything that was on my mind regarding Abbas, brilliantly explained with relevant data.
https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/nz-vs-pak-lovely-spells-but-not-many-wickets-with-mohammad-abbas-it-s-a-worrying-pattern-1246635

 

[Yash.]

The best primary spinner I can see them having is a 36 year old former Aussie offie at the moment.

And Ajaz Patel...

 

[LiveLoveABD]

Finally an article on this. Laid out everything that was on my mind regarding Abbas, brilliantly explained with relevant data.
NZ vs Pak - Lovely spells but not many wickets - with Mohammad Abbas, it's a worrying pattern

I could have told you so. It is an issue with us Asian players where "the good length" varies country to country. We all have a natural length.

I genuinely think PAK have not played bad this tour. They are missing a couple of batters and a legit third seamer and proper spinner. I would be more interested in knowing the lack of evolution in Yasir Shah.

EDIT- Let's hope PAK don't mess up the white ball bowling. Shaheen, Wahab and Amir should be first choice. Hasan Ali has to figure in the squad. (don't know where his fitness is at) I would like to see Naseem bowl in limited overs. Hope they're consistent with Imad, Shadab.

 

[CerealKiller]

I would be more interested in knowing the lack of evolution in Yasir Shah.

He debuted at 29, having played years on substandard pitches, on which he didn’t really have to develop variety (read below post for details). Playing in the UAE, he didn’t really need to develop, he was that good at bowling the legbreak with enough variation. Mickey and Sarfraz playing him as the only spinner at home as well as away put a lot of burden on him, and his fitness is far from perfect, so that could’ve been a factor.

The reason for our fast bowlers not being good is that our domestic circuit is not good enough. Ramiz Raja under Tauqeer Zia with unlimited powers (which come with dictatorship) changed the nature of pitches of domestic cricket.

When the wickets were flattish in the 70s, 80s and 90s we produced bowlers who can run through teams with reverse swing or extreme pace or spinners who had 3 types of googlies or doosras. Why did this happen? Because they couldn't get wickets with just bowling seam ups. They had to find different ways.

When wickets are green we have produced medium pacers who try to hit a length and the ball/pitch does the rest for them. When in international cricket this doesn't happen they struggle. From Wasim and Waqar we are down to Ehsan Adil and Imran Khan.

Similarly for batsmen, we had stroke players in plenty. Now we can have batsmen who look to survive long periods, play few shots, and wait for ball to get old, pitch to dry, spinners to come on. Azhar Ali, Sami Aslam, Imam ul Haq, Fawad Alam, to a degree Asad Shafiq.

If Pakistan wants to play Test cricket like the 90s we have to go back (to a certain degree) to the system that produced such unique talent.

 

[AsadRM]

I think if you are looking for a coach to teach your players at this level then the team is not a national team. Coaching and teaching happens at a much lower level.

This!

If someone like Haris Sohail with plenty of technical flaws (that a basic Cricket fan like me can figure out) is playing for Pakistan then there is something seriously wrong with the system. The national side is where perfectly-polished players are brought on, who should've spent years with coaches in domestic fixing their techniques. What's the use of these High-performance centers, National Academies, domestic coaches, etc. when Khushdil Shah has to get into Pakistan international set-up to learn a square drive? It isn't Younis Khan's duty to teach Abdullah Shafique to play with a straight bat when the ball is bouncing. It isn't Younis Khan's duty to tell Haider Ali to not play with his common sense missing.

Say whatever you want to about Hasnain, but the man went back to National Cricket Academy, worked on his fitness, and lost 5-7 kgs, fixed his runup and seam position. Just look at him bowling in the 2019 Eng series and Pak vs Zim 2020 and in only one and a half years you'll see massive improvements.

I fully support inducting young blood, but there is no justification for their poor entitled mentality e.g. Fakhar Zaman who thinks that he has 'nothing wrong with his technique'. You'll have Kohli and Babar saying how they aren't perfect and are constantly working on their techniques, but Mr. One Hundred against India thinks he has everything figured out.

 

[LiveLoveABD]

This!

If someone like Haris Sohail with plenty of technical flaws (that a basic Cricket fan like me can figure out) is playing for Pakistan then there is something seriously wrong with the system. The national side is where perfectly-polished players are brought on, who should've spent years with coaches in domestic fixing their techniques. What's the use of these High-performance centers, National Academies, domestic coaches, etc. when Khushdil Shah has to get into Pakistan international set-up to learn a square drive? It isn't Younis Khan's duty to teach Abdullah Shafique to play with a straight bat when the ball is bouncing. It isn't Younis Khan's duty to tell Haider Ali to not play with his common sense missing.

Say whatever you want to about Hasnain, but the man went back to National Cricket Academy, worked on his fitness, and lost 5-7 kgs, fixed his runup and seam position. Just look at him bowling in the 2019 Eng series and Pak vs Zim 2020 and in only one and a half years you'll see massive improvements.

I fully support inducting young blood, but there is no justification for their poor entitled mentality e.g. Fakhar Zaman who thinks that he has 'nothing wrong with his technique'. You'll have Kohli and Babar saying how they aren't perfect and are constantly working on their techniques, but Mr. One Hundred against India thinks he has everything figured out.

If I had to tell you in one line what is the major issue in Pakistan compared to say an India, since we are neighbours-

When we lose, we blame Kohli. When you lose, you blame Misbah.

If you catch the bull by the tail continuously, these results are normal.

Pakistan has to become more professional if they want to get consistent. Will they win big tournaments? Yes. Because there is so much talent that they can just play on that and flair and have an outstanding month or two. But till the time you get pro, you will not be consistent.

Misbah is the right coach because he will not make it about himself. But, you need to leave him alone and all the other guys with him need to be removed. Too many cooks in the kitchen mate. Just have a basic support staff.

I would snatch your arm off if you guys wanted to swap coaches and I assure you most India fans would (those with sense) and it has nothing to do with who Misbah or Shastri were as cricketers.