ICC Cricket World Cup - May/July 2019

[aditya123]

I share your pain but I'm very disappointed with your assessment. I am going to try bang heads with you and try and be reasonable.

Captaincy, as I found out in something as small as league cricket, is all about balance. I suffered a lot because of being over attacking to the point I almost lost the team I spent two years building. But, it taught me a lot. It made me understand the value of balance. My fellow team mates trusted in me and actually backed me for the job. In return, I became a bit more open to being I won't say defensive, but not attacking unnecessarily. But, I refused to budge on my convictions and I never budged on changing my team. Why am I on about this? I see conviction on certain matters with Kohli. He has definitely shaped up Pandya and Rahul along with making Bumrah a world beater. But, some of his choices in crunch games is just mind numbing. The way they treated Rayudu was just absolute rubbish. DK in my opinion, won us the most improbable game in a final and then he just went off the radar in terms of playing consistently and then suddenly returned to the squad when we were guessing it would be Pant or Rayudu?

We had the squad to win in SA, then in ENG and now the WC. We just won in Oz and we all know that, that was Australia's worst time in cricket in centuries. Sharma has got to be made captain. Got to be.

As for today? You played the extra batsman in DK today. We have played the extra batsman right through this WC. How many games has that 'extra' batsman made a match winning contribution. The death bowling is a huge factor in LOI and BK bowled superbly up top. Bumrah got the wicket, but it could easily have been BK. The missed step was not playing Shami. 3 left handers in this line up, Kuldeep has run through NZ this year and he was kept out for Chahal. The extra bowler gives you 10 overs every single game. This conversation would have been entirely different if Pandya's groin would have completely given up after his 4th over. I bet, people here would still want Kedar in and not a proper bowler. The middle order has been a point of contention because 3 people have not played 30-40 games in one position consistently. The name does not matter and today like it has on the odd occasion the top order has failed, the hole was exposed. The worst part is that our template of being conservative at the top and then slowly accelerating even more accentuates the 5 bowlers plus Pandya strategy. The 18 runs today that we were short by could easily have been compensated with the extra bowler, specially if that bowler was Shami. By opting for DK over Shami, you are choosing an in form match winner to sit on the bench for someone just to somehow give you 30 runs.

As for Dhoni, again the management messed up by not enforcing upon him to occupy No.4. He is not the bi

As for Dhoni in chases? I don't know how many blokes could have carried a chase from 92-6 to within 18 runs of a Final berth. If this job is so easy, why don't the likes of Williamson, Kohli, Root or Smith ever try to do this job in a bilateral? Let alone a WC knockout? The critique of Dhoni is a joke. We didn't lose anything because of him, we might have won another World Cup if he was inches faster. He's not the legend we deserve, just the one we needed. And, just like some legends are treated across the border, a lot of crap is being levied at him and I find it utterly shameless.

I don`t see where we differ though. I`m saying mostly the same things. I want us to risk more, rest the top order in live games. We kept playing the same top 3 in most matches in bilaterals. How many games have Starc and Cummins and Hazelwood played between 2015 and 2018. Its the last year that you start playing with the full side more often. Dhoni himself took these calls as a captain. We lost quite a few bilateral series in that 2007-2011 phase. Players also had the experience of winning games like the tri-series final against a bloody good Aussie side in 2008. All that counts. The current middle order hasn't even had the experience of 10 uncomfortable chases in general. We almost seem shell-shocked the moment the game situation becomes tight. We forget how many chases the likes of Raina/Yuvraj pulled off before they became good enough to do it at the stage that matters. We did not allow this current middle order to get that experience. We dropped Pant for NZ and AUS ODIs. The guy got 3 games in India, got booed by the crowd and walks straight into the WC as a No.4! If that is not a momentous lack of vision what is. When Shikhar was injured and Rahul was doing okay at No.4, could we have sent Rahane as an opener? Its too late, but we must stop playing a first XI in all live bilateral games. Very often, the only time the bench gets tested is when the series is won already. The match situations are`nt the same. The opposition often does`nt field its own full side. That is all that bilateral ODI series have to offer these days, I`m afraid.

As for MSD, the team management should`ve put their foot down and made him bat at No.4. He is`nt your big-hitting finisher anymore and the game went close only because Jadeja played that blinder. Dhoni, as I have maintained has value in smallish run-chases while stalling a collapse. If the management is not smart enough to get that they must step down. Pant and Pandya are batting a slot too high. If Dhoni walks in at 5/2 instead of 70/5, he gets those many overs extra to bat, dot balls hurt less and the early threat can be worn off. As for Shami, I do not understand what it would take for them to realize his value, especially with sides playing Bumrah out and Bhuvi no longer being the new ball threat.

 

[Rehan_24]

One semi final loss and you guys are going to change captain ? Virat as captain brings the right aggression to the side however I agree he is not the best captain among all but give him more time and eventually he would be there moreover the problem was with lack of substance middle order lineup rather than captaincy. MSD as a batsman literally have a failed WC campaign however you cant just left him out in this WC, he was needed for his cricket brain.

I personally feel you guys and indian team management considers Pandya a genuine allrounder however I dont think so, he is a bowler who can bat a bit. Banking on him with dhoni ? Not enough

I said before after england game that the way england played out India I am not seeing a slight chance of them winning the World Cup because of their massive reliance on top order particularly sharma and virat

Today loss to NZ is defintiely a huge blow because it was very unexpected but this is the beauty of cricket. There are never clear winners.

 

[hammadahmed88]

One semi final loss and you guys are going to change captain ? Virat as captain brings the right aggression to the side however I agree he is not the best captain among all but give him more time and eventually he would be there moreover the problem was with lack of substance middle order lineup rather than captaincy. MSD as a batsman literally have a failed WC campaign however you cant just left him out in this WC, he was needed for his cricket brain.

I personally feel you guys and indian team management considers Pandya a genuine allrounder however I dont think so, he is a bowler who can bat a bit. Banking on him with dhoni ? Not enough

I said before after england game that the way england played out India I am not seeing a slight chance of them winning the World Cup because of their massive reliance on top order particularly sharma and virat

Today loss to NZ is defintiely a huge blow because it was very unexpected but this is the beauty of cricket. There are never clear winners.

I agree with this. Although I do like Rohit's ability to lead, going knee-jerk and taking out your best player as captain after a pretty fine tournament would send a horrible message. I am a massive fan of Kohli so this may be biased, but I don't think there is anything particularly wrong with him as captain. It was always going to be difficult following someone like MS. I think he's fine as captain. You can't really blame the captain for middle order failures and a team being 6 for 92. Generally with his field placements etc, he's pretty good. He also inspires massive confidence in players with the way he plays. I think pairing him with a cool mind like Dravid or someone like that would go a long way. I thought Kumble was perfect for this. They should have really tried to make him work with Kumble rather than folding so quickly to his demand of bringing Shastri in. Is VVS interested in coaching at all? He, I feel, would compliment Kohli perfectly. Any player that's been Kohli's senior, and someone with whom he's played would be good as well.

 

[Punk_Sk8r]

Umm am I the only one who thinks the conditions won't play as big a part as people here are speculating?

NZ dont have enough runs and India will most likely smash them pretty easily regardless of conditions. Like the ball will have to be swinging/seaming/turning as much as a cricket ball possibly can for there to be a chance...

I'll eat my words I guess

 

[SaiSrini]

One semi final loss and you guys are going to change captain ? Virat as captain brings the right aggression to the side however I agree he is not the best captain among all but give him more time and eventually he would be there moreover the problem was with lack of substance middle order lineup rather than captaincy. MSD as a batsman literally have a failed WC campaign however you cant just left him out in this WC, he was needed for his cricket brain.

If you see who are the ones advocating for the change of captaincy from Virat to Rohit, you would notice that these people have been advocating for this for a very long time now. This semifinal loss in the WC has not brought about this opinion. It is something that has existed in certain Indian fans in this forum for quite sometime.

To me, Rohit is a better leader who brings about the balance between aggression and caution. He is aggressive too (though as raw at it as Virat) and more importantly, he believes in stability and developing a sense of security among players who are very skilled and need the stable space to express themselves. Virat in his captaincy time, has never done that and we can see it with the 'at times constant' and weird squad/team selections. When Rohit got captaincy chances in international level, he has done well. And to my painful memory, he is the holder of 4 IPL titles and has led a star studded franchise side like MI with all sorts of riches and a place where you can easily be swayed by the indulgence and mess things up easily.

 

[Alexei.]

For when the One Great Scorer comes To write against your name, He marks-not that you won or lost- But how you played the game.

For all those One-Man army efforts this worldcup, Shakib, Neesham, Jadeja etc.

 

[kushagra29]

So, What are your predictions today? AUS or ENG??

 

[NILAYSHAH60]

So, What are your predictions today? AUS or ENG??

England on form, Australia on history.

 

[Bevab]

So, What are your predictions today? AUS or ENG??

If England bat first, they’ll win unless the Dorff or Starc completely rip through their lineup causing one of their infamous collapses. Don’t see this happening because Roy seems to be a lot more stable and patient with his style of play now.

Hoping that Aussies bat first so that we get to see a more evenly poised game. They’ve relied heavily on their top 3 (largely just the openers tbh) just like India but the difference has been the unexpected form of Carey which has masked the middle order issues. Smith at 3 and Handscomb at 4 should help a lot in relieving the pressure on the openers although it is quite a big ask for Handscomb to come in and perform right away.

The ten overs from Lyon will be the key today IMO. He will be crucial if the pitch deteriorates like in yesterday’s game and England have also got over their spin issues as the tournament has progressed. Should be a fascinating battle. If England can score 60-70 runs from his overs as a minimum, they have got a very good platform to go for the kill during the death overs phase.

 

[cricmonk]

If Australia wins the toss and bat first, most likely to put pressure on England and Aussies knows how to put pressure in such situations. It would be more interesting to watch 2nd semi final.

 

[kushagra29]

If England bat first, they’ll win unless the Dorff or Starc completely rip through their lineup causing one of their infamous collapses. Don’t see this happening because Roy seems to be a lot more stable and patient with his style of play now.

Hoping that Aussies bat first so that we get to see a more evenly poised game. They’ve relied heavily on their top 3 (largely just the openers tbh) just like India but the difference has been the unexpected form of Carey which has masked the middle order issues. Smith at 3 and Handscomb at 4 should help a lot in relieving the pressure on the openers although it is quite a big ask for Handscomb to come in and perform right away.

The ten overs from Lyon will be the key today IMO. He will be crucial if the pitch deteriorates like in yesterday’s game and England have also got over their spin issues as the tournament has progressed. Should be a fascinating battle. If England can score 60-70 runs from his overs as a minimum, they have got a very good platform to go for the kill during the death overs phase.

Pitch is definitely going to play a big role here. Out of the 4 matches played here, 2 won by batting 1st & 2 by batting 2nd. So, I feel it doesn't matter whether u bat 1st or 2nd. Home factor is definitely going to advantage ENG but what can u say abt AUS, they came from no where in this tournament. Inclusion of 2 players has changed their mindset completely and the both are performing incredibly well. For me AUS are favorites as they have the experience of so many semi-finals & finals and knows how to tackle pressure.
Let's not forget all this analysis will come into play when the rain god show some mercy. As per the weather report, rain is expected today

 

[LiveLoveABD]

If you see who are the ones advocating for the change of captaincy from Virat to Rohit, you would notice that these people have been advocating for this for a very long time now. This semifinal loss in the WC has not brought about this opinion. It is something that has existed in certain Indian fans in this forum for quite sometime.

To me, Rohit is a better leader who brings about the balance between aggression and caution. He is aggressive too (though as raw at it as Virat) and more importantly, he believes in stability and developing a sense of security among players who are very skilled and need the stable space to express themselves. Virat in his captaincy time, has never done that and we can see it with the 'at times constant' and weird squad/team selections. When Rohit got captaincy chances in international level, he has done well. And to my painful memory, he is the holder of 4 IPL titles and has led a star studded franchise side like MI with all sorts of riches and a place where you can easily be swayed by the indulgence and mess things up easily.

It is not just the limited overs format. You also need to review the test format since this is the time we tend to reset the system. We have created enough chaos in that domain and Rahane's stature as a player is proof of this. It is time to give that responsibility to Che. What this will also do is give Kohli relief and extend his career. Time for a stable coach please. No need for drunkards.

 

[Rehan_24]

I agree with this. Although I do like Rohit's ability to lead, going knee-jerk and taking out your best player as captain after a pretty fine tournament would send a horrible message. I am a massive fan of Kohli so this may be biased, but I don't think there is anything particularly wrong with him as captain. It was always going to be difficult following someone like MS. I think he's fine as captain. You can't really blame the captain for middle order failures and a team being 6 for 92. Generally with his field placements etc, he's pretty good. He also inspires massive confidence in players with the way he plays. I think pairing him with a cool mind like Dravid or someone like that would go a long way. I thought Kumble was perfect for this. They should have really tried to make him work with Kumble rather than folding so quickly to his demand of bringing Shastri in. Is VVS interested in coaching at all? He, I feel, would compliment Kohli perfectly. Any player that's been Kohli's senior, and someone with whom he's played would be good as well.

With the kind of persona Virat carries, I don't think so he can afford a much influential coach in the side. I remember the Indian fans said here that Virat wanted a Yes Man for coaching job and there is not a best option available other than Shastri lol..

Personally, I liked Kumble. Dravid looks a very stable and calm personality and he can definitely bring in much positives into the side provided the U19 lot doesn't suffered. I really liked the approach of great players coaching younger generation. They are needed in grass root level more than on the international level but even as a full time coach you evolve and dravid should certainly be considered for this big role down the road.[DOUBLEPOST=1562834348][/DOUBLEPOST]Ps: My team for today is England. I like to see Eng vs Nz final

 

[Bigby Wolf]

Rooting for New Zealand now after India is out but won't mind an England win either considering both have not won a 50 over ICC world cup.

 

[kushagra29]

England on form, Australia on history.

We have seen the yesterdays match

It is not just the limited overs format. You also need to review the test format since this is the time we tend to reset the system. We have created enough chaos in that domain and Rahane's stature as a player is proof of this. It is time to give that responsibility to Che. What this will also do is give Kohli relief and extend his career. Time for a stable coach please. No need for drunkards.

I dont think its right to blame coaching staff or Virat's captaincy for yesterdays loss. The NZ have used the conditions well and played better cricket than India. Don't forget that Ind have pulled some close matches with their skill. If we want to blame someone we need blame rain god bcoz the story would have been different if Ind played the match on the same day.