New Zealand

[CG123]

Discussion for New Zealand's 2011 World Cup campaign.

Squad:

Daniel Vettori (c) - Spin bowling all-rounder
Ross Taylor (vc) - Batsman
Hamish Bennett - Pace bowler
James Franklin - Pace batting all-rounder
Martin Guptill - Batsman
Jamie How - Batsman/part-time wicket-keeper
Brendon McCullum - Wicket-keeper batsman
Nathan McCullum - Spin bowling all-rounder
Kyle Mills - Pace bowler
Jacob Oram - Pace bowling all-rounder
Jesse Ryder - Batsman/part-time pace
Tim Southee - Pace bowler
Scott Styris - Pace batting all-rounder
Kane Williamson - Batsman/part-time spin
Luke Woodcock - Spin bowling all-rounder

 

[aussie1st]

On paper that NZ side still looks good, just need to find some momentum and confidence. Haven't seen Elliott in a while, last time I saw him he was averaging in the 50s and going at a good SR ala Ferguson. Seems to have dropped down a lot since then. I'd probably still pick him but I haven't watched enough of him lately to do it with certainty.

Pace bowler wise I'm guessing Butler or McKay will get the nod.

 

[CG123]

Preliminary Squad:

Brent Arnel, Hamish Bennett, Doug Bracewell, Dean Brownlie, Ian Butler, Grant Elliott, Daniel Flynn, Martin Guptill, Jamie How, James Franklin, Kyle Mills, Adam Milne, Brendon McCullum, Nathan McCullum, Peter McGlashan, Andy McKay, Rob Nicol, Jacob Oram, Jeetan Patel, Jesse Ryder, Tim Southee, Shanan Stewart, Scott Styris, Ross Taylor, Daryl Tuffey, Daniel Vettori, BJ Watling, Kane Williamson, Luke Woodcock, Reece Young



There's only really a handful of players that have their place guaranteed:
Mills, B. McCullum, Ryder, Southee, Styris, Taylor, Vettori

The next group down probably all have a 90% chance of going:
Guptill, Franklin, N. McCullum, Williamson, Oram (if fully fit)

That IMO leaves three spots, one batsman, one back-up keeper, and one pace bowler.

Batsman - Brownlie, Elliott, Flynn, How, Nicol, Stewart
I'd probably pick them purely on form, over the next few domestic OD rounds. Elliott and Nicol add a bit with the ball, so maybe if either of them get into some form, they'll hold the edge.

Back-up Keeper - McGlashan, Young, Watling (I'd include him here)
I'd say one of McGlashan or Watling, because of their superior batting ability. It really depends where Watling's keeping is at, otherwise I'd say McGlashan has the edge.

Pace Bowler - Arnel, Bennett, Bracewell, Butler, Milne, McKay, Tuffey
I'd probably be looking to take someone with a bit of extra pace, therefore Bennett, Milne, or McKay. Considering Milne can't even make CDs OD team, and Bennett/McKay's injury problems, the other three all still have a realistic possibility. (I'd say Bracewell has no chance)

No chance - Patel, Woodcock
I don't see a need for another spinner, as you'd assume both Vettori and N. McCullum will go, along with Williamson. But maybe if they take Watling as batting and keeping cover, that might open up a spot for one of these two.



Elliott's S/R's probably the major concern, along with Williamson. (They're both below 70)

You'd think our top five will be Ryder, B. McCullum, Guptill, Taylor, Styris, therefore that S/R isn't really good enough for someone coming in at six or below.

Moving B. McCullum down to 6/7 is a realistic possibility, but them you have to find someone to fill in the top three, along with Ryder and Guptill.

 

[Chewie]

Elliott is terribly out of form, I wouldn't take him unless he improves considerably in domestic cricket.

I agree with your 12 players, and would suggest the next 3 to be Nicol, McGlashan and McKay (if fit). The selectors would most likely select Butler though

I see McGlashan definitely going though.

And re Milne, he was injured.

 

[sami ullah khan]

Kiwis have always been the dark horses in World Cup tournaments. They have always managed to have a semifinal spot but things could turn out to be very bad for them in 2011 edition of the cup. I think they will find it hard to qualify to 3rd stage.

 

[Howsie]

Elliott is terribly out of form, I wouldn't take him unless he improves considerably in domestic cricket.

Even then I'd still be hesitant to take along to the world cup, his career record in the subcontinent is terrible, 11 matches 169 runs @ 16 striking at under 50, those are some really terrible numbers. Elliott's a decent player of spin but when the pitch is lacking pace he really struggles at the start of his innings and will quite often be striking at well under 50 30+ balls into his innings before gifting his wicket away.

I honestly don't think I'd pick him in my 15 man squad.

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Moving B. McCullum down to 6/7 is a realistic possibility, but them you have to find someone to fill in the top three, along with Ryder and Guptill.

Jesse Ryder moving down the order looks like it might happen, and tbh I'd love to see it. He has a decent record opening the batting so far in his career but he's a much better batsmen imo then that record suggests, opening the batting he throws his wicket away far too often for my liking. There are plenty of batsmen in this country that could open the batting and average 30 while scoring at a decent rate but there aren't many who could possibly average 40+ in the middle order while still scoring just as quickly, Ryder imo could do that.

He's one of the best if not the best player of spin in the country so it would make sense to move him down the order - even if it's only to three, it would probably help Guptill just as much moving up to open also.

 

[2black2good]

Strongest side we could field imo would be

McCullum +
Ryder
Guptill or Williamson
Taylor
Styris
Franklin
Oram
Vettori *
N McCullum
Mills
Southee or Milne

 

[Howsie]

Adam Milne? He hasn't even played one day cricket for Central Districts yet. How do we know if he's able to even keep those types of speeds we saw in the 20/20's up during the course of a 50 over game? Which at this point in time is his only real asset.

 

[CG123]

@ Howsie - Fair enough point on Ryder, and I also agree with you on Milne.

If Oram's fit it looks like we'll only be playing two specialist pace bowlers, so Mills and Southee seem like the obvious options.

We're going to have a large amount of bowling which is good considering our inconsistency, Ryder, Styris, Franklin, Oram, Vettori, N. McCullum, Mills, Southee, only Taylor, Guptill, B. McCullum won't be recognized options.

 

[Chewie]

And both Taylor and Guptill have bowled in ODIs before too

 

[2black2good]

Adam Milne? He hasn't even played one day cricket for Central Districts yet. How do we know if he's able to even keep those types of speeds we saw in the 20/20's up during the course of a 50 over game? Which at this point in time is his only real asset.

Fair point but he looked pretty genuine in the T20, had the Pakistani top order jumping at times and his RPO didn't do his performance justice imo. (Taking into account the flat pitch, short boundaries and the Pakistani batsman getting away with a few lucky boundaries/edges)

 

[Insomniac]

I think NZ might lose to Canada or Kenya and one of those teams might go to the quarter final.

 

[riz7khan12]

I think NZ might lose to Canada or Kenya and one of those teams might go to the quarter final.

lets wait for the 6 match ODI series before we make judgements shall we.

This would be the perfect One-Day squad NZ could possibly take.

1. Brendon McCullum+
2. Jesse Ryder
3. Martin Guptill
4. Ross Taylor
5. Scott Styris
6. James Franklin
7. Jacob Oram
8. Daniel Vettori
9. Nathan McCullum
10. Kyle Mills
11. Tim Southee

12. Daniel Flynn
13. Peter McGlashan
14. Kane Williamson
15. Daryl Tuffey

I'm hoping that flynn gets selected for the one dayers against pak, he is pretty agressive now a days and could work out well if one of the top 3 gets injured. he could probably come in at 6 too.

 

[ferg512]

Oram?? I don't know whether he should just walk straight back in. Although, I suppose the way we have been going we could do with him, but he needs more time in domestic cricket atm.

I wouldn't go with Williamson or Elliott in my XI. Both just aren't up to it in terms of strike rate. I can't really understand why Ryder has opened in limited overs matches for so long, all the 50 over matches he has played for Wellington before being selected he batted at 3 or 4. I'm not sure about changing this until after the World Cup though..

McCullum, Ryder/Guptill, Guptill/Ryder, Taylor, Styris, Franklin, Oram (if fit), Vettori, McCullum, Southee, Mills.

Reserves - McGlashan, Williamson, Bennett, Another bowler (not McKay or Tuffey) but I wouldn't really want Butler or Arnel tbh either, they would all get smashed. Arnel maybe because we haven't seen him get smashed yet

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I would like to see Bracewell, but it is far too early for him. He will be very good in the future though.

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Also, if a player gets injured (which is bound to happen) does the replacement need to come from the 30 man squad?

I would've at least hoped that Bates would have made the 30 man squad. I can't believe they have actually got guys like Tuffey and McKay ahead of him.

 

[CG123]

I'd only select Oram if he's fully fit, maybe that mean not playing him in the first three Pakistan ODIs or something. Of course his batting's not where it used to be, but he's proven himself as one of the top ODI bowlers in the world (in terms of E/R).

I think everyone here's in agreement in terms of our top XI players, it's just the case of our four bench players.