Pakistan vs England Jul-Aug-Sep 2010

Trescothick was rubbish, you are right, where you play clearly matters so much. Strauss was in the runs a lot before England, played at Lord's half the time. I could go on, but it'd be frivolous.

Trescothick obviously is the only bat from Somerset in their short history who has done well for ENG on the national stage. But the BIG difference with Banger is that, he was fast-tracked into the ENG test setup in 2000 by Duncan Fletcher on the back performances in ODI cricket. His FC form was piss poor.

Someone like Cameron White when he came to somerset averaged heavily. But he went back to AUS, he couldn't replicate such high standards for Victoria in AUS FC cricket.
 
Hildreth should be nowehre near the test setup. The fact that he plays on the flattest county pitch in domestic cricket, doesn't help his credentials for a test birth.

What total and utter ignorance. I take it you haven't seen much cricket this year? If it's the flattest pitch in the Country, Phillips and Thomas must be up there with the best bowlers ever to average in the low 20s with the ball and that's without mentioning Kartik.

Try to get up to date before posting nonsense.

MUFC1987 added 1 Minutes and 13 Seconds later...

Trescothick obviously is the only bat from Somerset in their short history who has done well for ENG on the national stage. But the BIG difference with Banger is that, he was fast-tracked into the ENG test setup in 2000 by Duncan Fletcher on the back performances in ODI cricket. His FC form was piss poor.

Tres was picked for England because of his ability in FC cricket actually, initially in the England One Day side. Fletcher could look past a modest average (About mid 30s) to see ability, something which you are incapable of doing.
 
I really like farhats batting when he's on form, he's got a typical left hander elegance to him that butt lacks.

but er yeah, form, aint seen too much of that recently. Manzoor needs to come bacl.
 
What total and utter ignorance. I take it you haven't seen much cricket this year? If it's the flattest pitch in the Country, Phillips and Thomas must be up there with the best bowlers ever to average in the low 20s with the ball and that's without mentioning Kartik.

Try to get up to date before posting nonsense.

So what if Phillips, Thomas & Karthik may be averaging in the low 20s with the ball. Two are county trundlers & Karthik is an Indian reject (although i reckon he would be a good ODI & T20 bowler for them). They averaging so slow is just a refelction on how average county batsmen are, rather than a reflection of how good bowlers they are or the state of the pitch (this is taking your word that their best bowling performances this year have come @ taunton).

If their is any potential proof that Taunton pitch has become a more rounded cricket pitch & is no longer the flattest wicket in the country. I need to hear that from the club groundsman, somerset players, county players who have played there recently, ECB selectors or the skysports commentators Athers, Hussain & co.
 
So basically you're writing off the perfomance of every player at Taunton, batsman, bowler whatever, because you perceive it as being the best batting wicket in the Country? How does that make sense? You can't have it both ways.

And there is proof in the games that have been played there this year, which you are oblivious too. It's not my fault that you have a lack of knowledge, because a selector didn't phone you up and tell you that the pitch isn't as good as before. :sarcasm

MUFC1987 added 1 Minutes and 23 Seconds later...

And on the subject of groundsmen, ask Phil Frost about the pitch. But hey, I guess you have no idea who that is either.
 
Tres was picked for England because of his ability in FC cricket actually, initially in the England One Day side. Fletcher could look past a modest average (About mid 30s) to see ability, something which you are incapable of doing.

No his ODI form in 2000 Natwest series is what catapulted him into the test side. Just like how Morgan was pushed into the test side currently based on his ODI form. Their is no way anyone could have seen Trescothick in FC cricket between 95-2000 & claimed he could looked anything close to test qualiy. Suggesting otherwise, shows a poor knowledge of recent English cricket history.

Plus i certainly no all about seeing players ability despite modest FC form. I was calling for Morgan to be selected in test squad since the SA tour last winter based on his ODI form, while others where still skeptical.

While currently i would suggest Alex Hales will certainly open for England one-day in all forms..
 
No his ODI form in 2000 Natwest series is what catapulted him into the test side. Just like how Morgan was pushed into the test side currently based on his ODI form. Their is no way anyone could have seen Trescothick in FC cricket between 95-2000 & claimed he could looked anything close to test qualiy. Suggesting otherwise, shows a poor knowledge of recent English cricket history.

Plus i certainly no all about seeing players ability despite modest FC form. I was calling for Morgan to be selected in test squad since the SA tour last winter based on his ODI form, while others where still skeptical.

While currently i would suggest Alex Hales will certainly open for England one-day in all forms..
I said that Trescothick was picked for the England ODI side because of his FC performances. Most notably a big century on a tricky pitch. That is an example of Fletcher seeing his quality without being sidetracked by a modest average.

You mean you see players that appear on Sky and do well? I like how you mentioned Morgan who has done well on TV in ODIs and Hales who has done well in One Day cricket which is also shown on TV. How much FC cricket have you seen this year? Because you seem to be making a whole load of opinions on something which you haven't seen and have a very basic knowledge of, yet seem more than happy to write off people, just because of where they play, or who they play against.
 
I really like farhats batting when he's on form, he's got a typical left hander elegance to him that butt lacks.

but er yeah, form, aint seen too much of that recently. Manzoor needs to come bacl.

Yea if they intend to play Butt at #3 then they need to try someone else over Farhat. Hameed is doing well and hopefully for Pakistan cricket he can continue this.
 
So basically you're writing off the perfomance of every player at Taunton, batsman, bowler whatever, because you perceive it as being the best batting wicket in the Country? How does that make sense? You can't have it both ways.

I'm not writing it off. As i said i'm taking Hildreth's performances with a big pitch of salt given he plays @ Taunton which has that tradition . Which is compounded by the fact that standard of bowling in country cricket is poor.

Clearly the ENG selectors see it this way since if they did take Hildreths current county form on face value (given he in the last two seasons he seems to be stepping up). He would have being picked before Morgan in the test side, since he was the man with the FC runs.



And there is proof in the games that have been played there this year, which you are oblivious too. It's not my fault that you have a lack of knowledge, because a selector didn't phone you up and tell you that the pitch isn't as good as before. :sarcasm

Where is this proof then?. I read artciles of every county game every season religiously since you obviously cant see them on TV to keep an eye on upcoming players etc: Results | Global | Cricinfo.com

Although some low scoring games have been present I dont recall anyone saying or suggesting that Taunton reputation a the countries premier batting deck is changing.
MUFC1987 added 1 Minutes and 23 Seconds later...

Plus lame sarcasm overall. The selectors always make comments in the media about the state of pitches & grounds around the country, just as often as they may comment on players & their improvements etc. For eg for the majority of the last 10 years, i remember Headingley losing some of it uniqueness as "greentop", given the amount of roads that where present. But in the last 2 years, it seems to be back to its old self.


And on the subject of groundsmen, ask Phil Frost about the pitch. But hey, I guess you have no idea who that is either.

I dont need to ask if (presuming Mr Frost is indeed Tauntons groundsman), he just needs to make a general statement about the state of pitch to the media if asked.



I said that Trescothick was picked for the England ODI side because of his FC performances. Most notably a big century on a tricky pitch. That is an example of Fletcher seeing his quality without being sidetracked by a modest average.

That hundred (167 IIRC) in that FC got him picked in the ODI side right. It wasn't as if he was dominating in List A cricket, which is normal route into the ODI side.

If Tres had failed/struggled in the ODI series, Fletcher would not have picked him for the 3rd test @ OT 2000. What he did @ Somerset had nothing to do with his eventual success as an international cricket. Like Morgan today, Tres back then just adapted to all international cricket on the spot.


You mean you see players that appear on Sky and do well? I like how you mentioned Morgan who has done well on TV in ODIs and Hales who has done well in One Day cricket which is also shown on TV. How much FC cricket have you seen this year? Because you seem to be making a whole load of opinions on something which you haven't seen and have a very basic knowledge of, yet seem more than happy to write off people, just because of where they play, or who they play against.

Of course it is not possible to see FC cricket on TV here in ENG as it doesn't show on SKY (except end of season championship games that may decide the winner @ the end, which SKY has been doing since 2005 i think).

It is very easy to judge rate players & the standard of our county game by reading up on the match reports, which i do fairly regularly. Just like it easy to know about the hisotry of the game by reading up on past events that you never saw.

My opinon & position of taking performances in ENG first-class cricket with a BIG pinch of salt. Is proven proven by the facts & past failures/struggles of many of our players in the last 20 years who werent able to replicate their domestic form onto the international arena.
 
is it just me or has umpiring been getting worse with LBWs in series the review is in place.

like maybe instead of being more confident in their calls they are just thinking "i'll only give ones that are plum and anything else the team can refer so it's on their heads if they don't get it."

I really fail to see how an umpire could not have given that out, there's little carry in the pitch so it was never going over, pitched in line and straightened. No idea why pakistan didn't refer it either.

There are many implications of UDRS, you just hit one nail on the head with the comment "on their heads". Basically instead of umpires getting slaughtered for errors, the onus is switched to the use of the reviews. Personally I think it is a good idea poorly implimented, the third umpire should look at any decisions that look like mistakes and correct them. The players on the field don't have much more to go on than the umpires, other than they may know they did or didnt' hit it, but a number of referrals are being used on "close" LBWs and I'm sure that wasn't the intended purpose.



As for the match, England have come up against a more determined looking Pakistan who have taken chances and put England under pressure. Not great batting from the top order, put into perspective by Prior and Broad. If only England had preserved 2-3 wickets more at lunch then we'd have been probably still been batting. Pakistan have reinforced the batting line-up so this could be an uphill struggle for England.

England decided to leave things regards Cook and that worked out didn't it! :sarcasm He now has three innings max to "find form" and it would take more than one or two scores in the series to convince me he'll prosper down under. Not only has Cook not made a 50 in the series, he hasn't made 50 in the series TOTAL. That said KP isn't exactly in great form, 117 runs in the series for four times out and another four times or more should have been out. Ironically KP now has more runs than Collingwood in the series who is not under such scrutiny.

England do need to make inroads into Pakistan's batting order tomorrow, not only to salvage this match but to show they can against a side that puts up resistance.
 
So what if Phillips, Thomas & Karthik may be averaging in the low 20s with the ball. Two are county trundlers & Karthik is an Indian reject (although i reckon he would be a good ODI & T20 bowler for them).

Lol @ Kartik being an Indian reject, when he has just been unlucky to be the next best Indian spinner when Kumble and Harbhajan were in the team, and then, when he gets a chance and bowls well against Australia, gets dropped immediately after that, and hasn't got a chance again after that. Probably the best Indian spinner at the moment too.

And, jeez, where do Pakistan keep coming up with these bowlers from? Wahab Riaz looks like a better option than Gul in Test cricket.
 
I give up. Ignorance reigns supreme.

Well when or if Hildreth ever plays for England. We shall see which one our "ignorance will reign supreme".

- If he does a Bopara when he is intially picked. My position here will be proven right.

- If he does well, then you & the others who have taken his recent FC form as a clear indicator of how he will go in tests. Will be proven right.



LongLegs™ said:
Lol @ Kartik being an Indian reject, when he has just been unlucky to be the next best Indian spinner when Kumble and Harbhajan were in the team, and then, when he gets a chance and bowls well against Australia, gets dropped immediately after that, and hasn't got a chance again after that. Probably the best Indian spinner at the moment too.

And, jeez, where do Pakistan keep coming up with these bowlers from? Wahab Riaz looks like a better option than Gul in Test cricket.

I did say right after the poriton of quote that you bodled. That i still believe he would still make a good ODI & T20 bowler for Indian currently.

But whether the selectors in IND are right or wrong he is a reject. Just like how Brad Hodge who is still one of the best batsmen in AUS currently was drop after good performances & not picked back ever since (now retired from FC cricket of course).
 
Last edited by a moderator:
What total and utter ignorance. I take it you haven't seen much cricket this year? If it's the flattest pitch in the Country, Phillips and Thomas must be up there with the best bowlers ever to average in the low 20s with the ball and that's without mentioning Kartik.

Try to get up to date before posting nonsense.

MUFC1987 added 1 Minutes and 13 Seconds later...



Tres was picked for England because of his ability in FC cricket actually, initially in the England One Day side. Fletcher could look past a modest average (About mid 30s) to see ability, something which you are incapable of doing.

This.

Anyway, I think people should be cautious with Wahab, yes he bowled well today, but he also sprayed it about a bit, the resemblence to Johnson was uncanny. He's a match winner, but he won't be a consistent performer like Asif is.

England have to take early and regular wickets tomorrow. A lead for Pakistan in excess of 100 and the game is hard for us to get back in to.
 

Users who are viewing this thread

Top