India in England Jun-Sept 2014

[angad]

Wow....what a comeback from England! Hats off to them!

Great to see Anderson back in form, he is really a treat to watch when bowling like this. But the biggest surprise has been M Ali. He doesnt look like a spinner at all, and yet he is picking wickets after wickets (reminds me of when Monty Panesar came to India and everyone went on about how he is half a spinner and boy did he torment the Indians in that tour!

Coming to India, what a 'spine-less' batting performance really! Broad was out with an injury, Anderson was bowling well but wasnt at his best in the second innings yesterday and yet we lost 9 wickets in one session!!! Simply rubbish! And then to hear Dhoni say in one of the interviews that its good the game got over in 3 days as they will get more rest is just the kind of an attitude that is reflecting in the results. This team will always be just a flat track bully. They are good for 1 or two tests abroad at max and nothing more.

 

[angad]

I agree that Root could be used more. If Plunkett is fit, I'd pick him

I say get Finn back! He has always troubled the Indians and its a very good opportunity to get him back in form.

 

[angad]

The only reason Jadeja plays ahead of Ashwin is that he is the better batsman, and so even if the pitches dont help spin he can atleast contribute with the bat.

Not too sure about that!!! Jadeja is 'pathetic' with the bat in test matches. Ashwin is a much much better batsman who has even score a couple of centuries in test matches.

Jadeja could have had a bigger impact in this series had Dhoni not made him bowl that negative line down the leg side.

 

[grkrama]

This is so frustrating to see him show absolutely no traces of pain (even the way he says "This will hurt us" is so massively unconvincing; almost as if he was forced to say it). He seems to think the Indian fan goes even down when players show emotion during defeat. But for defeats like this, we want the captain to show some emotion and pain and tell us that he feels it. We know that anyone would not want to live with pain and will do something to make it go away. But I want to see it in him. Right now with the kind of attitude, there is absolutely no hope that the Indian fan can keep with their team. We essentially are left to wait in the dark for that rare wins (e.g. Lord's) with no assurance from the captain that they are really serious enough to ensure that these dark days do not happen often again.
Just for his attitude, I want him gone. Dravid was much different from his. Dravid the captain was also mostly diplomatic, but most often we used to see him express well during tough times (took Dravid's example here because Dravid is a similar personality to the current Dhoni; quiet, cool, etc).

just read this article you will know were his attitude comes from and he has always made a mockery of press confs so nothing new, remember that life jacket warranty analogy, state of mind for lack of practice etc, i think he is planning to become a satirist after retiring.

Seriously the guy is detached of everything by the look of things in the article apart from his bikes and guns.

Cover story | The star we don't know | The Cricket Monthly | ESPN Cricinfo
the sign in to read is worth it.

 

[Satan666]

Dropping MSD from the test team can only cause more harm than good. Kohli taking up the test captaincy at this time is way too much of a burden for him, needs some more experience also. Gambhir is hardly making the final eleven. So that leaves Dhawan. Really?

 

[whiteninness]

Hey I have a question to everyone who has been to The Oval before. Do they open the gates for free entrance late in the afternoon? Some grounds, with say an hour to go, stop checking tickets and open the gates. Just curious if that's the case here.

 

[grkrama]

Dropping MSD from the test team can only cause more harm than good. Kohli taking up the test captaincy at this time is way too much of a burden for him, needs some more experience also. Gambhir is hardly making the final eleven. So that leaves Dhawan. Really?

exactly what i have been saying dropping MSD wont do any good, he has been decent this tour in all departments even selections except for 3rd test, were he normally botches up.Right now kohli is in no state to take captaincy of now.

This tour we have been let down by batting in second half nothing much a captain can do, he has scored 3 fifties for his part, would have love a bit more of the first innings style play from MSD but he has done his part as good as he can, i cant see anyone stepping in and revolutionizing here by thinking of feet.

would sure love mSD to make a few more tactical changes or gambles with batting order but thats it.

 

[aditya123]

Well give it time, Ist tour for Pujara, Kohli, Rahane. We have a good bowling unit starting after a long while. Some positives for sure. Soon who knows, the trend may change. Since the Bridgetown debacle we have won in WI twice I think.

I never said that dropping Dhoni was the answer. He may stay as the wicketkeeper but he has to step down as the captain. Even saying things like the game getting over in 3 days is good is deplorable. Not once has the batting order been changed in this series or for that matter ever before. It is`nt rocket science to know that Kohli is not confident and Rahane has had a good time with the bat off late but not even once did we try shuffling the order. Ashwin is a far better batsman than Jadeja. Its totally illogical to suggest that Jadeja is in the side ahead of Ashwin due to his batting. The only area where he makes a case is his fielding and even there his drop of Cook was what turned the series on its head. Gambhir in the squad itself was an illogical decision. He was miserable in the Ranji Trophy along with Sehwag. He was even outshone by Sehwag in the IPL. Vijay Zol, Kedar Jadhav and K.L Raul must be in the test squad ahead of Nohit and Gambhir.

Gambhir, Binny and Pankaj are all selections that baffle me. I can at least think of 3 names who should be ahead of them in the squad. Non-India fans might think we are overreacting and the series is only 2-1 at the moment. The anger and frustration stems from the fact that we have let England get away with shoddy cricket. We showed discipline at Lords on that green mamba on Day 1 and that is why we won. Since then letting Moeen get so many wickets to go with loads of dropped catches is not a shadow of that effort at Lords. Even the performances in SA were actually really good. We bossed the SA side on that helpful Jo`burg track and did well in Durban to stay in the game for 4 out of 5 days. The team actually could`ve come out of the SA series with a win. In NZ, we showed a lot of character in the first test at Auckland where we were so behind and yet in the second innings bowled NZ out for a 100-odd and then almost chased down 400+. We let the game in Wellington slip when we should`ve finished it in 4 days. Yet, the team was progressing all that while up until Lords where we felt they had turned a corner.

Since then has been the most baffling and abject surrender by our side which is inexplicable and not much to do with lack of talent. The application has been poor. Selection has been timid. We were so aggressive to pursue that Anderson Jadeja case off the field. Had we applied ourselves even a fraction of that on it, we would`ve still been in the series. Even if we draw the series at the Oval, this has been a real step backwards.

Yes, things do change dramatically in test cricket. Australia, exactly a year ago had those two shambolic games at Lords and Durham where their batting collapsed inexplicable, just like ours here. They lost the series by a 3-0 margin far worse that the margin in this series at this point. Yet, they turned it around in 3 months time with aggressive selections and the right mindset. For the attitude to change, the change has to come from the top and that is why Dhoni must step down. People might say, where is our Johnson? We don`t need a like for like choice. Yadav, Aaron, Shami, Ishant and Bhuvi can form a lethal battery if they are backed up well by a pro active captain and a good slip cordon. We`ve got no choice but to play 5 bowlers at the Oval and I would go for 4 pacers and Ashwin. Rather lose 3-1 trying to make it 2-2 than play conservatively. Dhawan should be back. At least he seems to have some attacking flair which Gambhir absolutely lack at this moment. Also, he gives us our onl

My lineup for the Oval

Dhawan
Vijay
Rahane
Pujara
Kohli
Dhoni
Ashwin
Bhuvi
Shami
Aaron
Ishant

 

[AbhishekVAshok]

grey i know you are here somewere please reply friend to my VM

 

[richowebbo]

I say get Finn back! He has always troubled the Indians and its a very good opportunity to get him back in form.

I would prefer Plunkett, a) Because he plays for Yorkshire and b) well I don't really have a 'b', its just a bias thing I guess!

 

[richowebbo]

Yeah with the World Cup months away, Dhoni is going nowhere, and that is the end of that. Although another thrashing on the tour to Aus won't help his cause, but before the WC nothing is happening. If India perform poorly in the World Cup, then perhaps the question may be asked much more sternly. As a captain though there is nothing worth winning, that Dhoni has played in as Captain and not won. He has been the captain of India when India were #1, which was a good three years after Dhoni took over, so its not as if Dhoni just inherited a #1 team, without having to win anything himself. Dhoni has won the World Cup, CT, World T20, IPL and Champions League. That is about as complete a career as one can have as a captain. With the World Cup just months away Dhoni is not going anywhere.

By understudy I maen Ballance will be a good foundation for everything. A bit like Dravid. Every major knock by a cricketer needs someone to stay with him at other end, only then are great knocks achieved. No one scores a double hundred with wickets falling regulary. Dravid was that partner for India for almost every major innings an Indian played. VVS Laxman score 281, Dravid at the other end. Sehwag Score 254 Dravid at the other end. It was just mental how many great knocks Dravid helped anchor being the understudy n.o at the other end. 4 of the top 5 scores by an Indian came with Dravid at the other end. During his career, 35.6 % of the total runs India scored, were scored with Dravid as one of two batting in the middle.

Ballance could play that role for England.

AH I understand. I would use the words 'the perfect foil for Root'? Not sure if that is what I mean actually! Sunday morning's aren't my strong point!

But I get your point and agree. Lots of people have been comparing Ballance to Dravid, which is nice for him, and for us fans! I think DRavid likes Ballance as well.

Someone who I like a lot and I think should be groomed as Ian Bell's successor is James Taylor. He is a very handy player. Eventually I'd like the top 6 to be Cook (as we have discussed, he's going nowhere), Hales, Ballance, Root, Taylor, Moeen

 

[whiteninness]

Another ticket selling attempt, any takers: Bought for 52 Pounds but would sell for 45. 100% legit tickets and everything (can show the receipt, deliver them in person at the ground). PM if keen

 

[Satan666]

I never said that dropping Dhoni was the answer. He may stay as the wicketkeeper but he has to step down as the captain. Even saying things like the game getting over in 3 days is good is deplorable. Not once has the batting order been changed in this series or for that matter ever before. It is`nt rocket science to know that Kohli is not confident and Rahane has had a good time with the bat off late but not even once did we try shuffling the order. Ashwin is a far better batsman than Jadeja. Its totally illogical to suggest that Jadeja is in the side ahead of Ashwin due to his batting. The only area where he makes a case is his fielding and even there his drop of Cook was what turned the series on its head. Gambhir in the squad itself was an illogical decision. He was miserable in the Ranji Trophy along with Sehwag. He was even outshone by Sehwag in the IPL. Vijay Zol, Kedar Jadhav and K.L Raul must be in the test squad ahead of Nohit and Gambhir.

Gambhir, Binny and Pankaj are all selections that baffle me. I can at least think of 3 names who should be ahead of them in the squad. Non-India fans might think we are overreacting and the series is only 2-1 at the moment. The anger and frustration stems from the fact that we have let England get away with shoddy cricket. We showed discipline at Lords on that green mamba on Day 1 and that is why we won. Since then letting Moeen get so many wickets to go with loads of dropped catches is not a shadow of that effort at Lords. Even the performances in SA were actually really good. We bossed the SA side on that helpful Jo`burg track and did well in Durban to stay in the game for 4 out of 5 days. The team actually could`ve come out of the SA series with a win. In NZ, we showed a lot of character in the first test at Auckland where we were so behind and yet in the second innings bowled NZ out for a 100-odd and then almost chased down 400+. We let the game in Wellington slip when we should`ve finished it in 4 days. Yet, the team was progressing all that while up until Lords where we felt they had turned a corner.

Since then has been the most baffling and abject surrender by our side which is inexplicable and not much to do with lack of talent. The application has been poor. Selection has been timid. We were so aggressive to pursue that Anderson Jadeja case off the field. Had we applied ourselves even a fraction of that on it, we would`ve still been in the series. Even if we draw the series at the Oval, this has been a real step backwards.

Yes, things do change dramatically in test cricket. Australia, exactly a year ago had those two shambolic games at Lords and Durham where their batting collapsed inexplicable, just like ours here. They lost the series by a 3-0 margin far worse that the margin in this series at this point. Yet, they turned it around in 3 months time with aggressive selections and the right mindset. For the attitude to change, the change has to come from the top and that is why Dhoni must step down. People might say, where is our Johnson? We don`t need a like for like choice. Yadav, Aaron, Shami, Ishant and Bhuvi can form a lethal battery if they are backed up well by a pro active captain and a good slip cordon. We`ve got no choice but to play 5 bowlers at the Oval and I would go for 4 pacers and Ashwin. Rather lose 3-1 trying to make it 2-2 than play conservatively. Dhawan should be back. At least he seems to have some attacking flair which Gambhir absolutely lack at this moment. Also, he gives us our onl

My lineup for the Oval

Dhawan
Vijay
Rahane
Pujara
Kohli
Dhoni
Ashwin
Bhuvi
Shami
Aaron
Ishant

Care to tell us who should captain this team? You did mention Dhoni's captaincy should be stripped.

 

[aditya123]

Care to tell us who should captain this team? You did mention Dhoni's captaincy should be stripped.

Thrust it on Ashwin or Pujara. Its a risk yes, but the team needs some shaking up.

 

[PokerAce]

Say what? Manoj Tiwary and Ambati Rayudu have never played a single test match yet. And Manoj Tiwary has always been the perennial "in and out" man of India's ODI team. Never ever allowed to settle down consistently for a few games in a row. He has a ODI century vs West Indies, and an average of 31.62 in 9 matches (will say it again, 9 matches). Rayudu also has been similarly used very sporadically (used whenever the seniors want rest from series like the ones vs Zimbabwe, Bangladesh, etc). And in his given chances, he averages 32.62 in 13 matches.

Both are technically better players than Rohit Sharma and deserve a steady run in either ODI or test for India. I would atleast draft in Tiwary for Rohit and tell him that he is going to be with the test side for atleast 5 test matches (typically a series or more). Tiwary is cut out for test cricket.

Yeah thats what I mean ... in ODIs there is a fair sample to judge them on. They don't cut it, simple as that. Saying Tiwary has been in and out is misleading. Why has he been in and out, cos when given the chance he didn't grab them. If he was performing he would not be in and out all the time. 31.62 S/R 76 is not great to begin with anyway. Also while he has a 100 and a fifty, but apaprt from that he dosn't have a single score over 25. The 100 was n.o so that is pushing up the avg ,not that 31 is a great avg anyway, but its getting a huge boost from the one flash in a pan innings. How is it a flash in the pan, cos when you fail to score more then 25 in 78% of the innings u have played, a 100 is more an aberration than the norm. That avg of 31 is misleading when you cannot score more than 25 in 78% of the knocks you play.

Similarly Raydu, has been given opportunities. On the last tour to B'Desh he had scores of 16, 1 and 1, batting at no. 4 as one of the mainstays. You really want this guy to play test cricket? His avg again pushed up by 63 n.o he got against the might of the Zimbabwe team, and a S/R of 66 in ODIs, is not exactly cutting it for the top level.

Also the thing is I hate Rohit as much as the next guy, but one thing that cannot be called into question about Rohit is his technique and potential talent. That is the only reason he has such a long rope to begin with. That he has failed to live up to expectations is another issue.

Also to highlight, Raydu avg a mere 32 having played bulk of his matches against the two weakest teams there are, and again apart from 4 matches, 9 of his matches have been against Afghanistan, B'Desh and Zim !! To then have an avg 0f 32 is not good enough.[DOUBLEPOST=1407671257][/DOUBLEPOST]

Not too sure about that!!! Jadeja is 'pathetic' with the bat in test matches. Ashwin is a much much better batsman who has even score a couple of centuries in test matches.

Jadeja could have had a bigger impact in this series had Dhoni not made him bowl that negative line down the leg side.

Yeah fairly sure about that. Ashwin was the regular till, SA where the tail collapsed in the 2nd test leading to SA win. Post that the logic has been that if our spinners won't find help from the surface then may as well play Jadeja over Ashwin who could bat better.