New Zealand in England May - June 2013

[used2bcool]

Not sure it has to do with the English suddenly becoming bad - sure, KP's not there but that's not a huge dip of talent for this English team. You've still got Cook, Prior, Bell, Anderson, etc. It's more to do with intent - New Zealand have shown a mind to attack, both with bat and ball, and England haven't responded.

They're not short on talent. Just need a mental recalibration.

 

[sifter132]

Not sure if we should be so critical of England's batting line-up without KP.
I'll not be afraid to say that the New-Zealander's bowled pretty well, and Brits defensive approach didn't help them either.
If one player who could come to the rescue now, it would be Bell, let him get his approach right, I'd say England's right back at them!!

Thank god someone's at least willing to give the Kiwis some credit...I think NZ are a big show here. England and their fans seem preoccupied with themselves or maybe they are looking ahead to the Ashes. No one is talking about NZ and their pace attack is much better than the average punter thinks. So great work from Southee and Boult, these are 2 talented young guys. As long as the Kiwi batsmen don't fold like a deck of cards this will be a good series.

 

[barmyarmy]

NZ have played well and they're due credit but the mindset of the batters has been the critical thing for me.
England look so scared of getting out they're not playing shots, manoeuvring the field etc whereas NZ have looked far more confident.

The main Ashes point for me is how can we possibly be favourites when we're batting so dismally. I would say that our batting travails date back to the Pakistan tour last year; several players just seem to have lost all their ability to play freely and score runs.

 

[ferg512]

Thank god someone's at least willing to give the Kiwis some credit...I think NZ are a big show here. England and their fans seem preoccupied with themselves or maybe they are looking ahead to the Ashes. No one is talking about NZ and their pace attack is much better than the average punter thinks. So great work from Southee and Boult, these are 2 talented young guys. As long as the Kiwi batsmen don't fold like a deck of cards this will be a good series.

Exactly, its been extremely frustrating listening to the radio commentary especially with Boycott and Vaughan all they talk about is England how good or bad they are doing. Our attack is not special but its very disciplined and I'm not afraid to say its legitimately in the top 4. The beauty about them all is they pitch the ball up, just look at this game Anderson pitches it up thats why he takes wickets, Broad and Finn don't and I'd be worried that as an England fan. Where is Onions? He would be lethal in these condtions.

McCullums innings will be the difference here I feel, if he gets out cheaply I can see England getting a decent lead.

 

[barmyarmy]

Finn plays all his domestic cricket at Lord's. There's no excuse for him not knowing the length to bowl. Over the last two years English bowlers have consistently bowled too short.

 

[ste_mc_efc]

Finn plays all his domestic cricket at Lord's. There's no excuse for him not knowing the length to bowl. Over the last two years English bowlers have consistently bowled too short.

He has probably been told how he should bowl, if it was entirely up to him maybe it'd be a different length, but it isn't.

 

[CG123]

Exactly, its been extremely frustrating listening to the radio commentary especially with Boycott and Vaughan all they talk about is England how good or bad they are doing.

Waddle should just pull an all dayer in the com box, like he does when we tour like India etc. (and don't share commentators with them).

 

[Owzat]

Finn plays all his domestic cricket at Lord's. There's no excuse for him not knowing the length to bowl. Over the last two years English bowlers have consistently bowled too short.

What made Broad a liability, he seemed to have wised up for a bit and hit some really good form. Unfortunately his batting ability is almost non-existent at times, and his dismissal made me think of Collingwood at his worst.

In his last five series including this one innings he has scored 177 runs @ 12.64. In the same period he's taken 36 wickets @ 35.97, 22 @ 45.05 if you take out his 14 against windies at 21.71. Is 12.64 with bat, 35.97 with ball justification to include him? It's the Giles scenario over again, in as much for the batting potential and a reason with his bowling (hoping Broad can find form, Giles being an SLA who can keep it tight)

With a four man attack you need the four to be taking wickets, that so you can have the extra batting. Finn had an ordinary reverse series, 10 wickets of which six came in one innings. I'm all for consistency of selection, but not when a supposedly "proven" performer like Broad isnt firing and you only have four bowlers, doesn't leave scope for others not to fire.



Still it's an interesting Test for a change, scoring not easy and enough help for the bowlers that noone is quite ever out of it. This is more or less what cricket is about, or at least should be. Wickets, runs, tactical decisions of how to approach batting and bowl, not easy to run away with it and so on.

Credit to the kiwis for their bowling, and to a degree their batting, although thus far that's Taylor and Williamson. Still their run rate is +1 on our's.......... . Our scorecard makes ugly reading, five of the top six got to 31 and noone added more than 10 runs to that. England hit 21 fours, Taylor alone hit 13 and the kiwis already on 23.

 

[Owzat]

Could be in for a cracking finish to this, England doing what the kiwis did and clawing it back from a solid looking position. England were 192/4, lost their last six wickets for 40 runs. The kiwis were nicely placed at 155/4 and have lost four wickets for 40 runs.

The margin may be pretty small, probably in favour of England. I hope the kiwis don't lose heart if they don't get a lead, they will probably want to get another 20 runs at least though, on a low scorer as this seems to be they won't want to give away too much of a lead when they have to bat last.

Is this not way more interesting than 450+ plays 300+ etc ? Good bowling getting rewarded, batsmen able to score runs although 66 is the current HS. Would be disappointing for the kiwis if they don't reach or pass 232 when Taylor and Williamson scored 125 between them.

And where is everyone?

 

[cricket_icon]

very good bowling from both sides and I always love it when Finn is amongst the wickets, I hope he gets a shot this summer in the Ashes. I'd love it if he did.

Anderson as usual was the man with the swing...now it really is game on. Can England get a good enough lead and how will the Kiwi bowlers respond??

 

[vaibhavtewatia]

Disappointed indeed, cause Kiwis managed very in the last session, rather Brownlie supported Williamson very well, so that McCullum doesn't have to play a lot of the last few overs.

Game on, a very important day for both teams, with England clearly having the edge, with players like Cook,Prior,Trott,& if Bell could belt a few, it will be very difficult for the Black Caps. Still looking forward to their bowling though.

 

[StinkyBoHoon]

And where is everyone?

I was at the gym.

but er yes, before I went I was going to post that you were all being a bit overly pessimistic about this match as NZ would struggle to reach englands score and they did.

however, would agree with some of the criticism. I think england's batting does look a bit uninspiring, I think a bit of this is due to have a settled 5 places and then just rotating other players hoping one of them cements his place with a barn storming 100. If you think back to india during the dravid/tendulkar/laxman years they did the same thing, just tossing the no.6 spot to whoever was flavour of the month. Didn't help anyone in the long run as no one really stuck, it was only when dravid and laxman did retire they were forced to back some young players, who then felt they were going to be given a fair chance, did they find new players begin looking like viable replacements.

It's maybe impossible right now but bairstow and root know one of them is going to be dropped at the end of this series, it's just too much pressure. They also no 2-3 bad tests after that will see either the other one get a shot or someone else entirely come in.

The bowling is easier to sort out, I think bresnan should be a starting player for england except in the sub-continent. he offers something different. Finn is just another tall man that bangs it in at fast medium pace, exactly like broad. Two reasons this is bad, Broad was quite a poor bowler for a long time and I'm not sure playing him all this time was worth it. Anyway, he's not so good you'd ever be going "god, wish we had two broads.".

The other thing, which may reveal itself more definitely in the next innings, is if swann has lost anything due to his surgery. He doesn't just bring a good spin dimension to england, he brings a force of personality to their bowling. If his ability is diminished then, not only will he just fail to get people out as a spinner obviously, england will have lost a talismanic presence in their attack. I'd say you want to see swann play a big part in this series before it's over or the ashes is not looking quite as easy as it was at the start of the summer.

 

[swacker]

What's the story with Bell? Shaping up to be a low scoring thriller.

Dare I say it's an opportunity for Root coming in so early in the Innings?

 

[Owzat]

It's maybe impossible right now but bairstow and root know one of them is going to be dropped at the end of this series, it's just too much pressure. They also no 2-3 bad tests after that will see either the other one get a shot or someone else entirely come in.

There are two spots, but neither Root could conceivably open I guess. I know where you're coming from though, and ding dong just seems to be a fixture when his form isn't all that and he does enough every now and again to cement his place for another 3-4 Ashes series

Two reasons this is bad, Broad was quite a poor bowler for a long time and I'm not sure playing him all this time was worth it. Anyway, he's not so good you'd ever be going "god, wish we had two broads.".

As I said earlier, Broad is another Giles, the selectors see him as giving balance by being able to bat and bowl. The problem is his continued selection is never going to give him a chance to find any form, and as you say he's not "so good......." anyway.

Broad (Tests)

Series 01-05 : 26 wkts @ 45.23 (SR 83.38, ER 3.25, BB 3/34)
Series 06-10 : 57 wkts @ 32.02 (SR 60.05, SR 3.20, BB 6/91)
Series 11-15 : 62 wkts @ 24.03 (SR 55.23, ER 2.61, BB 6/46)
Series 16-20 : 38 wkts @ 35.55 (SR 64.39, ER 3.31, BB 7/72)

Nothing special, one purple patch which included three series where he averaged 23.36 against Pakistan at home, 13.84 against India at home and 20.46 against Pakistan in UAE.

His figures overall are pretty ordinary, for part of a four man attack he doesn't fire often enough and his batting is down to a 24.63 average with only three fifties since his 169 against Pakistan 24 Tests ago. I'd send him back to his county for at least this series, if he hits top form then bring him back for (or during) the Ashes.

For a four man attack to work we can't be carrying someone who in three of the previous four series he took wickets, half of them came in one innings : 6/51 in 11 wickets against New Zealand, 5/69 in 11 wickets against South Africa and 7/72 in 14 wickets against West Indies - interestingly the only Test of the three we won was against West Indies.

The other reason to give Broad back to his county is so another bowler (or two) can be tried out, if Broad is truly our first choice and gets injured, who comes in? Bresnan probably, he himself I think is coming back from injury. And isn't Broad playing all formats for England? Surely another reason to give him breaks.

 

[MUFC1987]

I just find it so frustrating watching Broad. When he's pitching it up he looks really good, yet he always has to throw in those short balls, which relieves the pressure and takes his economy rate up. I think he has the ability, it's just mentally he's not disciplined enough, he feels he has to 'rough the batsman up' which he just isn't quick enough to get away with as often as he tries.